Heartless Britain - will attitudes ever change?

Adult population of the UK around 50 million.
Survey sample size 2226.
Of course, silly me, it must be representative.

Chardy

Total sample size was 2,226 adults. Fieldwork was undertaken between 11th - 12th November 2020. The survey was carried out online. The figures have been
weighted and are representative of GB adults (aged 18+) with respect to vote in the 2019 general election and EU referendum, age, gender, education level, attention paid to politics and region.
I think if a professor, 3 PhDs and a research assistant carried it out, then it has serious validity.

Let's read again what Chardy posted, and then suggest that it was just coincidence that nearly half of the people they asked think this way. Rather than think there are people like this in the world we should think the survey was so badly designed they didn't allow for that?
That would be completely unrealistic. We can't rubbish the survey just because the results make us uncomfortable.

I believe that coincidentally the survey picked some unpleasant people. Had they picked another group on a different day the survey may well have found some more generous people. That is the nature of a survey. Which is my point.

So the Kings College team either hunted out people with distasteful views, and skewed the survey to give them a voice, or they just made it all up. Which do you think it was?

Or could it perhaps be that there a minority of people out there who hold such extreme views that there are people on here that can't quite believe it?

Sorry I altered my final sentence and made a hash of it.
Should read
That is what I am talking about

The heading for the thread was ‘heartless Britain - will attitudes ever change’?
I do not believe that we are a heartless country. I believe that there are some heartless and selfish people but they are a minority and therefore I question the findings of this survey and surveys in general.
That is what I talking about on about.

Laura, what are you talking about? Really. I'm lost. Of course the opinions are distasteful. That's the point of this thread!

My lengthier post was about my opinion of experts and surveys in general.
I did read the particular report and find some of the opinion given quite distasteful. It does not reflect the opinion of anyone that I know but my post was in answer to some sneering that some people would dare to question a survey because ‘academics’ are involved.

No problem, VampireQueen, I think we are thinking the same way.

I’ve moved on now from “amazed” to “gobsmacked”. To see posters say that they don’t trust surveys, that they can only be the thoughts of the (few) people polled. When some other posters have gone to great lengths to explain the research methodology used and how the sampling process worked. And its Kings College, but someone digs up (Googles?) irrelevant facts and thinks they’ve found proof that they are untrustworthy.

Its fine to question surveys, but when someone has gone to the trouble of explaining to you why it’s a robust survey, to continue in doubting it shows a special kind of hubris. To complain its only those people’s opinions, when the survey is explicitly conceived, designed and published to tell you what people’s opinions are, is just beyond belief.

We truly are doomed, aren’t we?

Pantglas2

Well as I was the first responder on this, I’ll explain my initial thoughts just in case t’others are misunderstanding"

I don’t hold a great deal of faith in surveys per se. I always want to know the political leaning of the question setter and the purpose of the survey and even then I believe it can only be a survey of those polled. How can it be anything other?

I have a very broad church of friends, ex colleagues and family and I know that none of them believe that people lose their jobs because they’re useless in normal times let alone during this pandemic.

How many times have we seen surveys get things wrong, it’s just not an exact science. More like cooking than baking in my book.

Exactly.

No thanks teacher!

So you think the survey was flawed? Or do you think the responders were lying?

Read the 88 page report if you want to know the purpose of it and what the exact questions are. When you have, come back with your feedback.

eazybee

*it was written by Kings College Policy Institute in conjunction with the Institute for Fiscal Studies and UK in a Changing World. Pretty good credentials I would have thought*.
Would this be the same site as the one, King's College London, which sent out more than 1,000 emails from fictitious people worried about finances during the pandemic to MPs, consuming more than 650 hours of caseworkers time, to see if certain occupations and party affiliations had an impact on MPs' responses.
Professor Rosie Campbell. Professor of Politics, has apologised for 'misjudging' the impact on the workload.
Pretty good credentials??

That’s outrageous isn’t it?

It’s a survey, and the questions in all surveys are often skewed.
People may reasonably think ( with some evidence) that firms have taken the opportunity at times to get rid of problem/ unproductive workers by not keeping them on furlough during the pandemic.
People in the UK are amongst the kindest and helpful in the world I think, and their charity giving is extremely high.

Well as I was the first responder on this, I’ll explain my initial thoughts just in case t’others are misunderstanding"

I don’t hold a great deal of faith in surveys per se. I always want to know the political leaning of the question setter and the purpose of the survey and even then I believe it can only be a survey of those polled. How can it be anything other?

I have a very broad church of friends, ex colleagues and family and I know that none of them believe that people lose their jobs because they’re useless in normal times let alone during this pandemic.

How many times have we seen surveys get things wrong, it’s just not an exact science. More like cooking than baking in my book.

But Eloethan some people presumably do think like that. That's why the people who commissioned the survey were surprised.

I've now read much of the rest of the 88 page report and very little about it surprises me in the slightest because I've seen people come out with similar attitudes, including on GN.

PS. Some of them are even reacting as expected.

LauraNorder

growstuff

Which "pompous" posters claimed to be academics in social sciences?

I did not say ‘pompous poster’, I said pompous assumption.
I did not say any poster ‘claimed to be academics in social sciences’
The above is your interpretation of what I said, somewhat proving my point.

Oh really? Did you have a point? I missed it.

Eloethan

Dinahmo I can understand your disappointment at seeing these sorts of survey results. I feel the same sometimes. I imagine, though, that there are lots of people who do not take this sort of judgmental approach about others - and they are often the ones who have more experience, in their own lives and in the lives of those close to them, of hard times that have not been of their making.

Sadly, the misfortune of some people can be an ego booster for others, who smugly sit and think it could never happen to them because they are so invaluable to their employers. They might find they are mistaken.

I think it is really quite ridiculous to assume that people who lose their jobs do so because they are not capable - particularly at this time when, as the OP points out, many businesses cannot operate and are on the verge of bankruptcy.

Nobody so far has actually analysed the results or tried to explain them. They are results of a survey - just that. Maybe there was some kind of flaw with the survey methodology - I expect it will be checked before any conclusions are drawn.

I think it's quite amusing how defensive some people are. They would never think like that, of course!

Urmstongran

I’m with Pantglas, eazybee, NellG and LauraNorder on this issue. Well said ladies.
??

Why? What did they write which is so commendable?

I’m with Pantglas, eazybee, NellG and LauraNorder on this issue. Well said ladies.
??

Dinahmo I can understand your disappointment at seeing these sorts of survey results. I feel the same sometimes. I imagine, though, that there are lots of people who do not take this sort of judgmental approach about others - and they are often the ones who have more experience, in their own lives and in the lives of those close to them, of hard times that have not been of their making.

Sadly, the misfortune of some people can be an ego booster for others, who smugly sit and think it could never happen to them because they are so invaluable to their employers. They might find they are mistaken.

I think it is really quite ridiculous to assume that people who lose their jobs do so because they are not capable - particularly at this time when, as the OP points out, many businesses cannot operate and are on the verge of bankruptcy.

growstuff

Which "pompous" posters claimed to be academics in social sciences?

I did not say ‘pompous poster’, I said pompous assumption.
I did not say any poster ‘claimed to be academics in social sciences’
The above is your interpretation of what I said, somewhat proving my point.

I think things would change if people thought more realistically about other peoples lives versus the current idealistic mindset. My idealistic, blue voting county are way behind on the vaccination programme and they are blaming a lack of volunteers. Well maybe they should volunteer themselves, the rest of us are volunteered out or too busy caring for other people and working as hard as we can anyway.

Not a smear or even a sneer.
Facts.

growstuff

NellG

LauraNorder I really wish GN had a 'like' button.

I don't. It would lead to bullying, as happens on other sites.

I was just agreeing, but had nothing substantial to add so 'liked' what had been said. Sorry to have rattled you.

There's more than enough bullying on here as it is.

NellG

LauraNorder I really wish GN had a 'like' button.

I don't. It would lead to bullying, as happens on other sites.