A year of Starmer What do you think?

MaizieD

^ where as KS has dumped all the policies and is hoping in vain that focus groups will give him some.^

How do you know that , trisher? Are you in one of them?
Or do you have access to their proceedings?

I'm judging from his actions. The way he forced MPs to vote in Parliament. Things like the Covert Human Intelligence Sources (Criminal Conduct) Bill which should have been the focus for real opposition just nodded through. His inability to present any honest or open ideas, instead he just seems to be busy making sure the right wingers who lost the LP the 2017 election are allowed to get away with it

Until policies are formulated before the next election, there is no point in speculating about what has or has not been rejected.

Starmer has plenty of time.

The pandemic is the big focus, but hopefully as that wanes, then minds will turn to other serious issues, like climate change and that old perennial Brexit, which will of course be rearing its ugly head big time.

Once we can read the policies and judge for ourselves how Starmer is performing over issues like, Brexit, climate change, poverty, inequality, NHS, housing etc we will be in a better decision to make a considered judgement over his suitability for PM.

Mind you if suitability means constantly lying, cronyism and corruption, plus a willingness to “spaff” taxpayers money up the wall” (charming expression) then Starmer has lost before he has begun.

^ where as KS has dumped all the policies and is hoping in vain that focus groups will give him some.^

How do you know that , trisher? Are you in one of them?
Or do you have access to their proceedings?

It is possible that he is listening to the focus groups, and keeping his powder dry for the election campaign.

MaizieD

^I don't think he will last and fear he is overseeing what Owen Jones described as politics by focus groups, rather than policy driven politics.^

That is so interesting because that is just what the tories are doing, and being very successful too...

I think perhaps the difference is tht the tories have policies they put to Focus Groups and then adapt to what is discovered, where as KS has dumped all the policies and is hoping in vain that focus groups will give him some.

Starmer is too subdued in PMQ. He is more quietly spoken where Boris is a loud character, who ridicules everything he says and looks around the room for applause seemingly.

I don't think he will last and fear he is overseeing what Owen Jones described as politics by focus groups, rather than policy driven politics.

That is so interesting because that is just what the tories are doing, and being very successful too...

I don't think he will last and fear he is overseeing what Owen Jones described as politics by focus groups, rather than policy driven politics. He does I think firmly believe he can destroy the left wing and maintain a party, the problem is that the left were never "far" and if it has no left wing, what is the Labour Party?

MayBee70

From what I’ve read on Labour Facebook pages Starmer is reviled and everyone seems to have forgotten how useless Corbyn was both at PMQT and in elections. It seems to me they don’t want to get rid of the worst government/governments in living history but are going to vote Green. I despair.

The momentum/militant group dominate the Facebook groups. There are a couple of Facebook groups, such as Keir Starmer for PM that have comments from what I’d say are more moderate left leaning people.
I saw Starmer, Nandy and LongBailey during the last leadership campaign. Lisa Nandy was good and is growing in strength and ability. Starmer was the strongest candidate. I liked his presentation.
He’s a mountain to climb with people who claim to want a Labour government but do all they can to undermine the party and the leader.
I wonder if he is the Kinnock candidate who has to rid the party of the momentum types, lose the next election and bd replaced. I’d like to see Lisa Nandy - but I’d prefer Starmer to win the next election. Some hope of overturning that 80 majority

Doodle food for thought there. Will go and digest it and return anon ?

I don't think he was ever intended to be PM. He was brought in to make the LP electable, which I think he is doing well. He is an excellent contrast to 'Boris', and comes across as professional and competent, which is more than can be said for the PM.

It is interesting that people always refer to him by his full name, or as 'Starmer', whilst using the PM's 'stage name' of Boris. To me this indicates the differential in the amount of respect in which the two men are held.

In the end, though, I think that a more charismatic candidate will be in place before the next election. Unfortunately, the public is now used to soundbites and entertainment instead of debate and statesmanship, so someone like Sir Kier will struggle to compete for attention. I wonder whether Andy Burnham will be a good alternative? He is personable, sensible and is good in front of a camera.

I agree that the Speaker is hopeless, and that this is why Johnson gets away with so many lies. Love him or loathe him, Bercow would never have allowed it, and whatever their politics, I'd like to think that most people would see this as a good thing.

In the Guardian (of course) I recently read an article about KS pointing out that unlike most party leaders he hasn't yet had an opportunity to present himself and the LP policies to the general public. He became party leader after the GE and last year there were no local elections. This year there are local elections and so perhaps we all should reserve judgement until later.

Finally, he has written the odd piece for most of the papers.

Dinahmo

I haven't seen PMQs for a few weeks but a friend told me yesterday that at a recent one Johnson told 6 untruths. A Welsh MP stood up to question the last untruth and Johnson walked out. Apparently he does this often when confronted about his lies.

When KS queries Johnson, the response is unrelated to the question. I did see the Speaker once ask BJ to answer the question put and to point out that it wasn't the Opposition's responsibility to put forward their policies since they aren't in govt. Certainly they can query the govt's policies and KS has done that.

I do think that this Speaker is not up to much because he doesn't take BJ to task over his untruths. I watch the Daily Politics with my lunch when it's on and their fact checker points out the mis-truths and incorrect facts, of which there seems to be many. Had Bercow still been Speaker things would be very different for the govt and I for one regret his departure.

Johnson lies at every single PMQ ( and on most occasions in between when he opens his mouth) He lied yesterday at the press briefing.
I agree the Speaker is beyond useless which is why the Tories wanted him.

I think quite a few of the very far left do Maybee but that didn't win them an election, did it. With Corbyn on the far-left and Johnson on the very far-right, I rather think people want something more centre/centre-left. The balance to the see-saw so to speak. Starmer may be able to do it but he has been hamstrung by the pandemic. We will probably just have to wait and see. I just wish he would offer PR - but that's a personal wish; I don't know what they country would feel about that.

I haven't seen PMQs for a few weeks but a friend told me yesterday that at a recent one Johnson told 6 untruths. A Welsh MP stood up to question the last untruth and Johnson walked out. Apparently he does this often when confronted about his lies.

When KS queries Johnson, the response is unrelated to the question. I did see the Speaker once ask BJ to answer the question put and to point out that it wasn't the Opposition's responsibility to put forward their policies since they aren't in govt. Certainly they can query the govt's policies and KS has done that.

I do think that this Speaker is not up to much because he doesn't take BJ to task over his untruths. I watch the Daily Politics with my lunch when it's on and their fact checker points out the mis-truths and incorrect facts, of which there seems to be many. Had Bercow still been Speaker things would be very different for the govt and I for one regret his departure.

From what I’ve read on Labour Facebook pages Starmer is reviled and everyone seems to have forgotten how useless Corbyn was both at PMQT and in elections. It seems to me they don’t want to get rid of the worst government/governments in living history but are going to vote Green. I despair.

PippaZ yes, that's the one, thanks.

Yes possibly suzie. But if you look at America, and I know we are very different, Biden won the last election, I think another type of Democrat would have lost it.

silverlining48

It’s not easy to be the opposition in the current situation. Starmer said at the start that he would try to cooperate for the good of the country, but this may be to the detriment of how he is seen as a potential PM.

I think this is a very fair comment and really expresses better than I did why I feel I can’t really contribute a definitive view on him. It is also early days as well. I remember a quote from ages ago ( no idea who) that oppositions don’t win elections, governments lose them. I think there’s some truth in that.

It’s not easy to be the opposition in the current situation. Starmer said at the start that he would try to cooperate for the good of the country, but this may be to the detriment of how he is seen as a potential PM.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/apr/06/sleeze-tory-governments-gift-keir-starmer-labour

Is this it Ilovecheese?

WHO ?.

I think he is an honourable man, and that is not meant to be ironic.

Having read the article given in the OP, I do agree with this part

"Starmer is recrafting Labour not as a real opposition to the Conservative party’s increasingly extreme, crony capitalism, but as a responsible, more moderate alternative to it. He is offering voters a Labour party that feels more like the Tory party of old, which prioritised tradition, patriotism and family values. "

I think he sees this as a winning strategy, and he may well be right in thinking that. but what he wants to do if he does win, I am not sure.

Polly Toynbee has written a piece in support of Keir Starmer in today's Guardian. I am sorry I don't know how to do a link.