Does anyone here believe, as I do, that Johnson is finished (and I am sure HE does know himself)

Racingsparrow

Sorry do you not read the news. The Northern Irish do not like being part of the EU. The DUP are threatening to shut down the government if the problems with goods sent from the rest of the UK are not sorted out. The present arrangements make the return of the troubles a distinct possibility. My Daughters in-laws are from Northern Island and can see what is happening . My Two brothers in law both live in Northern Ireland and are both worried by the present situation.

Over 55% of those who voted in the 2016 referendum in NI, voted to remain? Why do you think opinion has changed?

GG13, yes, in the end the help was there. But the family emigrated to Canada a few years later, where they are doing well, but it caused a lot of unhappiness and worry for his family at the time.

Oops sorry your friends family member.

M0nica

Grannygravy I agree, a friend's SiL, only 19 at the time and a member of the TA, also did 2 tours in the Balkans. Unlike the regular army (who had little enough) there was no psychological support for TA members and he was very severely affected by what he witnessed.

Sorry your family member had no support. It’s difficult to come to terms with the horrors they witnessed. Have they approached any of the military charities which are helpful and experienced in war trauma.

Racingsparrow

Sorry do you not read the news. The Northern Irish do not like being part of the EU. The DUP are threatening to shut down the government if the problems with goods sent from the rest of the UK are not sorted out. The present arrangements make the return of the troubles a distinct possibility. My Daughters in-laws are from Northern Island and can see what is happening . My Two brothers in law both live in Northern Ireland and are both worried by the present situation.

The DUP do not represent the majority in NI. They're not having difficulty with sourcing food or fuel because it can come in with no problems via southern Ireland.

M0nica

*Alegrias*, Yes, I was wrong abou tthe protocol. I was confusing it with clauses in the GFA, which any change to the protocol could endanger.

Namsnanny Being PM didn't work for Cameron because respectable businesses saw him for what he was. That is why he got involved with a dodgy company like Greensill.

I cannot see why it should be any different with Johnson. Cameron had problems with out the burden of being known to be a serial lier and cheat, which Johnson has.

Tony Blair is a very interesting case. He was respected on the international stage in a way he wasn't in the UK. I could never bring myself to vote for him. In fact he was why I didn't vote Labour in 1997, but his skill in dealing with Northern Ireland, not a perfct solution, but one that has worked, plus his involvment in the Middle East did win him international respect and kept him in business after he retired. I would also not underestimate the power and influence of his wife, who is far cleverer and canny than many give her credit for. Nothing against Mesdames Cameron and Johnson, but neither of them as astute or as clever as Mrs Blair.

I think Mo Mowlam, David Trimble and John Hume also deserve some credit, it was just Blair.

The current situation in ireland is worrying, and there are still extremist on both sides that would like to get the troubles going again, but the one thing that unites Ireland, both sides of the border, is their desire to be, and stay in the EU.

With both sides so united on this issue, Brexit could actually expedite Irish unity.

Grannygravy I agree, a friend's SiL, only 19 at the time and a member of the TA, also did 2 tours in the Balkans. Unlike the regular army (who had little enough) there was no psychological support for TA members and he was very severely affected by what he witnessed.

Racingsparrow

Sorry do you not read the news. The Northern Irish do not like being part of the EU. The DUP are threatening to shut down the government if the problems with goods sent from the rest of the UK are not sorted out. The present arrangements make the return of the troubles a distinct possibility. My Daughters in-laws are from Northern Island and can see what is happening . My Two brothers in law both live in Northern Ireland and are both worried by the present situation.

NI voted to remain

Sorry do you not read the news. The Northern Irish do not like being part of the EU. The DUP are threatening to shut down the government if the problems with goods sent from the rest of the UK are not sorted out. The present arrangements make the return of the troubles a distinct possibility. My Daughters in-laws are from Northern Island and can see what is happening . My Two brothers in law both live in Northern Ireland and are both worried by the present situation.

It’s almost like a war that has been forgotten by many. Sadly not for those involved.

Having an adult child who had two tours in Yugoslavia during the war, I can honestly say that what they witnessed still haunts them.

I agree with you MayBee - it was his praying with Bush about going to war that put me off him.

MOnica. Don’t forget Blair and Yugoslavia as well. No one seemed all that bothered about what was happening there till he got involved. I find it so sad that someone who is very much a man of peace ended up embroiled in such a senseless war in Iraq. I’m sure it haunts him: I can see it in his face. On just about every other subject he talks such sense

?

Hands up anyone who doesn’t care if they never see, eat, cook another turkey ever again ??????

Alegrias, Yes, I was wrong abou tthe protocol. I was confusing it with clauses in the GFA, which any change to the protocol could endanger.

Namsnanny Being PM didn't work for Cameron because respectable businesses saw him for what he was. That is why he got involved with a dodgy company like Greensill.

I cannot see why it should be any different with Johnson. Cameron had problems with out the burden of being known to be a serial lier and cheat, which Johnson has.

Tony Blair is a very interesting case. He was respected on the international stage in a way he wasn't in the UK. I could never bring myself to vote for him. In fact he was why I didn't vote Labour in 1997, but his skill in dealing with Northern Ireland, not a perfct solution, but one that has worked, plus his involvment in the Middle East did win him international respect and kept him in business after he retired. I would also not underestimate the power and influence of his wife, who is far cleverer and canny than many give her credit for. Nothing against Mesdames Cameron and Johnson, but neither of them as astute or as clever as Mrs Blair.

No other country in the world would agree to something as stupid as this.

Perhaps no other country in the world has such a stupid PM.

The Northern Ireland protocol keeps this in place and does not allow for a border between the Irish Republic and Northern Ireland,

Want to see The Troubles start all over again, do you?

From what I can see the Northern Irish are perfectly happy with staying in the Single Market. No shortages of anything over there.

Oh, it started so well.

The EU are using this to punish us for leaving the Common Market

The EU are treating us exactly as we asked them to. We told them to treat NI differently. We don't get to complain about it if they then do exactly what we agreed to.

No other country in the world would agree to something as stupid as this.

You could be right there

I correct myself. Tony Blair negotiated the Northern agreement including the controversial letters to the IRA terrorists giving them freedom from prosecution. The Northern Ireland protocol keeps this in place and does not allow for a border between the Irish Republic and Northern Ireland, hence the stupid border down the Irish sea. The EU are using this to punish us for leaving the Common Market by controlling what can be sent to Northern Ireland from the rest if the UK. No other country in the world would agree to something as stupid as this.

Dinahmo

I don't think there'll be many turkeys around. In case you missed the link on a different thread take a look at this

www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oz33NNrs7g

I thought we were going to import lots of turkeys from Brazil...

I don't think there'll be many turkeys around. In case you missed the link on a different thread take a look at this

www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oz33NNrs7g

Dinahmo I do not think everything will be back to normal by Christmas, but many many people will accept a new normal after nearly two years of a pandemic and happily blame the EU for any shortages.

Alegrias1

GrannyGravy13

Dinahmo absolutely serious, that’s what the man/woman in the street is in all probability focusing on.

Not everyone is constantly considering the day to day political situation, they are considering themselves and their daily lives.

So wait, wait....

Joe Public is very well informed and has enough political understanding to vote away 40-odd years of political stability and advantageous trading environments.

But Joe Public will be won over by the buffoon getting him/her a turkey in time for Xmas and not worry about the political situation that made that a problem in the first place.

Maybe I should post this on all today's N &P threads

It does relate to your comments, I think, Alegrias.

From the New European:

It was, the occupiers of the moral high-ground said, sheer condescension to suggest anybody who voted for Brexit did so without fully understanding the implications for both themselves and their nation.

Nobody, it seems, was thick at the ballot box.

But when people sit in a two hour queue outside the nearest Shell garage, then suddenly their intellectual abilities come under a more forensic scrutiny.

Britain is suddenly full of eejits.

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/panic-buying-petrol-stupid/

Alegrias1 unfortunately yes.

I know it’s unpalatable to some (and me) but I think Mr.Johnson still has a few years left.