We are watching the demise of the NHS with our eyes wide open.

I think the wastage of unopened medicines is an area that concerns us all, and yet what to do about it no one knows. I presume medicines are destroyed unused because of the small possibility that someone outside the pharmacy/hospital may have tampered with them. Remember the case a few years ago of the nurse who was injecting something into bags of saline in a hospital in Stockport? I don’t know what the answer to this is, but the waste must be phenomenal.

maddyone, are you referring to NHS 111 as the very good out of hours service? In my area, I called them at 11pm, was told someone would be with my seriously ill partner within a couple of hours, I waited up all night for them only to receive a text at 7am informing me that they had finished their shift and I should now contact my partner's GP Surgery...

NHS is failing because of lack of staff at caring level! Skeleton staff on A&E last week where I waited for almost 12 hours with a very sick DH. One of the nurses was on his own, partner had called in sick, no replacement and he had to cope on his own. Another on a 12 hour shift, this used to happen once a month, now every second day.
Not surprised people are leaving the NHS in droves, the working conditions must be intolerable.

It didn’t say in the article I read.

My husband has been very ill, culminating in a kidney transplant a few months ago, without which he would have undoubtedly died). We are so very grateful for the care and expertise the NHS provided in getting him well again .... however we also became aware of what a wasteful organisation this is. They need to embrace technology more and work smarter,
At one clinic we attended there was a trained nurse being used to man a reception desk put patient folders in the trays outside the consultants office instead of caring for people on the wards in line with her training. Anyone could have done what she was doing, but more to the point, if all the info in those folders was on a computer system, there would be no need for folders or anyone handling them.
And don't get me started on waste! We currently have a massive box in our garage full of unopened, unused drugs which are still in date, yet we are told they cannot be taken back into the system. Up until a couple of months ago we also had 60 boxes of dialysis fluids (each bag, individually sealed in non recyclable plastic!) and then packed in fives into the 60 cardboard boxes. Despite these being on a rack in our garage since the delivery man put them there, Baxters, would not take them back and neither would the hospital. They told me to empty them down the drain and to bag up the unopened, unused drain bags, boxes of tubes and connectors (all in sealed plastic and in boxes) and put them in medical waste bags and get them picked up for destroying. These were all inported goods. If each box of 5 cost as little at £10 (for ease of maths!) our 60 boxes of fluids alone would be worth £3000 .... and we were being told to literally throw it down the drain!!!
If you multiply this by the number of dialysis patients nationwide who either have a transplant or whose mediication or type of dialysis changes then that represents a good proportion of what Major Tom, so diligently raised.

And still the NHS bleat about not having enough money!

Foxyferret

I just read an article about I think about 12 new managers on very high salaries. I just thought at the time too many chiefs and not enough Indians. I didn’t say I was qualified at anything, just passing an opinion.

12 new managers to do what? How much are they going to be responsible for?

Jackthelad

The consistent message I read in this thread is that the NHS is under funded. Where is this extra money to come from? Us the tax payer, of course. Very soon we are just about to pay even more tax to be given into the open maw of the NHS. I don't believe it will solve anything as it hasn't so far. When the NHS was set up in 1948 it started to go wrong almost immediately. The demand exceeded supply and so prescription charges came in. Swiftly followed by charges for spectacles. Dentists by and large have come out the NHS and that seems to have been generally accepted. Britain was the first in the field with healthcare. Other nations followed but learned from our mistakes. So now is the time for us to take a good hard look at their systems of working and incorporate the best bits and improve avoiding their mistakes. There has to be change or the NHS will collapse under its own bureaucratic weight.

I agree with you to an extent. I certainly think we need to look at best practice in some other countries, although we also need to accept that we need to pay more for the NHS most people seem to want.

I believe it costs around £250 000 to train a doctor. Young junior doctors are so overworked and unsupported many emigrate to countries where they feel valued and are treated well.

I just read an article about I think about 12 new managers on very high salaries. I just thought at the time too many chiefs and not enough Indians. I didn’t say I was qualified at anything, just passing an opinion.

maddyone

^Those working in care homes have been told to leave if they won’t accept the jab for a virus that no scientist anywhere in the world can isolate or prove it exists.^

WHAT? Are you for real? Where have you been for the last two years? 140000 dead and you think that is normal?

Planet Zog presumably!

Who is prof. Winston Graham, do you mean Robert Winston?

SecondhandRose

As already said there is a lot on NHS wasted money. I had a lot of drugs left over from my treatment. I took it back to the hospital and they threw it all away. It was in sealed packaging.

How much were the drugs worth? How much could have been saved?

The consistent message I read in this thread is that the NHS is under funded. Where is this extra money to come from? Us the tax payer, of course. Very soon we are just about to pay even more tax to be given into the open maw of the NHS. I don't believe it will solve anything as it hasn't so far. When the NHS was set up in 1948 it started to go wrong almost immediately. The demand exceeded supply and so prescription charges came in. Swiftly followed by charges for spectacles. Dentists by and large have come out the NHS and that seems to have been generally accepted. Britain was the first in the field with healthcare. Other nations followed but learned from our mistakes. So now is the time for us to take a good hard look at their systems of working and incorporate the best bits and improve avoiding their mistakes. There has to be change or the NHS will collapse under its own bureaucratic weight.

Those working in care homes have been told to leave if they won’t accept the jab for a virus that no scientist anywhere in the world can isolate or prove it exists.

WHAT? Are you for real? Where have you been for the last two years? 140000 dead and you think that is normal?

Foxyferret

It seems to me that when money is thrown at the NHS, it goes to the wrong people. All these new manages on ridiculous salaries instead of doctors and nurses. The government say they are giving more money to the NHS but it’s all going in the wrong places. They never give a breakdown of exactly where the money is going.

So who is going to decide how money is distributed, if there are fewer managers and accountants?

Money could be saved from scrapping commissioning and the profits which are being siphoned off to private providers.

Foxyferret

It seems to me that when money is thrown at the NHS, it goes to the wrong people. All these new manages on ridiculous salaries instead of doctors and nurses. The government say they are giving more money to the NHS but it’s all going in the wrong places. They never give a breakdown of exactly where the money is going.

Can you tell us what your qualification is that enables you to speak with such confidence about what the NHS is doing wrong?

Did you read candelle's excellent and very informative post earlier? The one that shows that the NHS has been underfunded for the last 10 years?

Privatisation, here we come...

It seems to me that when money is thrown at the NHS, it goes to the wrong people. All these new manages on ridiculous salaries instead of doctors and nurses. The government say they are giving more money to the NHS but it’s all going in the wrong places. They never give a breakdown of exactly where the money is going.

As already said there is a lot on NHS wasted money. I had a lot of drugs left over from my treatment. I took it back to the hospital and they threw it all away. It was in sealed packaging.

Has anyone been following an organisation called Compass? - www.compassonline.org.uk/
It promotes the power of motivated and accountable coalition government as a means of breaking the current dead hand of a single-party monopoly disinterested in the needs of the electorate.

I also had cause to call 111 recently as I had a UTI. I was away from home on holiday. I had a call back from a GP an hour later who sent a prescription to the local chemist for me to collect the next morning. Couldn’t fault it.

The NHS is seriously underfunded and maybe some sort of 'privatisation' of certain sectors might prove a positive step,

The underfunding of the NHS is a political decision. The money is available to fund it properly, it only needs political will, but that doesn't exist in our government. Privatisation of some sectors has already happened. The government are running down the NHS so that the public will do what you've just done, knspol, ask for, or approve of private provision.

The contempt in which the government holds the NHS is blatantly obvious. It has been deliberately run down, our current supposed 'Health' Minister is demonising GPS, the government has refused to give NHS staff a pay rise that will be ahead of inflation (claps are good enough for them, who needs money) and is minimising the value of the pay rise by taking most of it in increased taxation next April.

I think (can't be sure, might have been on twitter or in my newspaper) some poor innocent early in this thread said that the NHS wouldn't be privatised because the public love it so much.

Well, listen to the voices of the public on this thread then tell me how much protest there would be if it disappeared? NOT A LOT, I fear...

During lockdown I was seen by my GP in person. I was put on the two week cancer pathway and had a colonoscopy. Still during lockdown. I then had major cancer surgery and 6 months of chemo. District nurses came to my home and helped me and gave me my first vaccine in January. I have had first class NHS treatment and had nothing cancelled or delayed. Long live the brilliant NHS. Yes I am Tory.

Yes, you are right whitewave, and it is extremely worrying. I have a friend at the moment with a particularly invasive cancer and following diagnosis, she is still waiting for an appointment to see a surgeon. She is out of her mind with stress, knowing how invasive this is.
It is all appalling. A lot of people are opting to spend their savings to be seen by a Consultant. That’s great for them. But not so great for those who cannot afford to pay privately and who continue to wait. It’s truly awful for people who have no savings and do not have health insurance.
It’s very concerning. What can we do?

I don't believe it's policy to run down the NHS rather it's incompetence from govts to understand and act on the problems experienced by us all. There is obviously a lack of GP's - why? One reason is that it has relatively low standing amongst other specialisms. An easy first step would be to make sure that all of the doctors trained in the UK are made to work here first for a minimum amount of time before returning to their own countries or moving abroad. The NHS is seriously underfunded and maybe some sort of 'privatisation' of certain sectors might prove a positive step, I'm not in a position to know the answer to that. I don't want to see the demise of the NHS but agree wholeheartedly that GP's need to offer face to face apts and that waiting lists need to be cut and that medical staff who have been putting their lives at risk for the past 18 mths need help and that costs money that we all need to contribute to one way or another.

OH MY GOD!!!

Those working in care homes have been told to leave if they won't accept the jab for a virus that no scientist anywhere in the world can isolate or prove it exists.

Where are you getting this nonsense from, Athenia?