33 days to go .... What’s the Brexit plan?

It also means he (Corbyn) won't be in the HoC on one of the most crucial days to opposed Brexit

Can you explain this one away, Grandad?

I'm not trying to be snippy, I usually have great respect for your posts, but this is really dreadful...

Precisely, Grandad, as your post of 09.57 explains;

manoeuvrings and machinations.

Blimey the guy is a waste of space. Can't Starmer take over? Much more credible.

I very much hope I am wrong

Sir Malcontent ?? ?? For Parliament
@johnleremainer
·
Oct 12
Corbyn is apparently holding a rally in Liverpool on the 19th.
Not only will he not be present on the People's Vote march he will be forcing Labour members to choose between him and Remain.
It also means he won't be in the HoC on one of the most crucial days to opposed Brexit

Oh yes grandad I’ll find it and post it.

He is apparently attending a rally in Liverpool.

Whitewavemark2 Quote [ I am reading that Corbyn is not attending parliament next Saturday.!!] End Quote.

Could you please post the links to the above Whitewavemark2 as I would be very interested to read such, as having carried out a search I cannot find any reference.

With thanks

MaizieD, in regard to your post @09:31 today, the Labour Deligate Conference faced many motions on Brexit put forward from Labour District and Constituency Parties, alongside motions and resolutions put forward by trade union branches, district, Regional and the National Executives of those bodies.

All were considered by the conference standing orders committee and that finaly brought forward two opposing composite motions that all who had put forward motions and resolutions agreed on.

Both motions were then debated and voted on by conference and one was then then passed into Labour Party/Movement policy. All are then under obligation to support that policy, and that is democracy in action.

If there are Labour MPs who feel that they cannot support the above action, then they should resign their Palimentery seats and their membership of the Party.

It would seem that desire for a confirmatory referendum is growing amongst the parliamentary MPs.

I am reading that Corbyn is not attending parliament next Saturday.!!???

Next Saturday should be the crunch time.

They are alarmed at Johnson’s move to a very hard brexit and the appalling damage it will do to jobs and welfare services as well as the NHS.

However, once more we witness some in the Parliamentary Labour Party undermining and placing themselves above the decision and desire of the whole Labour movement.

It isn't the decision and desire of the whole labour movement as well you know, Grandad. It was the result of machinations and manoeuvreings at Conference where the leadership was faced with motions from the membership which directly contradicted their desired strategy of Corbyn getting a crack at renegotiating Brexit... A Brexit that he wants despite the wishes of the majority of Labour members and voters.

The Labour Movement Annual Delegate Conference once again fully endorsed the policy of "General Election first then a second referendum" and that was democracy speaking

Those MPs that now speak out against that decision, put themselves above those party members and affiliate members and above the party democracy that placed them in their positions.

Without doubt, if all got behind the Delegate Conference policy, that policy would gain support in the electorate's view and the Labour Party would then win the forthcoming General Election.

However, once more we witness some in the Parliamentary Labour Party undermining and placing themselves above the decision and desire of the whole Labour movement.

And then they wonder why they get deselected.

I can’t understand this excitement over the Johnson proposal which looks pretty much the same as Mays much derided one. NI get privileges which the rest of the UK can’t enjoy-+seems unfair.

I didn't hear anything that inferred that the Labour party didn't want a general election growstuff. What was it that gave you that impression?

Urmstongran Johnson is not delivering a satisfactory solution to the people of Gibraltar nor to the EU citizens in the UK or UK citizens in the EU. Ireland was/is a sticking point, but not the only one.

If Northern Ireland will be allowed to stay in the EU customs union "de facto", why can't Scotland? While we're at it, how about London staying too?

Meanwhile, while there's a march in London and an important sitting of the HoC on 19 October, Corbyn will be in Liverpool.

I'll read it more carefully, but my understanding is that Starmer wants a referendum and not a GE.

Labour seem to be in denial about a GE because they won't win. Johnson is immoral, incompetent, dishonest and corrupt, but still twice as popular as Corbyn in polls.

Corbyn dodges serious issues and will be as complicit as the Tories in enabling Brexit, despite the face that at least 70% of Labour voters are against Brexit. Despite the virtual signalling, he's no democrat.

Apparently, Corbyn has said he'll resign if he loses another GE. He needs to do the party and the country a favour and leave now.

I have no wish to fight the LPs's battles for them but Keir Starmer has simply repeated LP policy, hasn't he?

A fresh referendum is the only way to break the Brexit deadlock, Keir Starmer has said, in a move likely to fuel divisions at the top of Labour.

The shadow Brexit secretary said there was "only one way out" of the current impasse and made no mention of efforts to first trigger a general election, despite this being the party's official policy.

His comments will be interpreted as throwing his weight behind calls for Labour to prioritise another referendum over an election, and come ahead of a week in which MPs are expected to try to secure a Final Say vote.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-referendum-keir-starmer-jeremy-corbyn-general-election-a9153196.html

A deal would be good. I hope it’s (a) better than Mrs. May’s & Ollie Robbins capitulation plan - we do have more Leavers on the negotiating team this time around and (b) I hope it’s good enough for the thwarters and plotters to agree to in the HoC.

Leo Varadkar seems happy.
Boris is delivering Brexit.
The DUP seem okay (this time) with a border in the North Sea as N.I. seem well placed with this deal to receive other benefits (plus they voted to Remain so are probably happier).
The EU seem positive.

Fingers & toes crossed now for ‘a deal’. So many of us are fed up of it all now. It’s time to move on and talk about other stuff in the U.K. yes, I understand negotiations about trade deals, tariffs etc will take years but the deed will have been done and we will be OUT. Finally.

And you believed him in UG?

Listening to Today it seems the Johnson may be about to agree to a boarder in the Irish Sea. The very idea he is suggesting is the same one he poured scorn on previously. Noticeable, the ERG are being very quiet at the moment. Are they finally beginning to see that we will not be able the fairy free trade agreements they we so sure about? Some of the commentators certainly think so.

If we cannot get the free trade agreements and the Brexiteers have driven us into leaving, how will leave voters feel then? In a country that loves to judge the will certainly be blamed as living standards plummet.

There is only one safe way to leave and that is in a customs union and the single market. If this is agreed then we must have a confirmatory vote as some leave voters will think we may as well stay, some will see it as a first step and some remain voters will have been suspicious of the political ties but didn't dare vote remain previously.

Johnson is well known for breaking his promises.

I thought Boris said he’d rather die in a ditch than ask for one?
?

My guess is that Johnson will claim that he's made enough progress to ask for a further extension.

What about freedom of movement and the rights of EU citizens already in the UK and UK citizens already in the EU? What about healthcare? what about Gibraltar?

Urmstongran, if Johnson has accepted that there cannot be a border in Ireland, then he must have also have accepted that there has to be a Customs union on the island.

That Customs Union if not incorporating the whole of Britain then in some way it has to be worked out how could be made to apply to just Ireland, and in that still protect the integrity of the EU free trade area.

Whatever the outcome of the above negotiations (if the reports of Johnson climb down are true) then the ERG group, DUP and the Brexit Party will never accept such an outcome.

It will be chaos in the House of Commons once more, and the Brexit Party will be fighting every constituency in the forthcoming General Election and all will have a view to overturning the agreement.

As stated, if the reports are true, the crisis could be a long way from over. However, for me, Britain remaining in the Customs Union would be the best way for Britain to actually leave with the least possible pain.

A lot of people in the negotiations are very smiley right now! Let’s hope it’s a deal everyone can get behind (at long last).

It is reported that the big move by Boris has been to accept that there cannot be a customs border in Ireland.

If that is actually the case, and the European Commission will be looking to probe the UK proposal very thoroughly indeed, then it is a major step from the British side.

But after months of impasse and stand-off, it seems there is finally something to talk about!