Sensible Discussion on Labour Leadership hopefuls MK 2

I have not yet received my voting slip. Grandad- I will not and cannot vote for anyone who is anti EU and campaigned to Leave- as it will hurt the most vulnerable who have already suffered too much since Thatcher.

I also cast my votes yesterday evening along with many in my Unite Trade union Branch I believe. I too, however, will fully support whoever of the three candidates elected to the leadership position as I always have done in my fifty-three years continuous membership of the Labour movement.

Through thick and thin that's me. ?

I have just cast my votes for the Leader and the Deputy Leader.
I voted for Keir Starmer for leader. I did feel that I was making a rather 'safe' choice. I liked all the candidates and will not be disappointed if either of the others wins, I just felt that Keir Starmer was the least divisive whereas if Rebecca Long Bailey wins it will be an excuse for more division, although I agree with her views on most matters.
Lisa Nandy, I thought, had some very good points to make about listening to people in their constituencies and finding out what people would really like from a Labour Government, not what politicians think that they should want.

So having played it safe in the leadership election I thought I could go with my gut feelings a bit more for the deputy. I voted for Richard Burgon first, then Dawn Butler, for their enthusiasm and passion. Although again, I will not be upset if either Angela Raynor or Rosina Allin Khan win. I would be a little disappointed though, if it is Ian Murray, as he seemed rather willing to ditch the policies in the last manifesto.

I have liked the way the hustings have been carried out, the candidates have not sniped at each other (apart from Jess Philips in the early stages) which has made it boring for the press, but has, I think, shown people that Labour candidates can put aside their differences and work together towards a common goal.

POGS yes agreement between us about Lisa Nandy being anything but a tory in disguise. I've been impressed by her campaign so far.
Also, we're in agreement about the return/new member folks who joined when Corbyn was elected. From my point of view of course that was a Bad Thing in that people expelled by Kinnock returned to create even worse mayhem. I live in hope that the current lot of returners are like me, likely to be dismissed as Blairites. (I say this only partly in jest)

I am 64

Thanks for responding. You say:-

'The balance was tipped I think by the members who are either re-joiners, or new members who want rid of Corbyn's legacy.

He is seen as moderate in comparison with RLB and LN, though I've heard some members refer to Lisa as a Tory in disguise.'
--

There is indeed a mirror image of what happened when Corbyn became Leader of the Jeremy for Leader/Momentum Labour Party which gained such a huge success because of ' return/new ' Labour Members then and the same thing happening to stop his legacy from continuing by a new influx of ' return/new ' members of late. Pure irony.

I hear it often said Lisa Nandy is ' Tory Light / Tory in disguise' and I honestly do not understand why.

Sigh

I wouldn’t normally comment on posters’ spelling, but when a poster pontificates about all things to do with the Labour Leadership, you’d think he could spell all the contenders names correctly wouldn’t you?

Rebecca Long Bailey is undoubtedly the accurately called ' Continuity Corbyn Candidate ' so there is little UNknown about her or her policies.

Lisa Nandy can throw some spanners in the works and I have changed my opinion about her the most during the debates and hustings that we have as the public been allowed to view or read. Over the years I have watched her on programmes such Politics Live, This Week et al. she came over as pragmatic and centrist and did so with a certain charm. I now think she has all along actually been further to the left than thought. She certainly has found her feet.

Keir Starmer is is so smooth I find him a tad slippery at times. I think he is trying to be all things to all people but if he is not careful they will scrutinise what he is or what he is not saying as the case may be.

If the debates / hustings were not so ruddy pally and saccharin at times we might be a tad wiser. Perhaps the gloves will come off when they go back to work next week.

Grandad

'Where Kier Starmer stands on several issues is enclosed in the vagueness of a attorneys speak. I believe he is attempting to be "all things to all members" in this election campaign.'
-

Or as I mentioned previously he is a flip-flopper who will engage in conversations setting out his stance according to whom and where he is speaking to and where he thinks he can manipulate to garner points.

What is commonly known as' facing two ways '

Milliband the broken looking brother... (facepalm)

Hahaha Gdad nice try massive fail - the discussion will continue. You are a caution ! The only legal aspect of the trans pledge I’ve seen being discussed is the fact that Women’s UK were defamed and some of us wanted to encourage them to take legal action - unlike RLB and LN they haven’t got deep pockets lined by the unions and other anti-women groups so are unlikely to be able to do other than fight their corner on Twitter.

Just click on pic to enlarge it.

Saw this today ?

Galaxy if there is a legal challenge begun in regard to trans gender issues within the Labour party, then it is wise I feel for all to sit back and allow the court action(s) to run there course.

In the above, it may not even be allowed to be on the agenda for debate at the Labour conference in September.

Thanks yes his past career is impressive.
It's a challenge re all women shortlists grandad, the crowdfunder launched in 2018 and as far as I am aware the papers have been served and they are waiting for a response. The barrister is amanda jones, Great James St chambers. Sorry I cant do links!

Galaxy - I'm not sure the CLP does view him as moderate to be honest. I think the vote was swung away from RLB by people who don't believe she can win an election. I suspect those 4 votes came from a former MP and new or re-joining members. Otherwise, it would have been RLB.
I think looking at the number of CLP's who voted Starmer, it's more than him not being RLB. He's left enough, his life and work experience mean he is viewed by many as the candidate most likely to win an election and lead an effective opposition.
Not sure this answers POGS question, its just my own view.

Are you able to say why your CLP view him as a moderate, I think Pogs question is a good one. Is it simply that he isn't RLB?

Galaxy Quote [There are currently legal challenges against the labour party with regard to this issue grandad.] End Quote.

Have you any links to the above Galaxy, I would be genuinely interested in reading them.

POGS Keir was elected at our CLP recently, by a majority of 4 (total of about 65 members present). RLB was second and Lisa Nandy third. Like most CLP's we had an increase in Corbyn supporters, some of whom remain and are committed to RLB, they were very disappointed she didn't win. The balance was tipped I think by the members who are either re-joiners, or new members who want rid of Corbyn's legacy.

He is seen as moderate in comparison with RLB and LN, though I've heard some members refer to Lisa as a Tory in disguise.

The party remains divided and Starmer is pushing to be seen as the candidate who has best hope of unity. As can be seen on this thread and in other discussions, not all LP members support him so we wait and see.

Also quoting the equality act to women who have been fighting this issue for years is like me explaining trade union membership to you .

There are currently legal challenges against the labour party with regard to this issue grandad.

ananimous.
???

Kier Starmer tried to thwart Brexit, so there is that... maybe he's on loan from Boris? An inside plant to bring down
cheapLabour

His eyes are mighty close together.

POGS, you make a very good point in your post @12:02 today. Where Kier Starmer stands on several issues is enclosed in the vagueness of a attorneys speak. I believe he is attempting to be "all things to all members" in this election campaign.

However, I feel there is a deep suspicion of where he will really attempt to take the Parliamentary Labour Party in terms of left/right general stance which is in all probability why he has spent much of this week confirming his allegiance to the Policies that have been brought forward under Corbyn's leadership. Whether a majority trust him in those statements is anyone's guess

Therefore I am as confused as you POGS on the real political stance of Starmer.....trustworthy?????

And I certainly CBA to go back several days to find what I said - I would still agree with it anyway I’m sure?