Comparison of European responses to CV

Without a code informing what big X and little x mean, and what the restrictions are this is a little vague. Premiership football matches have been cancelled until 4th April. The USA travel restriction, as far as I'm aware, is nobody allowed in ( except USA citizens) from the Schengen area, UK still allowed.

I've had various messages in my in box today from venues I'm on the mailing list of. (In France) All of them are cancelling concerts, performances etc. I get the impression from the papers that the populations of most European countries are philosophical about cancellations and are quite willing to self isolate, whereas the UK govt thinks that people won't stand for such treatment.

It's just been reported that the government are going to ban mass gatherings after all. Another U-turn!!

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/13/uk-to-ban-mass-gatherings-in-coronavirus-u-turn?

Also on the BBC.

anniezzz09 I have no love for this government, and little confidence in them but what would you rather, that they stay pig-headed and refuse to re-evaluate? Some people are never satisfied! It's late, but better late than never.

In a situation where it should be proactive this government is being fumblingly reactive. We have watched the CV crisis grow in other countries for weeks now; government should have been following developments closely, observing best practice, and planning and preparing for worst case scenario.

As it is, it's been disgustingly lax and blase about the whole unfolding nightmare. Even to the extent of a Cabinet Minister showing symptoms, ignoring them to attend a big reception and run a surgery, then, pass it on to her 84yr old mother. These are the irresponsible dimwits running the country.

I am deeply relieved that they've been forced into banning mass gatherings but 'better late than never' earns no points whatsoever.

Who do we listen to?

Plenty of medical experts are opposed to lock down

Numerous articles suggesting it's pointless

We should listen to the WHO:

www.who.int/

More scary stuff, especially 'lowering standards' in care homes!

www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/coronavirus-emergency-laws-police-get-powers-to-detain-victims-b65fp7fvm

janipat I don't quite see the point of your comment. It seems to me that we have an uncoordinated, knee jerk governmental response to this crisis. A response which lurches along hiding behind apparent scientific experts, ideas about herd immunity that have been declared incorrect by international experts, nudge theory and a stance that is different to every other nation in thoroughness of practice.

What would you have me say? Oh thank goodness, that's ok then, jolly good boys? Each u-turn indicates a scary lack of real leadership or understanding of the situation. To pretend to forget while they lurch on means that one day, when this is over and there is a public enquiry about the government's handling of all this, then their ineptitude has been remembered and recorded.

Who knows what the assessment of this will be? Draconian measures to contain this virus may prevent its spread and save a number of vulnerable people but what happens when the next one occurs? Will we all be in lock-down again and again? This virus, like many illnesses cause a number of deaths, but the reaction to this one is potentially causing an economic depression which would impact on health, happiness and well-being. Repeated blows would change our way of life. We are in uncharted waters.

New Zealand have 6 cases and no deaths yet are taking stringent measures. It will be interesting to see what impact it has in the spread. This pandemic has been in the way since January, plenty of time to get our house in order. This time has been wasted. The government are trying to let the genie out of the bottle slowly. But this is a massive gamble.

anniezzz09 I agree entirely that this whole situation has been poorly managed, but I'm glad the government are at last apparently changing direction. Too often I see the u-turn comment used as damnation, a criticism of the u-turn, when surely that action is what we want when wrong decisions have been made in the first place? Margaret Thatcher famously said the lady wasn't for turning, maybe things would have been better if she had. Of course I don't expect you to say Oh thank goodness, that's ok then, jolly good boys? With someone as arrogant as Johnson I'm just relieved that someone persuaded him to see sense.

I get the impression from the papers that the populations of most European countries are philosophical about cancellations and are quite willing to self isolate, whereas the UK govt thinks that people won't stand for such treatment.

I haven't come across this view elsewhere. As I understand it we are some weeks behind countries like Italy and the consideration was nothing to do with people in the UK not standing for such treatment but with not implementing something until it was necessary. Common sense really.

Why have other countries, at a different phase of the virus within their country, suddenly become the "Jones" we must keep up with?

It is a gamble. It will be interesting to see in NZ stays relatively free and if so, why. For example, COVID-19 may be affected by seasonal factors. By the way, the pandemic was only declared this week; and we have had no shortage of advice for weeks.

It may be clutching at straws but I wonder if higher take-up of influenza vaccination in the UK than in most parts of Europe will help. [Data from 2018 and earlier]. Vaccination will not protect against COVID-19 but, maybe, by keeping over 65's free of 'normal' flu, it will leave us stronger to fight off this new virus. Just a thought. I will continue hand-washing and social distancing in line with expert advice.

an interesting article about two different approaches to the virus and its containment.
www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/03/italy-south-korea-differ-tackling-coronavirus-outbreak-200313062505781.html

Gracesgran

I gained my impressions about the different views in Europe compared to the UK from interviews on the tv news, newspaper articles and talking to people here in France. I have heard govt ministers say that if large events are cancelled then people will just gather elsewhere in private spaces. But I can't believe that Brits would be so stupid. We are after all, dealing with an unknown quantity.

On the Breakfast programme this morning they interviewed a pyschiatrist (or pyschologist - I can never remember the difference) who was talking up the mental health problems that will arise from periods of self isolation.

Obviously I'm aware that many older people, living on their own, will find it difficult not being able to meet other people but surely it's better to try to avoid large groups of people, or small groups in closed spaces for a few weeks, rather than run the risk of catching, or unwittingly spreading the virus.

There is no one size fits all for any crisis and I see no problem in different countries haveing different approaches to dealing with this crisis. Have the countries with the most draconian restrictions had the greatest success in reducing the incidence of the CV? The experience of Italy would not suggest so. China is further down the time line,so not directly comparable.

There is much that is purely psychological behind government responses to crises like this and I think some of these restrictions are being made because governments feel they ought to be seen to be making dramatic gestures rather than that they are likely to be effective.

I prefer a government like ours who presumes its population is reasonably intelligent and can see that what is necessary for limiting the timeline of the spread and peak of the disease, it cannot 'control' it any more than Canute could control the waves, is the best way to proceed and that most of us are not impressed by ineffective announcements of 'bells and whistles' and jumping up and down and shouting. What we want is considered and effective measures as and when necessary.

... we have had no shortage of advice for weeks.

It is not a shortage of advice Cunco. It is the thinking and evidence behind the advice that people are asking for. I doubt you would jump off a cliff without wanting to know the reason why you are being asked to do that. It may be because it is the best way to save your life from something coming towards you or it may be because saving you is too costly. You would still want to know.

I agree about the no one size fits all Monica and apparently, the government agrees that they should give us more of the background information. If this happens I will continue to basically but questioningly trust what they are saying. I appreciate why they could not do it earlier but I will keep gently asking the "why" question.

GGM3 we actually agree, so something good has come from this crisis

I've noticed that Monica. It is definitely a plus