Is our PM, infallible and free of any blame?

Petunia I wish I'd had the eloquence to write what you have. Yes, they are largely private concerns, so I am not entirely sure why the government was 'charged' with supplying their PPE. Shouldn't they have obtained that themselves - once it became widely available of course, and checked out how to use it. I think headlines saying that Johnson 'blamed' Care Homes are somewhat inflammatory. Surely, he is saying that they should have learned how to use it properly ... as should anyone taking on the responsibility of caring for vulnerable people in a horrible situation. I am amazed that they did not know how, particularly as there have been many instances of other infections diseases in Care Homes (Norovirus for example) which have had to be dealt with - don't they require PPE. I know that it was worn on several occasions when my parents resided in a Care Home when infection necessitated it. These are vulnerable people for heavens sake - irrespective of Covid19.

That doesn't mean that I am denigrating any of the staff who work in Care Homes. Both my parents lived in one for several months and the care there was exemplary and, above all, safe. We were lucky - the owners took it upon themselves to ensure that all staff were thoroughly trained in all aspects of caring for very vulnerable people.

Having said that, of course the discharge of untested people from hospital to Care Homes is appalling and that needs to be thoroughly investigated.

Why blame Boris/government ? It's management who run care homes. Aren't they supposed to know the ins and outs of a pandemic or don't their qualifications include any medical knowledge ?

GrannyGravy13 I think the invasiveness of the test is why they have gone for testing every four weeks for residents. I can't imagine it's easy, especially if it's someone with dementia of some sort.

I hope they are looking for an easier to administer test as a lot could happen in four weeks.

Goodness, three posts following one another suggesting we do away with rules - or is it do away with government? I can't decide if they are far-right or simply nihilistic. Thank you Petunia, OurKid1, EllanVannin; I will watch with interest if this is what we face. Government has no responsibility for those things that they have been responsible for in the past, it seems. Interesting times if that's the case.

Just an afterthought. If government and Johnson bear no responsibility for anything why do you vote for anyone at a GE? Perhaps you don't. Who knows if this "no blame government" is a new movement. It could be.

Just a quick reminder for those who are quick to blame care homes for accepting covid19 positive patients from hospitals: in this region there have been reports of several who have been told that the patient is covid19 clear, only to find out later that this is not the case, I assume this is not only where I live. Also, many homes were left with no alternative but to accept patients back from hospital as the big clear out for covid 19 patients started. As I said before, no doubt some care homes got it wrong, but the government certainly did not get it right, so much for all pulling together in a crisis eh?

Boris isn't responsible for every person in this country to do the right thing, each and every one of us is responsible for our own health and well-being. For the vulnerable in nursing homes and hospitals these people rely heavily on the staff who look after them.

Under normal conditions some nursing/residential homes are better than others but it 's never been called to question as to why this is so ? The same with hospitals, some have had more deaths than others, were there any questions asked ?
Is there an on-going debate about why so many blacks have died during this pandemic ? Is Boris going to take the wrap for that as well ?

Doubt Boris will end up taking the rap for anything. He seems to have such a devoted following

EllanVannin

Boris isn't responsible for every person in this country to do the right thing, each and every one of us is responsible for our own health and well-being. For the vulnerable in nursing homes and hospitals these people rely heavily on the staff who look after them.

Under normal conditions some nursing/residential homes are better than others but it 's never been called to question as to why this is so ? The same with hospitals, some have had more deaths than others, were there any questions asked ?
Is there an on-going debate about why so many blacks have died during this pandemic ? Is Boris going to take the wrap for that as well ?

I don't think anyone has suggested Johnson was responsible for every person in this country to do the right thing EllanVannin. Let's face it, he would hardly be a role model for that would he. But there seems to be the suggestion from some that governments are not responsible for the law, for keeping us safe, or for anything if they are Conservative. I say this because I can't see those who are saying this putting the same argument forward if they were not.

Planning for a pandemic was on everyone's list and they did the best they could but apparently you don't expect it of our government. All we can hope is that this ends up in court and they have to try and explain themselves legally. I wouldn't envy anyone representing Johnson. Not unless I could ensure he wouldn't open his mouth.

I wouldn't be surprised if some Care Owners sued him. They should. They truly should. I would help pay the lawyers and so, no doubt would a lot who have lost loved ones. If the people turn against him he can hardly do the trick of calling the Courts "the enemy of the people" again can he.

The problem with running on a populist ticket is when you become unpopular and "we ain't seen nothing yet".

Where's the management of these care homes ? Why don't they show their faces ? Why leave it to the staff who run these places-----because half the time the management can't be contacted ! Simply because a lot of these places are running on a shoe-string and rely on low paid staff to juggle with the running of them.

If Boris zJohnson isn’t responsible for all the people in the UK does that mean it’s the people of New Zealand that are responsible for the country eliminating the virus and not their PM/government?

Why is it that some of these homes have been virus-free ? Answer that GGumteenth, you seem to know everything else.

Maybee. Good point !

EllanVannin

Where's the management of these care homes ? Why don't they show their faces ? Why leave it to the staff who run these places-----because half the time the management can't be contacted ! Simply because a lot of these places are running on a shoe-string and rely on low paid staff to juggle with the running of them.

They have been all over the television. They did what the government told them to do. How does that make it their fault?

MayBee70

If Boris zJohnson isn’t responsible for all the people in the UK does that mean it’s the people of New Zealand that are responsible for the country eliminating the virus and not their PM/government?

Quite right MayBee. I don't understand this current thinking that Johnson is above criticism.

People are basically reading the headline "Is our PM, infallible and free of any blame?" and saying yes.

EllanVannin

Why is it that some of these homes have been virus-free ? Answer that GGumteenth, you seem to know everything else.

As far as I know where I live, the ones that have been virus free have two main differences: (1) they only accept private clients therefore are not bullied by local authorities telling them that they have to take residents back after a period in hospital whether or not they have been tested for covid19 and (2) they closed down when most of Europe did, ie. at least two weeks before our government advised the same.

How can it be Boris's fault, I asked GGumteenth.

How come some care homes were virus-free, I asked.

EllanVannin

How can it be Boris's fault, I asked GGumteenth.

How come some care homes were virus-free, I asked.

Sadly that wasn't all you said was it EllanVannin.

I am waiting to hear from GNHQ how I should reply to Answer that GGumteenth, you seem to know everything else. after their recent guidelines.

The recent decision to test weekly staff and residents sadly has an exception and that is Agency Staff.
So Agency Staff will quite likely work at more than one Care Home and never be tested.
That is a very careless decision and can lead to more infections.

Go ahead and report me GGumteenth. It wouldn't surprise me if you're using another name from the last time you reported me ! I'm not stupid.

That doesn't seem very thought out, does it pinkquartz. That would seem to cover carers going from home to home too.

Maybe Cumming herd immunity is still in place but that makes me feel that it will entail the killing off of the older part of the herd.

I remember your style of posting.

EllanVannin I did not report you. I asked a question of GNHQ. Everyone - with the possible exception of you - knows exactly who I am. We have talked about it on other threads. I'm not hiding anything.

So if care homes are inadeqate and providing unaceptable levels of care whose fault is that? Well it is of course the Tory government, who were warned in 2019 that standards were slipping, but who continued to underfund the care sector.
Private firms have increased their domination of care home places over the past few years while the government has repeatedly cut core funding to councils for social care. While Whitehall spending has grown in recent years, the £21.3bn it gave to councils last year was £700m less than the £22bn it put into social care in 2010-11.
So if the response to the pandemic was inadequate it was predictable. No matter which way you look at it it is Boris's responsibility.
Whole article here www.theguardian.com/society/2019/sep/19/84-of-care-home-beds-in-england-owned-by-private-firms
But then look at Boris's record of denying responsibiliy for anything.

What is government for if it’s not to keep the population safe? If it’s all down to individuals then what’s the purpose of government? Maybe one of you who talk about the nanny state could answer that? Why should care homes be money making businesses? Shouldn’t they be about caring for the most vulnerable?