Anyone live in Leicester? The lockdown there has been extended.

Thank you Bluecat for that articulate and accurate explanation.
You touched on my very point that Asian families, and many other foreign families, live together so they can look after their elders. It's traditional and I admire it.

What you failed to grasp growstuff was that I too was talking about a multigenerational Asian family who could easily have spent £350k three times over to live in separate houses, but chose to remain together. Sometimes wealth is not a factor.

So we have established that the spike hasn’t originated from Pakistan and that sandwich factories can become virus hotspots as well as meat packaging plants. But if we don’t discuss these things we won’t learn from these outbreaks. I’m hoping that Dr John Campbell will refer back to the Telegraph article because people that listen to his blogs pass on information.

Well said Bluecat I am relatively new to Leicestershire and Leicester but I love the city and its diversity.
There has been so much incorrect and unsubstantiated information on this thread.

I have read through the posts and now I am quivering with rage. Such ignorance and racism.

I have lived in Leicester all my life. I have an Asian husband. I have Asian relatives by marriage, some still living in the affected areas, some further afield. Allow me to correct a few... well, let's be polite and call them misconceptions.

In Leicester, white people are 50% of the population. The next largest ethnic group is Indian, like my husband. The Pakistani community is vanishingly small. You would be hard pushed to locate any Pakistani people, they are so few. I think that the blather about flights from Pakistan is irrelevant.

Nobody knows why it is happening. It could be that BAME people are more susceptible to the virus, for physical reasons that we don't know yet. It could be that, as these tend to be poorer areas, people there might be employed in jobs that put them at risk. The tendancy of people, particularly the older ones, to use small local shops where it is much more difficult to socially distance may be a reason. Some people live in multi-generational households, sometimes for economic reasons, often because there is a tradition of caring for parents and grandparents - but there are not nearly so many now, and the nuclear family is becoming the norm.

Asian people are not stupid. They understand about the virus and the lockdown. Older people may be unable to speak English but most families are now 3rd or 4th generation. Very few people have no-one who can translate for them and tell them what is happening.

Yes, some Asians will have broken lockdown, like some people from every ethnic group. Some will have visited family. Some will have kept working throughout, because they need the money. However, they are less likely to be the ones crowding onto the beach or waiting impatiently for the pubs to open.

One anomaly which no-one seems to mention is that one of the affected areas is Stoneygate, the poshest area of Leicester, full of nice, big houses. Admittedly, it is near one of the Asian areas - presumably people from Pakistan have hurried round to cough on rich people?

Despite the occasional efforts, over the years, of scum like the EDL to cause trouble, Leicester has a proud tradition of racial harmony. I love my diverse city, where you can buy English, Indian, Polish, Afro-Carribean and Chinese food with ease, and see our streets lit up for Diwali, Eid and Christmas. I dread that this outbreak will be used by some to try to drive a wedge between us. We will just have to rely on Leicester people's good common sense.

Oh, and it wasn't a meat packing plant. It was a sandwich factory.

tigger

Illte, you're making assumptions and I resent it. I have a mobile hairdresser. We have known each other a long while and are both intelligent and mature people. For instance I am sure we would wear a mask before opening the front door to a neighbour rather than not answer or talk through the window. Don't be surprised if she never speaks to you again and probably coughed as a joke.

There is a difference between stating cultural facts vis racist comments. I live in a part of Leicestershire where I am part of the ethnic MINORITY. In Leicester we have made cultural diversity work, we have had to. Certainly, we have had our problems but we have a lot to offer each other.

Coughed as a joke?!

If that’s what people are considering humor these days, I’ll stay locked up in my house alone.

Also, being a mature intelligent person doesn’t mean you aren’t going to get sick. What a load of rubbish.

Barrow in Furness has a high population density I believe. I did look it up a while back when a Labour MP said that different parts of the country should be treated differently I think it was regarding schools reopening) but the reply from (I think) Matt Hancock was that they intended to treat the country as a whole. Another u turn methinks ?

Ellianne How can you honestly say that wealth is not a factor? How many people would choose to share a bedsit with other people or not live in a house, where children could at least have their own bedroom and there were a number of bathrooms?

Ellianne

It maybe that multigenerational living is part of the problem in Leicester, but this is exactly how foreign families live, not just Asian. Didn't they establish that this was the reason why northern Italy was so badly affected by CV? Grandparents living in the family, sometimes aunts and uncles etc. The disease will naturally spread more quickly.

That said, the above has nothing to do with wealth. Across the road from our house in London there are 6 adults and 4 children. Whether it is a £million house or terraced property it is the living together under one roof that makes the spread worse. They choose this lifestyle and prefer it to living separately. It works for them, but in the current situation I do think they especially need to be more vigilant and adhere strictly to the lockdown rules.

No, they established no such thing about Italy, although the rumour mongerers on GN were speculating.

How do you explain the high infection rate in Barrow-in-Furness?

So your hairdresser goes to lots of different houses. She can't even sanitizer her surroundings!

That's your idea of a joke?

No wonder there's a problem.

Peardrop50

Listening to the Leicester mayor and wondering what he is paid for. He was waiting for local statistics from central government and was unaware of local outbreaks. Surely in a time of crisis local councillors would have their fingers on the pulse in their community and report regularly to the mayor, seems he was busy elsewhere.

No, they don't. How could they? They're not being given the data they need to make decisions. They wrote to the government a few weeks asking to be sent data.

It maybe that multigenerational living is part of the problem in Leicester, but this is exactly how foreign families live, not just Asian. Didn't they establish that this was the reason why northern Italy was so badly affected by CV? Grandparents living in the family, sometimes aunts and uncles etc. The disease will naturally spread more quickly.

That said, the above has nothing to do with wealth. Across the road from our house in London there are 6 adults and 4 children. Whether it is a £million house or terraced property it is the living together under one roof that makes the spread worse. They choose this lifestyle and prefer it to living separately. It works for them, but in the current situation I do think they especially need to be more vigilant and adhere strictly to the lockdown rules.

Our border should have been policed weeks ago its not political its a public health issue When Foot and Mouth was rampant we policed the border for essential traffic and that should have been the case now.
We've been doing well after a shaky start when Nicola Sturgeon followed Boris' dodgy "scientific advice" thats the advice the "scientists" at the briefings wouldn't endorse!

Since we've had our own advisory panels its gone much better and the figures are heading the right way .That how we would prefer it to stay and the tourists or "returning natives" should stay where they are for the forseeable future

The local Mayor needs to be informed about the number of cases in the area. They can't depend on 'hearing about it' from locals or pick the knowledge out of thin air. Of course he didn't realise there was a serious outbreak until he got the government data. 2 weeks late....

Now, if the government had used Local authorities' expertise in tracing contacts the Mayor would have known about the outbreak a great deal earlier.

Illte, you're making assumptions and I resent it. I have a mobile hairdresser. We have known each other a long while and are both intelligent and mature people. For instance I am sure we would wear a mask before opening the front door to a neighbour rather than not answer or talk through the window. Don't be surprised if she never speaks to you again and probably coughed as a joke.

There is a difference between stating cultural facts vis racist comments. I live in a part of Leicestershire where I am part of the ethnic MINORITY. In Leicester we have made cultural diversity work, we have had to. Certainly, we have had our problems but we have a lot to offer each other.

I shouldn't have opened the window.
That's twice I've let someone over rule my gut instinct.

At the beginning of June a relative asked to pay a garden visit. I said yes though I was uneasy about it. She seemed so relaxed and confident it was OK. Two days later she had a cough and a positive test result.

You have no idea how stressful it was waiting to see if I'd caught it. And now I've let politeness and social pressure put me back there!

Listening to the Leicester mayor and wondering what he is paid for. He was waiting for local statistics from central government and was unaware of local outbreaks. Surely in a time of crisis local councillors would have their fingers on the pulse in their community and report regularly to the mayor, seems he was busy elsewhere.

My son and his family live in Leicester, they think they had the virus in April but can't be sure. When lockdown was eased they went out to support local business by buying food and drink from kiosks and doing some non essential shopping. Granddaughter was allowed a few friends to her birthday party in the garden. Local grandma joined their bubble, such as it was. Now they're locking down again and wonder why.

Illte

Just trawling through the various posts on gransnet you'll see that loads of people are mixing with friends and family. Lots of hugs and it was worth it. Lots of encouragement from others - "go for it."

Believing that it's someone else who's responsible means that people still aren't taking responsibility for their own behaviour.

Ive just been visited by a neighbour who was rather put out that I wouldn't open the door to her and talked through a window. I opened it a fraction because she couldn't hear me and then she coughed!

That's me on edge for the next week!

Well, we must all “do what feels right to our own common sense now” mustn’t we?

It’s bonkers how many people say that, and then get upset that other people are doing the same thing.

Well trigger, you're prepared to take the risk with the hair appointment.
Lots of different clients, one after the other, all going back to families, work, friends.
It's not much different to seeing your mates in a car park really.

Just trawling through the various posts on gransnet you'll see that loads of people are mixing with friends and family. Lots of hugs and it was worth it. Lots of encouragement from others - "go for it."

Believing that it's someone else who's responsible means that people still aren't taking responsibility for their own behaviour.

Ive just been visited by a neighbour who was rather put out that I wouldn't open the door to her and talked through a window. I opened it a fraction because she couldn't hear me and then she coughed!

That's me on edge for the next week!

timetogo2016

Spot on JenniferEccles.
We went through Leicester a year or so ago and it was mainly asians living there.

Walsall will be next.
And before i get accused of being racist by some,let me tell you that is far from the truth as i am stating a fact.

.....people can “state facts” AND still be racist.

It’s not mutually exclusive

There are so many reasons why Leicester is in lockdown. If you lived here you would know why. Primarily young people socialising outside of takeaways, carparks. Eid could have been an issue. Police, ambulances etc try their best but dealing with large groups is not easy. It's depressing. Just hoping I can hold on to my hair appointment but I doubt it.

tigerfangran

What do you expect when the mayor visits and does odd jobs for his girlfriend (the other side if town) and stays the night during lockdown.No one has stuck to the rules so we all have to suffer.

Are you seriously suggesting that Soulsby deliberately infected Leicester residents? This is a "non sequitur".

4allweknow

My son does not live near Leicester. He does have an Asian family live nearby. Every Thursday when the "clap for NhS" was ongoing he we t outside and found the Asian family of 4 children and two adults had at least 10 people outside. One evening he had a quick count of 13. He called over he thought they must be having a party in a joking way. The response he got was 'oh I know, they just won't stay away'. Apply this approach to lifestyle up and down the country and of course hot spots will develop. We need strict testing of all arriving in the UK and compulsory isolation not the let's hope people follow the rules. And of course, as in Germany everyone tested to find those who carry with virus without knowing and follow up on their contacts. No if buts and maybe's strict policies with penalties if not followed.

And it's just Asian families who have ignored social distancing, is it?

BTW Are they Chinese, Indian, Pakistani, Bangladesi, Malay ...? Asia is a big continent.

MayBee70

Illte; please can I reassure you that I didn't mention the flights due to racism of any kind on my part. Right from the start of the pandemic it was obvious that BAME people were disproportionately affected by covid, especially in the NHS but [as Maw pointed out] it seemed to be ignored for fear of it appearing racist/politically incorrect. It just reminded me of the way this country allowed Italians to enter from known hotspots right at the start of the pandemic and lessons did not appear to have been learned from it. Dr John Campbell is still convinced that BAME need to be given VitD supplements as a protection but this is still something being largely ignored in this country. It's beyond me that people from anywhere are still flying into the country without proper checks and I, too will be self isolating way into the future and not seeing my children or grandchildren, even outside in gardens. By doing so I hope to protect both myself and others. But we can't let political correctness get in the way of protecting people. Certain things have to be eliminated to get to the bottom of these outbreaks. Meat processing plants have been hotspots throughout the world; I do hope that they are being studied carefully.

No! There was actually a report on it, which has been ignored by the government. Kemi Badenoch, the Equality Minister, is supposed to be investigating. However, she stood up in Parliament and said nobody knew enough about the causes of the excess deaths. She flatly denies racism in the UK. She happens to be my MP and I know she also thinks the poor are responsible for their own circumstances.

So it's not race nor poverty which has caused excess deaths. What is it? Not surprisingly, the report into excess BAME Covid deaths seems to be still in her inbox.