The French - is it personal?

maw have you never read what Johnson has written/said about the French?

I would not welcome him to my house under any circumstances if he had been as rude to me.

I think it's the British that have a chip on their shoulder about the French. All those centuries of hostility and war have left their mark.

I think a lot of it is routed in history, William the Conqueror came over and laid claim to England, Frenchified us quite a bit, sure even then their French was easier on the ear than Anglo Saxon. The Plantagenets stayed pretty French for quite a while, for example, I believe Richard I didn't speak English. With subsequent marriages to French women, Henry 11 to Eleanor of Aquitaine, we acquired large portions of France.......and then at some point in time the French wanted their bits back, by which time I imagine the Plantagenets had become more English than French .........or something like that. Anyway we always seemed to be at war with them for one thing or another. Nevertheless, England was a refuge for many French fleeing successive blood baths over the water, Huguenots, refugees from the French Revolution etc. even old mouthy General "non" de Gaulle parked himself here during the war. It's a love hate relationship I perceive. I love lots of them, have extended family over in France, I even married one......ex husband!.........he was prone to tell me I had English ankles.......known today as cankles I believe. I did like to correct him on that point "the ankles" I would tell him frequently "are only half English, so go and ooh la la that"

Anyway to quote Julie Burchill, the French think the English can't knock up a good sauce, apart from custard, or creme Anglaise, but as she rightly points out they haven't produced any good singers. Every time I went to France I'd pick up a Paris Match and there he'd be the late Johnny Hallyday........yeah! sad!

Just trying to find the reference that states Germany is building up massive armaments - whereas UK has ... zilch! Even selling off steelworks in Scunthorpe to Turkey for Army pension pot. Turkish Army trained by US, btw. Turkish Army apparently best in world now.

Q: Why are the roads and avenues in France lined with trees?

A: So that the Germans can march in the shade.

Ta dah!

"In May 1967, de Gaulle argued that Britain’s entry would only be possible when ‘this great people, so magnificently gifted with ability and courage, should be on their own behalf and for themselves achieve a profound economic and political transformation, which would allow them to join the Six Continentals’. Just one of the many reasons de Gaulle veto-ed GB (not UK) entry to the EEC. Ref: ukandeu.ac.uk website

Nobody likes the British , they only like what they can get from us . England has always been the one giving and the rest of the world taking . I lived in spain for 15 years , I wasn't entitled to dole money and if I didn't pay tax i couldn't use the health system . I'm afraid England is is own worst enemy .

Something my Grandmother used to say comes to mind. She said that the Germans could never beat us in a fair fight & that the French could not win a fight without us.
Sometimes wonder what she would say to all this Brexit nonsense?

(When it comes to being asked for reasons why I voted leave, this sort of thing is a perfect example of why. Being goaded by a pompous little French person and told what to do.

I have to admire your courage for coming on here and saying this Alima! So we're going through this awful time of anger, hatred and deep division in the UK, facing severe economic damage and losing international respect, because some people don't like pompous little French people

I really thought people would have grown up a bit by now. I have voted Remain twice in my lifetime; the first time I was particularly influenced by the desire to put historic animosities behind us and work together with other European nations for a peaceful and secure future. But it seems that many of our UK citizens still judge intranational relationships at a playground level. It's very sad.

De Gaulle, hated Britain, he never wanted us to join the Common Market. He held it against us because of the war.
I too thought Macron could have conversed in French but then again Merkel conversed in German.
The French people still honour our war dead, the cemeteries etc.
I say just get on with it.
Triciax

I can’t believe that Macron is criticised for speaking French!!! Why shouldn’t Macron speak French in France fgs! Did Johnson speak French / German?
Maybe it’s the Brits who have a chip on their shoulder re France- after all they have better food, drink, roads weather, lovers.

I can just revert to history...

we did NOT vote for a political union, we , ie the British back in the 70`s or whenever, we voted for trade,, that is what we were asked that is what I voted for,,,, I did NOT vote for any EU political stuff.

No Growstuff , not falling for anything press-related. I have often felt that our much vaunted “friendship” with France is one-sided and that despite our 20th century wars with Germany, we and they are much closer in many respects.
I think Macron is on a fairly shaky footing within his own country - look at the gilets jaunes - and frankly doesn’t give a toss about the UK. Merkel is, I think, more aware of the bigger picture.

Yes Boris speaks fluent French & yes the French don't like us.
I speak reasonable French but have been ignored or told they cannot understand me in shops in Paris many times. Or maybe it is just the Parisiens?
I get the impression that a lot of French people wish they were getting out of EU too!

I despair of the British not the French. I am in France for a short holiday, nothing but courtesy and incredulity about Brexit. Immaculate sand on a long sea beach, clean lakes, virtually no rubbish, yes I know this is not universally true in France and all these generalisations about “France” or “Germany” are so unhelpful and simplistic. The EU is complex structure but it offers us membership and allegiance in a troubled global world. I am horrified that we are isolating ourselves or about to throw our lot in with Trump for protection in difficulty and subject to his whims. Make dealing with Macron look easy!

Of course the French don't have a chip on their shoulder as regards the UK. They can't possibly because they are brought up believing that they are the best nation in the world.

Given our shared history going back 1000 years and our proximity to each other I'm constantly surprised at how different they are to us in many ways.

Right now they are bemused at what is happening in England. They feel sorry for us and are sympathetic towards the English residents here and the problems we are likely to experience if/when Brexit happens.

There has always been a love hate relationship with the French they are even more nationalistic than we are, at the moment they think the national interest is in the E.U.

I don’t think the E.U. are going to move much on the deal, what I am hoping for is just enough face saving changes that will allow parliament to vote yes - but I’m not holding my breath.

I think Boris speaks French?

I got the impression Macron was being unhelpful as he spoke in French when he is fluent in English.

I think it all goes back to the days of de Gaulle. We used to camp every year in Europe and would enter France at Boulogne. One year we were stopped at the first junction by the gendarmes and fined for not stopping at a stop sign even though we had stopped. They were waiting for the Brits from the boat.

The next year we entered France and were given a gift of Camembert, wine and other goodies. It all depended on how de Gaulle felt that particular year.
The French are quite fickle.

I rather like Angela Merkel and rather naively maybe but I
hope BJ can come up with something to ease Brexit.

If nothing else maybe we can all then get on together again and stop all this infighting.

How did Macron goad Johnson?

I disagree with you absolutely and totally, Alima. Merkel is just about the most states(wo)manlike person on the current world stage.

MawB, I think you're falling for the UK press' take on this. The EU isn't on the verge of collapse and the threat that France would vote to leave the EU is very small. Macron is unpopular for reasons totally unconnected with being part of the EU.

MawB, I think you're falling for the UK press' take on this. The EU isn't on the verge of collapse and the threat that France would vote to leave the EU is very small. Macron is unpopular for reasons totally unconnected with being part of the EU.

I expect she felt free to make the offer knowing there isn't enough time to do anything.