Food Banks and Poverty- was Nye right?

I was ashamed to work for DWP when I retired 6 years. I worked with older people, helping them to get more benefits. But my last 2 weeks was spent on Jobcentre reception. My first thought was When did Jobcentres stop helping people?

baggs Who is hating whom Baggs?

Nietzche also said "Man is the cruelest animal.".

Billions available in benefits is just not claimed either, particularly by older people.

Benefit fraud. So much insistence on benefit fraud which somehow justifies the appalling treatment of those in genuine need.

Do these self righteous harpers on 'benefit fraud' actually know how much fraud there actually is?

It's a lot, lot less than most people think it is:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39980793

So let's ignore the fraudsters and think about the people in real need... Tax evasion costs the economy far more than does benefit fraud; where's all the pearl clutching and indignation about that?

(And let's be realistic, at least the fraudulently obtained benefit money goes back into the economy... it's spent here in the UK, and so eventually returns to the treasury by taxation, not squirrelled off into offshore bank accounts..)

"In the absence of time to think and calmness in thinking, one no longer considers divergent opinions; one is satisfied with hating them." Nietzsche

Absolutely agree Lemon, this is a very complex situation. There is no way that people who are unable to work should be being denied benefits. That is what benefits are for, to support those who can’t work through ill health, and to provide a safety net for people who, through no fault of their own, fall on hard times.
Unfortunately there are people who abuse the benefit system, for example those who commit benefit fraud. Others who, whilst in a minority, live on benefits with little intention to find a job. I worked in a deprived community when I was teaching, and I know there were a number of families for whom a life on benefits was the norm. But equally, there were single mums who got a job as soon as their children were in school, and many other families who worked hard in low paid jobs to provide for their families.
Tackling benefit fraud is important, encouraging people who can work, to actually go to work is also important. But equally, providing for those vulnerable members of society who cannot work is crucial, and makes us a better society for doing so.

Growstuff Now you have explained your situation I apologize for having a go at you and commend you for the way you are managing and particularly growing your own veg. I have an allotment and was doing quite well till last year when I fell on it and broke hip and wrist, was just recovering from that when I fell again and broke other hip so 2020 has a question mark over it where the allotment is concerned.

I am reminded of a time I was receiving widowed mothers payment, I was working ,paying tax and NIC, I was ill for two weeks and claimed sick pay, I was told - ‘we keep you once we are not keeping you twice !

If the allowance was suppose to ‘keep’ me and my young daughters why the hell was I working to put food on the table.

I cannot believe the minds of people who state, blatantly, that those "in the cases above" can't cope.

There is a good chance they have coped with a great deal more than the poster has ever done. Being pushed to the edge by deliberately hostile policies is not "not coping.

A culture of caring and support would help as well lemon I think sadly that Nye was right. That the fight for equality has been abandoned by many, that the gap between the richest and the poorest has widened and that sadly there will be more deaths in 2020 while the rest of us watch Downton Abbey on our expensive TV sets, or Call the Midwife because it paints a picture of a caring society we have lost.

The tragic cases of individuals who cannot cope ( in the above cases) are awful, and there were a few in the list that I read about.
Bureaucracy/ Officialdom can be unforgiving at times, mainly because the staff are in many cases either ticking boxes without any care or sticking rigidly to rules, when common sense should prevail.Preventing benefit fraud is one thing and coming down far too hard on others in genuine need should be possible to be sorted out.
Vulnerable people don’t always have relatives/ friends/ kind neighbours/ priests/vicars or anyone else that they can turn to, and even when they have, for various reasons are reluctant to ask for help.
Governments of any political stripe must try harder to get things right, starting with the assessment process and how to help those who fall through the net, on paper it may be the
case that they could do some form of work, but practically, they actually can’t.
Rigorous staff training would help.

It needed to be spelled out to some people on here the benefits regime sanctions.
What a Tory decade has meant for children. 135,000 homeless in temporary accomodation, vulnerable children in need of care placed in unregulated homes, not enough beds to treat the sick & 4 million in poverty.

‘Breaking point’: fears over lack of intensive care beds for children
Exclusive: critically ill children rushed to units across England as NHS struggles to find beds

Not enough beds

amp.theguardian.com/society/2019/dec/29/nhs-picu-shortage-intensive-care-beds-critically-ill-children?__twitter_impression=true

Acrylic nails? What? How absolutely vile the assumptions and comments are from some.

Urmstongran What have you got to say in reply to my last post??

Joelsnan I'm so sorry to hear about your son.

Thanks Growstuff and sorry you've had such a bad time.

I've more to add but later. I'm off to an art exhibition.

BTW Tooting I don't know when you worked for DWP, but I have had two encounters with them over a number of years and there was a distinct change in the approach of staff in about 2011/2. Even some of the more established staff complained about the new regime.

What would help this discussion Tooting would be for certain posters to keep their smug, judgemental, ignorant opinions to themselves.

I have had to claim benefits myself, have worked with the homeless, my sister spent her working life in psychiatric nursing and I still volunteer with vulnerable families (as I did over Christmas). I have had direct experience of some of the problems in the OP and have tried to give facts.

Indeed and I'm not simply blaming Tories. Nevertheless, I find the attitude of some posters on here odious and they are loud cheerleaders for the nastiest of Tory policies.

Gagajo
Why the right wing?
Some of the actions in place were as a result of Labour Government policy. Others may have required cross party approval to pass.
This situation is more complex than a simple ‘blame the tories’

Thank you for posting the sad stories above. Reading through them highlights the complex needs of some individuals. One wonders how this comes about and decisions are made when payments are curtailed. Is it lacking training for staff assessing these claims, or are the guidelines so strict that staff are not able to exercise judgement or discretion. I worked in the Dept of Employment for a number of years and processed claims and made payments for income support and benefits. People claiming came from a cross section of society from the homeless, to people ashamed to have to claim because they lost their job through no fault of their own and many in between. We also has a busy fraud section who prosecuted those claiming benefit who were also working on the side. I have also been a recipient of benefit when widowed at 25 with 2 small children and a step son (sadly no longer with us) who was autistic and epileptic. So I like to think I have some insight on how the system works from both sides. What is evident is that there is no simple answer or fix. As a civilised society we have a duty to look after those less fortunate but a Government also has a duty to manage public finances responsibily. So a balance needs to be struck. What would help this discussion is some balance, some examples where appropriate support helped people turn their lives around. I am grateful it was there when I needed it at a low point in my life.

No need to write "Well done" GagaJo. I did nothing except write the truth. These people sicken me too. How dare they?

Nothing from the right-wing, 'get out there and get a job' brigade (who doubtless are sitting in a warm house, well fed, with all the bills paid, including their private healthcare insurance).

No compassion. No care. 'I'm all right Jack'. They sicken me. They don't represent the Tory party well.

Well done growstuff.

annep1 I am so sorry to hear about your brother. I also had a heart attack, which was almost certainly brought on by stress, but I was one of the lucky ones and survived, although my health has certainly been adversely affected.

Some of the posters here really don't have a clue.

JenniferEccles I waited until I was 37 and married before I had my first child because we wanted to be sure that we would be financially secure. It might surprise that most single parents in the UK are in their 30s and have been in a relationship when they gave birth.

And I also object to your smug, patronising attitude. I had been a high achiever all my life. I didn't need to litter pick (or whatever) to prove I could achieve.

And I repeat the question ExperiencedNotOld. How would you differentiate?

How do you expect anyone to live on £73.10?

Having been one of those people who couldn't find work after losing my job through illness, I find your attitude completely offensive. I am not just some anonymous "they". I was (and am) a person, who had done everything right in my life and had paid tens of thousands of pounds in tax, after having worked full-time all my adult life. Maybe that's not "deserving" enough for you.

And no Urmstongran I don't have tattoos or acrylic nails or several children.