Sensible Discussion on Labour Leadership hopefuls MK 2

No surprise really that Emily Thornberry was knocked out. The surprise was that she got this far.

Davidhs, in regard to your post @09:17 today, it has to be remembered that these MPs were elected to their Parliamentary positions on the back of policies that the Labour Party and broader Labour movement have been putting forward for some considerable time. If these MPs felt they could not support those policies then the "honourable" thing to have carried out would have not to stood as Labour Party MPs at the last General Election.

I can understand that there are those that would wish to see a change in policies and emphasis within the new leadership and Long-Bailey is standing as the continuity candidate to present policies. However, it has always been strong tradition across the whole Labour movement that should any member feel opposed any policy or action, then they stay within the Movement and campaign for change.

These MPs are in many cases "bleeting" to grassroots shop-floor trade union activists who on a daily basis fight uphill battles on behalf of the members they work alongside. Do these Labour MPs really think that such persons will give any respect or credibility to people who are given a privileged position of service and then wish or threaten to "throw in the towel" within a few weeks of a General Election?

What these MPs need to do is get off their backsides and campaign all around the Labour movement in the cause of their beliefs gaining support by their weight of their argument along the way. No other action will gain respect, and the attempted blackmail tactics they have resorted to may well enhance Long-Baileys chances of becoming Labour Leader.

POGS, in regard to your post @10:21 today, several Red Top newspapers have carried the reports of Labour MPs resigning should Long-Bailey be elected as Labour leader. However, no names have been mentioned, but obviously, the press has been briefed by someone, and many within the movement will have names come to mind based on passed troubles caused in the Parliamentary party.

Below are links to some of the reports:-

www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1240326/labour-leadership-rebecca-long-bailey-party-mps-quit-jeremy-corbyn-keir-starmer

www.politicshome.com/news/uk/political-parties/labour-party/news/109756/dozens-labour-mps-could-quit-party-if-rebecca

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/unite-boss-says-clear-out-now-to-labour-mps-threatening-to-quit-if-rebecca-long-bailey-becomes-leader-1-5080863

paddyann

' Nandy is a tory in disguise ,her views are very far right'
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If that is true why do you suppose Lisa Nandy has the backing from the likes of the National Mine Workers Union, The GMB Union (General, Municipal, Boilermakers) which has more than 631,000 members.,?

Starmer is a knight, not a peer otherwise he would be in the H of L.

I think it was for outstanding contribution to public life in his previous career. He prefers not to use it but of course the MSM will continue to do so.

I dont believe theres any chance of any labour "opposition" doing what they should and actually opposing instead of abstaining on votes where the toties losing would have made a massive difference in peoples lives.While I haven't voted labour for a very long time I am sad to see the party on the downward spiral it seems determined to continue.Nandy is a tory in disguise ,her views are very far right ,Starmer ,,well I can never quite get my head around a "labour peer" its so far removed from core values its off the page.I do wish the grass roots luck though ,they need it.

I am sorry about Emily Thornberry too, but I think Caroline Flint scuppered her some time ago,with her accusations of a kind of snobbery.

I am not sure that many M.P.s are voted for as individuals though, I think most voters vote for the party whose policies they most agree with.

As regards the MPs who are threatening to leave if Rebecca Long Bailey is elected leader, I think that it would be as well to let them go, but I would expect them to then agree to a by election , not assume that their constituents agree with them.

I will probably vote for Keir Starmer as leader, but not yet decided between Dawn Butler or Richard Burgon for deputy.

POGS I always found ET arrogant but thought that she must have either had advice or taken a long hard look at herself because I thought she had improved in her presentation recently.
I did wonder too if she no longer felt that Corbyn and his advisers were no longer a threat to anyone who dissented, so she was more free to speak her mind.

I agree POGS I too think KS will hoover up some extra support now.

Anniebach, Callistemon

Thank you very much but I meant leaving behind any personal spat to concentrate on the discussion. Cheers.

So Emily Thornberry is officially out.

She tried her damnedest to promote herself and I know I will be accused of being horrible but I have always found her arrogant and smug but it must smart a little today to be not be seen as a contender.

I would think those who backed her will shift their vote to Keir Starmer or am I wide off the mark?

Grandad, it is the “affiliate” members that need to be more realistic, their best chance of changing the lot of working people is to get a Labour Government into Westminster. Don’t they ever learn, Corbyn has been a disaster as leader, more of the same is not going to improve anything.

Burying their head in the sand is not going to change anything, of course many don’t represent anyone, they just pay the membership to get a vote

I think that both LN and R L-B are too low on the general public radar and lacking in experience in speaking before hostile audiences to make a success of the job. Either of them would risk going the same way as Jo Swinson, which would be a pity. We don't want any more ruining of the careers of able young female politicians.

I don't think this applies to Emily Thornberry so I'll be sorry if she really is knocked off the ballot.

Please stay POGS

That would be a pity POGS

there are fewer and fewer posters contributing to the political threads for obvious reasons so it could all just end up as a one-sided conversation.

Labour MPs have been elected by their Labour supporting constituents and then represent all of their constituents. I know far less than some on this thread about the processes but it does seem to me that these MPs have been treated with contempt for some time by those leading the Labour Party; however, they must be doing something right to be returned by their constituencies.

If RLB continues down the same route as JC et al does that mean those MPs and their constituents will continue to be held in contempt by the leaders of the LP?
That could result in yet another disastrous showing in a GE.

In general, voters in a GE have the last say. They have just demonstrated what they think quite decisively.

MaizieD Sat 15-Feb-20 09:00:42

' That's OK, POGS, I just won't read your posts if you can't summon up the manners to make them more accessible to everyone.'
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I am sure other posters are sick and tired of threads being derailed into personal spats that have bugger all to do with the thread so I will leave this matter behind as of now to allow others to post interested in discussing the Labour Leadership.

David's, in regard to your post @09:17 today, it has to be remembered that the MPs who are now threatening to resign were elected to their parliamentary seats on the back of policies that have been put forward by the Labour Party and the broader movement for some considerable time. If they did not feel they could support those policies the "honourable" thing to have carried out would have been to not stand as a Labour Party MP at the last election.

I can understand that their are those in the Parliamentary Party who would wish to see policy changes within any new leadership and within that Long-Bailey is standing as the candidate of continuity with the current policies. However, it has always been a strong tradition within the whole Labour movement that if there are any policies or actions that you do not agree with, you remain within the movement and campaign for change, gaining support by your weight of argument along the way.

These MPs are in many cases "bleeting" to grassroots activists in the trade union movement who fight uphill battles every day at shop floor level on behalf of the members they work alongside. Do these MPs think that such affiliate members will in any way support persons given a privileged position of service, and yet, wishing to "throw in the towel" within a few weeks of a General Election?

These MPs should get off their backsides and campaign all around the movement to gain support for the policies and leadership they wish to see brought forward.

Nothing but the above will ever gain any widespread support within the Labour movement.

Grandad1943 Sat 15-Feb-20 08:03:08

'To those who participated throughout in the now-expired "sensible discussion on the Labour leadership hopefuls" thread, I would be interested in their views on the media reports that a number of Labour MPs are threatening to resign from the parliamentary party if Rebecca Long-Bailey is elected as leader.
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Grandad be fair I have engaged with you over this matter more than once , see my post today 00.05 :-

' You mentioned this on the other thread and I said I had not heard this but the conversation went nowhere.

Can you expand on this, who for example has said it. I ask out of interest not to challenge the honesty of what you say which I doubt you would think was behind my asking, I would hope not.'
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I am interested to know. ' who ' the MP' s are and also which '' media reports / papers ' have reported this. The information can be informative to be able engage in debate.

It’s not a case of blackmailing Grandad it’s a case of throwing the towel in because “I’m wasting my time.” There is no point becoming an MP if you are constantly frustrated and your party have no chance of ever forming a government. To me RLB is every bit as left wing as Corbyn whereas KS is much more credible and likely to appeal to a far wider range of voters.
Your idea that you might support RLB because she is the underdog is just nuts, realistically KS has a much better chance of forming a government.

That's OK, POGS, I just won't read your posts if you can't summon up the manners to make them more accessible to everyone.

It is not blackmail, the MP’s are being honest

To those who participated throughout in the now-expired "sensible discussion on the Labour leadership hopefuls" thread, I would be interested in their views on the media reports that a number of Labour MPs are threatening to resign from the parliamentary party if Rebecca Long-Bailey is elected as leader.

my thoughts on the matter are, if these MPs wished to help Rebbeca Long-Bailey get chosen as leader they could not have stated anything of greater aid.

All members of parliament are elected to their position by democratic vote, and for such persons to state that they will not accept the outcome of such a democratic process outside of their own election beggars belief.

I believe that the above demonstrates the levels that some on the right of the Parliamentary Labour Party are prepared to sink to, and in doing that, they may have very much raised the prospects of Long-Bailey gaining the party leadership if only by way of members now voting for her just to see the back of these MPs.

The Labour movement is now once again a true socialist organisation, and the above MPs do not in any way reflect that and should have gone or been removed three years ago in the same way as Johnson removed the Brexit rebels in his party.

For me, Long-Bailey was no longer to be my first choice in the forthcoming ballot, but the threats from these so-called Labour MPs is now making me think again in polling for her as my first choice.

Blackmail must never be allowed to succeed.

Maizie d

Far too interested in debating the Leadership Contest to worry about how I come across if truth be known.

I shall have to just keep on upsetting you with my posts .

Grandad

'The most interesting event of this week has been the media reports of a number of Labour MPs resigning from the party if Rebbeca Long-Bailey is elected as leader.

The above I feel may have changed the whole tone and possible outcome of the campaign, but the importance of that does not seem to have been picked up on in this thread.'
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You mentioned this on the other thread and I said I had not heard this but the conversation went nowhere.

Can you expand on this, who for example has said it. I ask out of interest not to challenge the honesty of what you say which I doubt you would think was behind my asking, I would hope not.

but others probably realise that the word ' BUMP '

I knew exactly what 'bump' means, POGS. It was your second post I was referring to. The one where you copied and pasted swathes of the previous thread.

Formatting is easy. It differentiates between your thoughts and those of the person or persons you are quoting. To get italics you type one of these ^ at each end of the passage (with no spaces between the ^ and the following or preceding word) and for bold you do the same thing with a * at the start and finish.

Please, please format...