Whilst the concentration is on the control of covid, what about the many thousands of people whose lives are at risk from other illnesses like heart disease, cancer and strokes?
It’s already feared that many lives have been lost due to the cessation of treatment or simply the fact that people have been too scared to go to hospital for a diagnosis or treatment.
These people shouldn’t be ignored, but I fear that is what is happening.
Could we have the situation where more people die of other illnesses than covid?
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We need action now as we have the benefit of hindsight
(105 Posts)I fervently hope that Johnson will take the SAGE advise and introduce measures immediately.
He left it too lat last time with the result of thousand more deaths than necessary.
We can’t afford to dither, we have no test and trace system the only positive thing we can do is to introduce another form of lockdown.
I’ve recently read an article that claimed that almost all countries have ended up in the same place irrespective of whether they did/didn’t have lockdown.
Japan had no lockdown but came through no worse off than any other country and that even in war-torn Yemen, cases had fallen dramatic by June despite almost no precautions being able to take place.
Our lockdown was initially to protect the NHS. I hope we’ve got our ducks all lined up now in that respect now ?so I suppose we need to consider what the aim of a further lockdown would be.
It seems unlikely that we’ll be able to eliminate the virus entirely in the short term because each time a lockdown is eased, it will surge again. We do have the benefit now of knowing a lot more about the illness and who is most affected so maybe we need to concentrate on protecting those people whilst allowing others to take up a near-as-possible life again and also to prevent an excess of people from dying from non-Covid conditions and also suffering from MH problems caused by prolonged lockdowns.
Thank you Urmstongran for letting us know the situation in Spain. Anyone would think we were the only country struggling with Covid and trying to work out what to do to protect the economy, at the same time as trying to stop the spread.
This government hasn't always made the right decisions but I feel it's damned if it does and damned if it doesn't.
There are no rule books, no instructions, no rights and wrongs.
Children need to be at school, businesses need to be able to open but everyone needs to do their bit and follow the rules.
Bluebelle, I am in total agreement with your posts. I really fail to understand how any sort of general lockdown can help. Yes, it may lower the infections figures temporarily - but as soon is it ceases then the figures will rise again.
In the meanwhile, the damage to the general economy and the serious damage to so many families personal economies and plans and hopes for the future worsens beyond measure.
How many extra deaths from lack of cancer treatments, too late treatments for many other illnesses, from depression brought on by lockdown and financial crashes, just increase and increase.
Yes, those who feel themselves at serious risk from this particular illness should be the ones to lockdown (assuming they can without loss of jobs, etc), and let the rest of the country, particularly the children and younger generations get on with their lives,.
A scientist (?) I heard recently said that lockdown buys time and in that time we need to learn to adjust our behaviour, not only where it can be legally enforced but how we actually choose to behave - ie social distancing, handwashing, face covering, observation of maximum numbers meeting regs and good hygiene .
I genuinely believe that the Great British public thought that 6 or at the most 12 weeks of lockdown would somehow see the virus pass over us, like the Angel of Death at Passover. You wonder where they thought it would go?
Are you still there? What would happen if they lock down- as you probably are over your 90 days allowed.
Madrid is struggling. One third of all cases in Spain are there. 11,000 cases in Spain today. The government don’t know what to do. Lockdown or no?
It’s not just the UK.
I am inclined to follow the scientists.
Sweden is a one off and no other country as far as I know has followed their line.
Most countries seem far more confident about lockdown and their economy as their economies are fundamentally sound with nothing ahead to worry about once a vaccine comes through, but the U.K. has brexit and the instability that is going to cause and the lack of confidence by the world in our economy.
We’ve done lockdown but can’t do it forever. I’m in the NE and were again on local lockdown but can go to work but not see our families utterly miserable work home back to work not much of a life but still here.
I agree about Sweden and it’s what we have done every time there’s been a pandemic before (and there have been at least two others in most of our lifetimes not counting AIDS, SARS, Mers annual flu etc etc )
We have to keep going and those that are weak or ill stay away from danger and the younger fitter who are less at risk keep going Every time we lockdown when we come out it will be there waiting to bite us again we have to hold out against it till it wears itself out or dilutes it seems to have worked well in Sweden the only country to not act in fear they could have got it wrong but seems their bravery paid off it all makes sense to me There will be casualties but there will be huge casualties of other major illnesses , mental health, suicides, Poverty
We cannot lockdown for ever We have to learn to fight it amongst it
There are some excellent articles about what's happening as we concentrate on Covid
*Experts fear that deaths from illnesses such as cholera could far exceed those from Covid-19 itself
Across the globe, patients have reported being denied cancer care, kidney dialysis and urgent transplant surgeries, with sometimes fatal results. In the Balkans, women have been driven to try dangerous, experimental abortions themselves, while experts in the UK have reported a rise in DIY dentistry, as people turn to toe-curling improvisations involving chewing gum, wire-cutters, and superglue. Panic-hoarding of the drug hydroxychloroquin, which is normally used to treat malaria and autoimmune conditions, and has recently been found to increase deaths from Covid-19, has led to shortages. *
Why most Covid deaths won't be from the virus
www.bbc.com/future/article/20200528-why-most-covid-19-deaths-wont-be-from-the-virus
Whitewavemark2
The Oxford doctor who works in one of the London ICUs has tweeted that they have gone from no Covid patients to 11 in a week.
Yes, and I'm sure more will be hospitalised soon.
But how long do we lockdown for?
This isn't going to disappear even if we all stay in on our homes
Sorry about the not so good link but it backs up Wizend’s post.
The Oxford doctor who works in one of the London ICUs has tweeted that they have gone from no Covid patients to 11 in a week.
What sort of lockdown would be best?
My area is going into lockdown from Tuesday.
Schools will stay open. Most people will be going to work.
To be honest I'm not sure what this lockdown means
Six people. No mixing of households.
My daughter in law is a Primary School teacher. No masks. So basically mixing with 30 households. And of course the other teachers. She has a young daughter in another school who is mixing with 30 children.
I don't know what can be done.
I have 2 relatives who work for the NHS and as yet their hospitals have very few covid patients.
I have no clue what is best but I do know that people are dying of other things due to covid and that's a worry. People can't get to see their GPs. They are scared to go to A&E. Heart patients. Stroke victims. People aren't being diagnosed with cancer. Suicide rates have gone up.
I'm rambling but I don't know what is the best thing we can do.
A much stricter lockdown than we had didn’t stop a major second wave in Spain.
Maybe Sweden has it right, get on much as normal and hope for herd immunity.
The fact is, nobody knows how best to handle this beast - we’re in uncharted waters.
The scientist said that the government never followed scientific advise (whatever they said) .
Perhaps if they had done we wouldn’t be in such a mess.
We locked down to try to manage the level of infection so that the nhs would not be overwhelmed.
If we want to assist the nhs then we will have to do the same again.
They have had months to get the T&T system up and running. I understand you need a QR code to take to any test centre to prove you have an appointment. What if you don’t have a smart phone or don’t know about QR codes?
Listening to Any Questions/Any Answers today it seems that without much more local data people included such as those in rural Northumberland have every right to feel aggrieved.
I’ve been thinking about the statistical information we are given. Perhaps I’m a cynic in thinking that tests have been so difficult to obtain for some whilst others seem to have little problem. It seems to me that only the north of the country has been hit by additional lockdowns whilst the South East seems to be relatively “safe”. Does anyone know what the actual figures are, not just the modelled figures?
Finding information that is very specific seems rather problematic, at least for me. I’d like to see figures across the UK, broken down so that comparisons across the country could be made by the public more easily. The government appears to have no strategy whatsoever.
What I do believe is that the older you get the more severe the impact will be if you contract the virus. For anyone who has health issues such as heart disease, diabetes or a compromised immune system there is at greater risk of severe illness or death. Overweight people are also more at risk. Younger people generally speaking are at far less risk and many people are asymptomatic.
I expect limited lockdown will be imposed across the whole country in the not too distant future with social activities being curtailed whilst businesses, schools etc. will remain open. I have grave doubts as to how successful this will be.
It would be good to see some proactive leadership rather than this haphazard approach.
Wholeheartedly agree with you BlueBelle
The female SAGE professor ( I didn’t get her name) when asked if we should put health before the economy said that it was a non-choice.
Unless we get a grip which she said we haven’t yet, the economy will never have the confidence of a stable future.
She said that the test and trace should have helped get our infection rate as close to zero as possible during the summer, but T&T never got off the ground so we didn’t stand a cats chance in hell ( she didn’t actually say that) and so we should act immediately as it will be disastrous if we don’t.
I agree with BlueBelle, we can't risk another lockdown. We need to carry on as best we can, assess our own risks and take all the precautions we can.
Health, education, economy all closely linked. All have to be considered as a whole.
Blimey ^suziewoozie* I agree with you ?♀️
As my grandma used to say, it’s being so cheerful that keeps me going. ?
I just think we’re completely and utterly stuffed. Not a hope in hell of avoiding unmitigated.economic, health and personal disaster. It’s already clear that next year’s public exams need a rethink before we get to June and they whinge about hindsight being a wonderful thing.
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