We should all be deeply ashamed by this

I must admit that it concerns me that anybody thinks it's a price worth paying/a risk worth taking to achieve Brexit or not. Although I truly believe that Brexit is a totally bad idea and am prepared to argue my case, I'm actually quite sanguine about it. When I'm told I'm smug or whatever, I know it's not true and dismiss such comments as goading.

I've watched Johnson's dirty tricks and attack on parliamentary systems with horror and seen the appalling behaviour by certain individuals, including those who have threatened Anna Soubry, etc. I really do wonder how bitter and angry these people must be. I do think we could see some nastiness and I do think it shouldn't sway politicians from doing what's right for the country. Maybe that's what this survey is about, but the questions and choices are badly thought through.

Growstuff I am with Matt Singh in being dubious about the contruction of the questions in the poll. I had noticed some of the things he mentions. They make certain assumptions about what the responders are basing their answers on that may not be true, miss out certain questions, and don't allow for alternative answers that could affect the statistics of the results.

As often happens, the media seize on the most spectacular of the conclusions reached. I hold by my immediate reaction - that I just do not believe that the majority of the population are prepared to attack MPs and injure members of the public in this cause. It has a whiff of that "Project Fear" which is shouted around whenever someone points out the possibility of problems ensuing in supplies, transport, etc etc.

I sincerely hope that I am right, and that we are not set for a decade of anarchy and civil war - for that is what it would be. If I am wrong and we descend to that, would it really be worth it?

I was sidetracked while searching and ended up reading a diferent account of attiudes to the whole Brexit phenomenon. The survey found that there was not much correlation between Leave/Remain and most of the attitudes, or between Labour/Tory in whether people were for Leave/Remain. When I get home this afternoon I will find it again and post a link.

Oopsminty, yes, ok. To me it doesnt matter whether its Leavers/Remainers. What does matter is it is usual newspaper s* stirring to set people against one another. Honestly you cant open your mouth on these forums without somebody jumping down your throat.

Drug trials are entirely different to opinion surveys. Drug trials usually depend on volunteers that have to fulfil certain criteria, usually health and age come into it or they are individuals with a particular health problem. They do not use or need to use a cross section of the population as a whole.

Matt Singh is an election and polling analyst, who correctly predicted the result of the 2015 election. He has reservations about the poll.

This is what he had to say about it on Twitter:

This headline has made a bit of a splash. On the face of it, the findings are very worrying. But as usual, take a look at the question wording...

“Some have suggested that *leaving the European Union* might present challenges to the UK but others disagree, labelling this as Project Fear. For each of the following please tell us whether you think this would be a price worth paying or not paying for Brexit?”

It also asks a similar, opposite version re Remain. Here are the answer options. Note that it says “risk worth taking, which is semantically quite different from “price worth paying” as is the clickbait headline (former treats it as a risk, latter implies that it will happen).

Violence directed towards Members of Parliament

I want this to happen regardless of Brexit
I see it as a risk but it’s worth it to remain in the EU
Staying in the EU is not worth the risk of this happening

It’s also notable that there is no option on these questions (only on a later question) to say that you don’t think it’s likely. I suspect that if that had been offered, many on both sides would have taken it.

The really worrying result in this is that 7 percent of people say they want violence against politicians. That’s more than 3 million people.

As well as not thinking violence is likely, as some people don’t, people might also think that Remaining/Leaving doesn’t make violence likelier or less likely. So I’m not sure about these questions or the headline.

I was tired when I read this thread and the complaints that there was no source, clicked on the link to the Guardian and found the source within seconds.

I skimmed through the results and haven't yet taken them all in, which I will in the morning, but I did notice that the composition of those surveyed is given.

To be honest, it looked a lot less biased or weighted than many surveys I've seen and 4000 is a reasonable number to ask.

It's late and I am tired and none of us is perfect, weasel.

Wheasle?

Growstuff I thought that was one of those links to a definition of "academic survey" for those who don't know!

I've had a long day, so I don't think my grey cells are up to reading any more tonight. My only thought is that 650-odd people are a very small sample of the population of Scotland on which to base a sweeping generalisation, and that 53% of them does not represent "most of the electorate"

I also notice that there were questions about opinions on various aspects of the effects of Brexit, but that only the ones concerned with violence were mentioned in media

Finally, no-one said anything in the newspapers about the people (luckily quite small numbers) who appeared to have ticked, "I want this to happen regardless of Brexit" for the questions on violence to MPs and on people being seriously hurt. But perhaps I am too tired to make sense of the last.

The 2019 Future of England Survey is conducted by YouGov.

The data:
www.cardiff.ac.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/1708631/Copy-of-England-16-Oct-AH.pdf

Yes it is Elegran. Just click on the link "an academic survey".

Thank you Misadventure That link was not in the Gurdian article.

Research conducted by Richard Wyn Jones who may not be unbiased himself.

The survey results are available by clicking the links at the bottom of the article

www.cardiff.ac.uk/news/view/1709008-future-of-england-survey-reveals-public-attitudes-towards-brexit-and-the-union

I would like to know the demographic of the sample surveyed as I find the results questionable.

Suziewoozie, yes, no research is without some flaws. Whether it makes the research results worthless, all depends on what the flaws are.

I am not saying this research is worthless. Merely that the description of the sample is imprecise. I am not looking for the questionnaire because what we are commenting on is a newspaper article reporting research results and I would expect a newspaper, especially The Guardian - and on such an inflammatory subject to make sure it has carefully checked the research out and can recognise what needs to be checked when dealing with such a contentious subject.

Well, I am seeing my MP this weekend so must suppress my urge to give him a smack.

The usual aim of drugs trials is to find out, or prove, if a drug is safe.
Unfortunately, this may not always be the case despite previous and what is deemed to be rigorous research.

Oh, I see. You couldn't find it either and are referring only to previous reports from the Future of England project.

I realise that, M0nica but what may seem to be a representative sample could prove otherwise and some questions in such surveys and polls can be misleading or be set in a way which produces the required answers.

I now realise that Susiewoozie thought that I was implying a conspiracy to keep it from the public. No such thing had occurred to me, I was just surprised that I couldn't find something that had triggered several newspapers to publish articles on it. I decided that they had had an preview of it and it would be available to us all soon.

Well then if you know all about drug trials you’ll know the results are based on using relatively small samples

it was very very easy to find the link. If you’re capable of passing judgement on the research, then you should be capable of finding it.

I know full well how drugs trials are carried out.

Do you think we are all simple suzie?