Food Banks and Poverty- was Nye right?

Perhaps if the non working partner took care of all the domestic issues, leaving the working partner free to succeed and become wealthy enough to pay plenty of tax, then yes, the non working partner has contributed.

I don't think that was the point Pantglas. It was about the hypocritical comments previously made about other people's lifestyles by somebody who obviously hasn't "struggled" in a way most would mean.

A philosophical question perhaps: If someone didn't work, but their partner did, does that non-working partner have the righ to feel that he/she had contributed to their pension/society in their own right?

The more people are prudent inkycog the more there is for those not as fortunate. Of course not everyone can afford to buy even one property, let alone two, but don’t allow envy to colour your opinion of Mr Bevan’s eminently sensible suggestion.

I certainly don't want to start landlord-bashing. I'm lucky enough to have a wonderful one, but I don't think he would ever claim that he's struggled for very much.

It's a funny old world. I will have a pension which will just about pay for essentials when I reach state pension age. I also have an occupational pension. I worked full-time for 47 years and paid contributions for it. I will have to pay rent because I lost my house (and mortgage). Maybe I'm being a bit dim here, but I'm sure the work I did and still do (including being a single parent) was more difficult than collecting rent and organising maintenance of a second property.

I wish I'd have thought of doing it when I was younger.

On the positive side, I don't and never have lived in a bubble. I really do appreciate finding out about other people's experiences - from the very rich to the very poor. I think if I'd had such a limited view of the world, I would have had the decency to refrain from commenting on people who have to claim benefits. I would be modest enough to realise that I didn't have a clue what struggling is really like.

No. We're all entitled to our opinions and its a different topic.?
I'm just making the point that the statements on two separate posts can't both be true.

Yes, that's another topic. .

We don't want start landlord-bashing now, do we?

Oldgimmer I think it's a great idea to have a second property as long as you charge a reasonable rent and the tenant can stay as long as they want. Same as council housing. That is my personal opinion. But that's another topic.
I agree. We all need to plan.

But either the rent covered the mortgage or they struggled to pay both.

In my immediate family there is an older couple who also struggled to pay two mortgages, but they did it by both working all hours of the day and night into their eighties. Why did they need a second home? To house two relatives with severe mental illness who would otherwise most likely have ended up dying on the streets. They would never have been able to afford a second mortgage without two incomes.

If the government had provided the necessary security for people with enduring mental illness my family members could have relaxed and enjoyed their retirement years more.

Of course, lots of people can buy a house and get second one which they rent out. It's so damned obvious really. Why isn't everybody doing it?

I will tell my AC and they will respond forthwith.

Seems to me that JenniferEccles was ‘prudent’ - just what Aneurin Bevan wanted folks to be!

annepl I must be reading Jennifer's post differently from you, then.

I read it as a person who'd rather struggle to pay an additional mortgage to secure some kind of income in retirement and did so as an active choice.

So just sensible financial planning?

Maybe she was fortunate to have had the choice, but we don't know her full circumstances.

It was an old story, but was identical to the details you had given. I appreciate you don't want to write any more. Yes, yet another sad tale. How many more have there been?

Oldgimmer they weren't struggling to pay two mortgages.

Growstuff sorry but it wasn't my brother. He died on Christmas day, but not this year. Sorry I should have made that clear. I tend not to give too much detail. Sounds like another sad tale though.

annep1 I Googled your brother and found his story in the local press. I can't get it out of mind and am sooo angry that people still can't/won't believe that kind of thing happens. My very belated) condolences and I wish you a Happy New Year!

I'm sorry annepl but I can't see what it is about Jennifer's post that you're questioning?

JenniferEccles
We had to make a lot of sacrifices to save the deposit but once we bought the house we put a tenant in and the rent covered the mortgage.

I didn’t want my children brought up by a childminder or a nursery. It was a struggle especially as we had two mortgages but we managed.

??

Nobody would be called a scrounger if they claimed on their car or home insurance.

Very good point!

Some good points made here.
I hadn't thought of more women working now and contributing.
It's true that if people have not contributed hey get paid a benefit anyway. And means testing would work in their favour. And an occupational pension is often worth little as it loses you pension credit.
Depressing subject.

Grannyactivist so sorry to hear about your brother. He has been so unlucky.
It would be a harsh world if people were criticised for or were denied having some enjoyment because they are on benefits. What kind of life would that be.

I wondered about the term 'benefit' when it was introduced in the 1930s the term used was Unemployment Benefit but it was always known as "The Dole'. I wonder if not using benefit made it more acceptable and we are now seeking to make it unacceptable?
One of the effects of the change in pension schemes may be the mobility of NHS staff. Long term staff on the old pension scheme lose out if they move areas-eg NHS England to NHS Scotland as they have to move from the old scheme to the new one.

GagaJo Occupational pensions are becoming a thing of the past. A number of private schools have stopped enrolling their staff on to the Teachers' Pensions Scheme and some academies are considering following that route. By law, state schools can't opt out, but there soon won't be many of them left (if any).

There aren't many occupational pension schemes around which are anything like as generous as the ones in the past. That affects public service and private pension schemes.

I agree with you Callistemon that we never know what life is going to throw at us. That's why we pay National INSURANCE Contributions. Help is supposed to be available without stigmatising when life throws a few bucketful of poo at us. Nobody would be called a scrounger if they claimed on their car or home insurance.

Nothing wrong with try to achieve a better life. BUT there needs to be an acknowledgement that the vast majority of people, particularly now, do not have that ability. Plus you're cutting out the disabled, the zero hours contract people, those needing UC to top up wages that are not living wages.

I am fortunate enough to be trying to plan to retire at 60 without a pension. But I am one of the lucky few who has some options. I voted Labour to try to help those a lot less fortunate than myself.