Sexual Harassment of Girls and Young Women

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grandtanteJE65

Keepingquiet, are women really seen as inferior in the home in the UK?

I am asking because we have been considered equals since the late 1970s in the Scandinavian countries, so I wonder why Britain should be so different.

I am not doubting that you know your own country best, I am just horrified to learn that these attitudes still exist.

There is a lot of lip service paid to women's equality in this country- we only have to look at pay and work opportunities to see how we still have a long way to go.
In the recent pandemic women (carers, nurses, etc) have borne the brunt of the work and have lower pay. Also more women have lost or given up their jobs, reduced their hours etc in order to teach and supervise children who couldn't go to school.
The attitudes still do exist and are maybe even getting worse.

Galaxy

Scandinavian countries have high levels of crimes against women despite a better gender pay gap, etc so it is worth exploring what that means.

It would be interesting to know about reporting, prosecution and conviction rates of such crimes in the Scandinavian countries .

nanna8
According to the magazine Australian Men’s Health Australia ranks 7th in the world for viewing. So someone’s certainly watching it.

I think it is a long time since women were regarded as inferior here,too. Probably some time in the early to mid 1960s. Not to say there aren’t plenty of crude and rough men around who abuse women, that has always been a problem since the year dot. Sadly, it still is especially when they are locked up in the same house through covid restrictions

Scandinavian countries have high levels of crimes against women despite a better gender pay gap, etc so it is worth exploring what that means.

Keepingquiet, are women really seen as inferior in the home in the UK?

I am asking because we have been considered equals since the late 1970s in the Scandinavian countries, so I wonder why Britain should be so different.

I am not doubting that you know your own country best, I am just horrified to learn that these attitudes still exist.

Yes I take on board what you say suzie, after all grooming isn't new, I'm sure as you say abuse went on it just seems so common place right now and it's everywhere.

I'm just thinking about the girls my sons had as friends, not girlfriends all through their growing up years. Neither myself or my husband would have put up with them talking about their female peer group with such a lack of respect. I remember when one of our sons was early teens he put up some near naked pin up pictures of women on his bedroom wall, my husband had a chat with him on the basis that his then very young granddaughers may wander in his bedroom when visiting, he posed this to him "is it a good idea for your young nieces to see women presented in such a way?" Son had a think about that and took them down.

I think one of the problems is that actually we know very little about who is acessing porn. The fact that it is a multi million dollar earner suggests that it is more than just a few men. I remember a few years ago Cosmo and similar women's magazines were advising women to watch porn with their partner if the relationship needed help. It was also common place on TV programmes like Friends. If it is fuelling violence against women it would help to know exactly what the position is and who is likely to offend.

Terri I’m not sure that’s the full story going backwards - I think much was hidden certainly when we were girls snd young women - child abuse, domestic abuse, sexual abuse hidden and/or tolerated , seen as a normal part of culture.

There's nothing new about the sexual harrassment of women and children. Mine started when I was 12.

Did those policemen that assaulted people keep their jobs? They should be dismissed immediately and never,ever allowed to rejoin.
I don’t need to assume anything, meryl. I know them well and that stuff is just not on their radar. They are no angels, I’m not saying they are, but all very busy with their outdoor lives and friends. I think kids here spend more time outside because of the weather.

I have sons, they are now in their mid 30s, my recollection of their school days, mixed state junior and mixed comprehensive, was a time when they had many friends of both sexes, they regarded girls in their peer group as mates and not targeted sex objects, I know that there are quite a few they are still be in touch with. I have a close friend who's daughter same age and good friends with one of my sons, attended a single sex private school. When she got together with boys in her later teens, often they were with boys who had been pupils at fee paying single sex schools. She didn't have a comfortable relationship with the opposite sex that my children had, and often the behaviour she was on the receiving end relayed back to me via her mother, sounded to me like that that of the entitled and boorish.

I also read an alarming article recently relating to Durham University where some texts from prospective undergraduates had been exposed concerning young men all from privileged backgrounds who'd set them self a challenge to target young women from poorer backgrounds to have sex with with so they could brag and boast to each other about that. I believe when this came to light several places were withdrawn.

Reading about the increasing "rape culture" that prevails in schools many of these top notch establishments is extremely alarming, I imagine it is not confined to any one sector. It seems things are very different now to what I remember.

There seems to be such a lack of respect on the part of many young men towards their female counterparts, it's a problem that urgently needs addressing.

nanna8

I must lead a very sheltered life. No one I know or any of my children or grandchildren have ever been remotely interested in porn. They are too busy living their lives, going out with friends and enjoying themselves. Strewth.

They’re hardly going to tell you, are they? Never assume ?

Oh and a fifth point( all courtesy of C4) both these police officers are very recent recruits. It was suggested that in the rush to meet Govt targets, selection procedures are being less than robustly carried out

Four other points - this story was covered in depth on C4 news and had an interview with the young woman. She described many failures and delays in the police investigation and she and her family had to fight to get them to do anything at all.They have admitted this and apologised.
Secondly exactly what sort of punishment is a curfew during a lockdown?
And a third point, like the police officer who was guarding the site where Sarah was found who sent graphics, this police officer was moved to back office duties whilst under investigation. They should both have been immediately suspended
And a fourth point, he only changed his plea to guilty at the last minute. What was that judge yesterday thinking of?
There’s no hop

There is still a lot of victim blaming going on. There is an article in the local paper about a woman who was attacked whilst out running - a lot of comments are along the lines of she shouldn't have been there, she shouldn't have worn "running gear" and even one comment stating that women "like" a quick grope!! These are the attitudes that need to change

I don't think 50 shades was that popular - when I worked in a charity shop the most donated book was 50 shades. I couldn't get past the first few pages it was so badly written. I think it was over hyped, sold a lot of copies - which were mostly unread. I do wonder if more men than women read it!

I am always agog when people say oh he must have had a breakdown or he was such a normal family man. No he wasnt. For men who commit this type of crime the likelihood is there will be a number of unreported similar crimes and for the 'out of the blue' murder of a partner (sorry I know I am conflating two different type of crimes here) there will be a history of domestic violence.

Exactly Galaxy. It’s unlikely in the extreme that his behaviour towards women doesn’t reflect the contempt in which he holds us

It is highly unlikely that someone who commits an offence of that type wont offend again.

Terrie Bull, thanks for raising this case. I’ve just read about this in the DM on line. The man was sentenced to £500 fine and 14 night curfew. His defence argued against community service because the offender, police officer, shouldn’t mix with other offenders.

Why wasn’t this man given a community sentence with conditions to address his offence. He acted out an arrest as he terrorised and assaulted the woman. That behaviour didn’t arise ‘just’ because he was drunk. Sex offenders fantasise, the fantasies no longer do enough for them so they take it to the next level. How can any Court see this as an appropriate sentence? Will the CPS appeal?
He remains suspended as the force that employs him couldn’t go through its disciplinary procedure until the criminal proceedings concluded. Surely, he must be sacked.

Oldwoman70, newspapers, of course, use titillation to increase sales. Even their seemingly 'serious' articles on harassment etc. are included and headlined for that reason.

Not sure this is pertinent to this thread regarding young women and girls, but definitely relevant to continuing harassment of women per se, particularly after the awful and wicked murder of Sarah. I was shocked to read an article in the Mail on line this morning, together with accompanying CCTV footage, woman walking home in the dark, minding her own business in a village near Stratford on Avon, assaulted and verbally abused by a drunk off duty police officer. The footage is quite extreme imo. he actually tries to wrestle her to the ground, his language abusive in the extreme calling her a f**** s**g, a complete stranger to him who does her best to fight him off. His sentence for this assault, community service and to pay this poor woman a paltry £500 In the meantime she is left with extreme anxiety in the aftermath, this will stay with her for a long time I have no doubt. Truly shocking!

Reading the testaments of other women of late, who have been stalked and threatened, something needs to be done, how dare men who behave like this one walk away with hardly any punishment.

I must lead a very sheltered life. No one I know or any of my children or grandchildren have ever been remotely interested in porn. They are too busy living their lives, going out with friends and enjoying themselves. Strewth.

keepingquiet

Back in the day porn was accessible in magazines, newspapers and books.
It isn't long ago women were going mad over 50 Shades of Grey.
I don't think you can lay assaults of women at the door of internet porn.
As with racism, misogyny is institutional and in the every day experiences of women.
We may never fully fix the problem, but awareness of how we regard women in society as not deserving of the freedoms men enjoy is a start.

I’ve always been curious about the appeal of 50 shades. My daughters and one of their mums in law tried to read it after all the hype. Books in the bin because they all said it was badly written c**p

I agree with you that internet porn can’t be blamed for assaults on women. I can’t believe it doesn’t contribute to women being coerced, expected to consent to sexual practices they find painful or distasteful