Who are the Working Class these days?

It would seem that many in this thread are stating and comparing what were the working class in their youth with what are the working class today which I feel are two totally different working environments. I left school in the 1960s at a time when there were more jobs around than there were people to fill them. Therefore on leaving school I found employment consisted of secure jobs on guaranteed hours with such things as agency working and zero hours contracts not even allowed under the law. Today it is totally different with very many now working on the above contracts and Gig Economy terms of employment for agencies which are engaged to supply workers to workplace sites so companies that run and own those sites do not have to take on any responsibility for those worker whatsoever.

It is such places as the huge distribution centres that supply the supermarkets and online retail industry that have replaced Britain's heavy industry were employment was guaranteed and well paid and were workers could easily become trade union organised to protect there terms and conditions.

The new distribution centres employ similar numbers to the old factories, but workers find it near impossible to organise to better their employment conditions as many different agencies may have workers employed in them and the anti trade union legislation makes it so that even your employer becoming aware that you are a member of a trade union can swiftly see you out the door.

In those places are to be found Britain's working class of today. They are on no guarantees of pay or hours, or when those hours may start or when those hours may finish from day to day. Many are trying to maintain families and homes on those terms with growing numbers from rural areas sleeping in vans around those centres as that is the only way enough hours can be found at reasonable rates of pay to maintain there homes and families.

That is today's modern working Britain and the true working class within it.

I don't particularly see it as a traditional 'class' thing. It's more about belief systems and core values. The LP represents my belief systems and core values more than any of the other parties nationally.
The Unions aren't the power they once were. We no longer have the manufacturing, engineering, ship building, mining etc industries. We also no longer have closed shops and many people choose not to join the Union (whilst being very happy to enjoy the benefits the Unions obtain for them)
Young people are more likely to vote Labour, which I think has always been the case. If the LP does split it will be interesting to see whether the Union or the socially democratic group gets most support.
I fear a split may condemn this country to even longer tory misrule.

I’m another who feels that the British obsession with class is a problem. It is assumed that anyone who has ‘done well’ but supports Labour is some sort of hypocrite, which is ridiculous. Look at the people who bang on about Kier Starmer’s peerage.

As has been said, party support is based on one’s morals and beliefs. There are various loaded ways to describe these, but I will try to be neutral and suggest that they boil down to individualism versus State provision.

I see no conflict between people having a decent job and their own home whilst wanting equal opportunities for all.

The need for Trade Union support is not the preserve of the unskilled either. Anyone who works for anyone else should remember that the conditions of service they now enjoy had to be fought for in the past, and may have to be again if we take our collective eye off the ball.

Well if the Labour Party splits, that’s the Tories in power. - ad infinitum.

There are going to be thousands out of work and what about the latest scandal of people being evicted because they've lost jobs and can't pay the rent or mortgage ?
Where are their Labour councillors and what do they propose doing to help these people ?

I grew up in council house but have always owned my own property since I first got married. I suppose I am working class as I work for a living. My kids went to university as did I during my 30s. Yes, our generation moved up the social ladder from our parents, but it's not about how much money you have. It's all to do with wanting everyone to be treated equally and fairly. These have always been Labour's principles. Margaret Thatcher stopped people thinking this way and brought in an "I'm alright Jack society and sod everyone else" and unfortunately it's these people who vote Tory and no longer consider themselves working class.

It’s an interesting question Fennel, I’m not sure that the Trade Unions would have enough support to develop their own party, as so many people now have portfolio careers without relying on union support, hence falling membership. I think Labour is the party of choice now for the thinking younger people, who tend to be more socially aware than our generation, and aspire for a fairer society. They are reforming at the moment, and their credibility is rising - maybe they will change their name?

Well, paddyanne, you certainly don't hear much noise coming from Labour these days with poverty as it stands.

The divisions and inequalities in this country are positively obscene Dinahmo.
At least with a communist government you know where you stand. This country is neither one thing nor the other with the worst being those who jumped from Labour to Conservative if they had a bit of a windfall. I've met them too, obnoxious individuals.

EV my grandparents were property owning socialists too,my Granny was one of the first women members of the Labour party and a suffragette .She fought hard for workers rights ,she demonstrated against unfair rents ,she worked for and with those who needed help ,They were comfortably off but they often took in people who had nothing and helped them find a home and a job .My granny was born in 1888.

Unless you have inherited wealth and live off investment income, you are worker whether you are a school cook, a nurse, a doctor or the owner of a large business.

Back in the late 70s/early 80s when post war babies were young adults the Labour Party was still talking as though the majority of workers were down trodden. They hadn't recognised that we wanted more out of life and, as Fennel says, we had become aspirational.

I do think that Thatcher, with the sale of council housing, is indirectly responsible for the present state of the country (well, pre-covid) if for no other reason than preventing the councils to build more houses with the proceeds from the sale of their housing stocks.

When I was about 6 my parents moved from London to Dorset and got a council house - probably post war, but I'm not sure of that. I don't know how they managed it but I assume that it wasn't difficult. During my school years some of my contemporaries were from poorer backgrounds and some from better off but it's not something I was aware off.

I also think that Thatcher was partly responsible for the change in peoples' attitudes. I remember in the early eighties, one of my friends who was a deputy in a south London primary school, talking about some of the parents who would threaten teachers and sometimes physically harm them, because their child had been told off.

The UK is a strange place I think. The divisions in society seem to be worse than those in other European countries. Tens of thousands of people have donated to various charitable sources this year and there are countless stories of people helping others. But there are also examples of huge greed and destructive behaviour. I don't know what the answer is.

No, they're not EV. Socialists believe in an equal society that supports it's poorer or more vulnerable members. You don't have to be poor to believe in that.

I'm working class ,always have been even though I've run my own businesses since I was 21 .If you WORK for a living you're working class in my eyes .People who hang their hat on being middle class or UPPER middle class are a bit of a joke to me .I've had socialist principles all my life treat people fairly , do what I can for the old the sick the vulnerable

.People who hit hard times,shouldn't be looked down on but helped ,would rather my tax went to folk who need help than into Bojo or Reece Moggs pockets ..or to a greedy monarchy thats happy to pocket millions when there are people including forces veterans on the streets .

Class is divisive and is meant to be that way ,the old two Ronnies sketch shows it very well ,forelock tugging is so medieval though and having an Empire "honour" to make youfeel superior is beyond belief in the 21st century.

All manual workers. I come from the first generation of professionals from both sides of the family.

The semantics are all wrong.

My working class parents and grandparents were all property owning Labour supporters. Grandmother was born in 1890.

I also forgot the two cars in the fronts of these council houses.
It's the Conservatives who have to flog themselves to death to keep up !

Those in my day who were Labour supporters didn't own properties, least of all their own, so how can it be classed as such when they're supposedly the underdogs of the economy by not owning anything ? Ownership and Labour shouldn't be in the same sentence so far as opposing governments go.

Labour supporters have done very well in a Conservative government, I know many who could buy and sell anyone especially those who bought MT's council houses and who now own a street of them. How/why do they call themselves Labour voters when they're raking it in ? It doesn't make sense as a Conservative means to conserve, which is what people with money do ? It's all arse about face if you ask me.

Oh, and don't forget the second homes etc.Labour ? you must be joking !

I don't get our politics at all.

Working class. I had a terrible state education and as a teacher, have seen state ed return to the deplorable state it was in during my childhood. I worked 3 jobs, including a shelf stacking night job, to put myself through university and also to do my post grad studies. I put my ability to do this down to the grit I developed during a poor childhood, certainly not to opportunities provided by the Conservative govt in power who were responsible for decimating state ed.

I own property and am comfortable, but despite it all, am a firm Labour voting, working class socialist.

If you work and are not gentry your working class!

EllanVannin

Members of both parties are very wealthy, some already were in their own right so if it's money that's divisory there's no contest really is there ? What is then the point of having Labour AND Conservative.

But it's not the money that's divisive, is it?

It's about values and beliefs in the best way to run the country.

Tories and Labour have quite different beliefs, even centrist Labour do.

But we have to remember that most people are quite conservative (small 'c') in their views.

I think it's time we stopped being so flipping class conscious; for a start, it leads to stereotyping and pigeonholing people.

Members of both parties are very wealthy, some already were in their own right so if it's money that's divisory there's no contest really is there ? What is then the point of having Labour AND Conservative.

Sorry, Bluebelle, John Prescott declared in 1997 that
"We are all middle class now"

I was going to add that we're all working class in one way or another. Even landed gentry aren't what they used to be. It's only the Queen with her billions that can say that she isn't.

If the Labour Party split Bluebelle, which 'bit' would you see yourself closest to? Genuine question!