All eyes now turn to Brexit.

Nobody has been ‘duped’ it’s a laughable assertion by remainers who just can’t get over leaving the EU.
Am sure it must be hard for a few posters, the political party they hate has been in government for just about forever and they were on the losing side in the referendum as well.
It’s time for their big boy pants perhaps.

lemongrove

What nonsense.
Musicians managed their careers perfectly well before we ever entered the EU, and they will do so again.

Read the thread, lemon.

Stop telling us about how people managed 40 years ago. It isn't applicable today when so much has been closely integrated with the single market and freedom of movement.

It is very boring. Especially as no Leaver has ever been able to tell us how it is going to improve everyone's lives.

lemongrove

Yes whitewave I do think... and you merely litter your posts with Trump references as a sort of sneery insult to anyone who votes differently to yourself, including in the referendum.
Our time in the EU is over, and I give a sigh of relief.
It’s been a good year politically: Corbyn gone, leaving the EU and Trump gone in the US.?

It is no good getting insulting. It never works with me I’m afraid. I never rise to the bait.

But yes I do think there are many people who voted leave now regret their decision - there is evidence to prove that.

They understand how they were duped, just like many republicans who voted for Biden.

What nonsense.
Musicians managed their careers perfectly well before we ever entered the EU, and they will do so again.

As the poster above says, I voted leave and no regrets whatsoever.

I can only assume that the 'no regrets' Leavers will not be affected in any way by the difficulties facing thousands of people and businesses who trade with, or work, between the UK and the EU.

People like the musicians in the thread I posted, which I doubt if any Leavers have bothered to read, because it is just too boring reading the whinges of people whose lives and livelihoods have been adversely affected by the 'win' that we're all supposed to 'get over'.

The lack of any sympathy ( or is it a complete failure to understand?) whatsoever for the people whose lives they have, in some cases, ruined by their vote has been very marked over the past four years.

Yes whitewave I do think... and you merely litter your posts with Trump references as a sort of sneery insult to anyone who votes differently to yourself, including in the referendum.
Our time in the EU is over, and I give a sigh of relief.
It’s been a good year politically: Corbyn gone, leaving the EU and Trump gone in the US.?

I’m impressed someone knows 17 million people personally.
Wow!

David Davies said many things ( perhaps he even believed them) most intelligent people realised that it would be an uphill battle but would be worth it in the end.

lemongrove

No whitewave....however much you like to drop those little asides about Trump into just about any situation, this has nothing at all to do with Trump, the US or Trump supporters.

You think?

varian

The problem is that many, if not all Leave voters, like Ttump voters, were charged up on an emotional level and it is so much part of their identity, that they find it hard to acknowledge the truth, that they believed a load of lies and they cling on by their fingernails in the face of evidence.

What a load of c**p
17 million voters ......all charged up and emotional?Dear oh dear varian

And to think that David Davies the first Brexit secretary to be appointed said as he left for the first "we are leaving" meeting with the EU negotiators "these will be the easiest negotiations ever concluded.

The EU was going to fall apart in the rush to do a deal with us. Now, what happened to that prediction I wonder.

No whitewave....however much you like to drop those little asides about Trump into just about any situation, this has nothing at all to do with Trump, the US or Trump supporters.

biba70

it is quite nice talking among ourselves, isn't it

Well, it’s certainly what you appear to want.....no dissenting voices, just those who add to your own view that all is woe and thrice woe!?
Never mind....soon be over, and we will have left either with or without a deal. As the poster above says, I voted leave and no regrets whatsoever.

Kandinsky

I voted leave. No regrets whatsoever.

Just like Trump supporters

I voted leave. No regrets whatsoever.

Said on the news just now that nothing had been done regarding brexit in the past week. Too busy fighting amongst themselves. Still we’re constantly being told that a deal will not happen until the very last minute and we’ve got how many days left??

The problem is that many, if not all Leave voters, like Ttump voters, were charged up on an emotional level and it is so much part of their identity, that they find it hard to acknowledge the truth, that they believed a load of lies and they cling on by their fingernails in the face of evidence.

They sold it as the need to keep immigrants out, but in fact it has actually affected and taken rights away from millions of U.K. citizens both in their leisure and work.

People like ug will directly affected. I assume she will be back soon? I think she said November when someone asked her.

For an explanation of the effect on musicians see this long thread by Howard Goodall

(it's a bit mixed up with comments but keep scrolling for the whole explanation)

twitter.com/Howard_Goodall/status/1326554091401613314

Yes I think it is becoming easier to understand the psyche of the leave voter, and what drove them to inflict such harm on the country.

The government must address this, just as must be done in the USA.

As rosecarmel said on another thread, the harm done over past decades needs to be unpacked and repacked in a way that there is greater fairness and less grinding generational poverty.

Without this recognition, there will be even more willingness to vote for greater extremes. We’ve seen it in Trump and Brexit and the harm it does.

I am hopeful that Biden understands this with his agenda of inclusiveness. We are still stuck in the mire with the pigs and their snouts firmly embedded, but it can’t last for ever.

There is one positive. And that is that other EU countries, seeing the mess that we’re in have stepped back from the anti EU feeling that had started to spread through them. And this has been echoed in America with the defeat of Trump.

Don’t think there are any positives. What an all round disaster. I feel sorry for young folk who will lose out being able to travel, be educated and get European jobs.

It is a bit of an echo chamber Biba70 but it won't be long before we get there is no point in discussing it, we have been over it again and again and that old favourite it would have been worse under Corbyn . So, anyone reading this like to make the case for positives?

it is quite nice talking among ourselves, isn't it

It is now apparent to anyone who reads a newpaper, or watches the news, or has a relative working in the car industry or finance.....this is going to be an absolute disaster if it goes ahead. There are absolutely no positives and I find it really disturbing to live in a country with a Home Secretary who celebrates the fact that we cannot go where we want, when we want, and for how long we want, why is this to be applauded? Has anyone read the implications for musicians and associated staff? Catastrophic.