Owen Patterson and sleaze- a shameful day in the House

But relevant surely if we are talking about MP’s behaviour?

But Urmonstongran, do you consider Johnson's ability to u turn, his unprincipled behaviour positive factors? Your silly comment about acid is beneath you.

Reported yesterday that Boris Johnson has admitted receiving a free holiday at a luxurious Spanish villa linked to Zac Goldsmith, the former MP who was given a peerage and job by the prime minister (the property is advertised as costing £25,000 a week to rent!) And interesting that Johnson has been investigated in the past by the same Standards Committee (and the same Chair) and is about to be again- could this possibly be linked to why he wants to get rid of it?? Surely not !!!

It's worth voting for a party which doesn't stand any chance of winning because they still get some money from the Treasury coffers. This is the formula and how much each party is currently receiving:

commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01663/

Neilspurgeon0

Personally I had, until very recently always been a conservative voter, based primarily on my mother’s argument that ‘you now have something to conserve’, having struggled to buy my own house and always worked to support the wife and children that we decided to bring into the world and never taking ‘benefits’ to support my lifestyle. However, since Johnson, who I DID vote for to make sure that the wish of the majority to enable Brexit became the law, I have turned away from that particular view of the world, and I do not really consider BJ or JR-M to be true conservatives anyway and will, for the foreseeable future, vote Green, IF they put up candidates in my Borough.

However I do accept that this probably means, in my leafy southern English town, that I am really wasting my vote.

It is a sad world we now live in.

At least the Greens will get some "short money" and be able to continue the fight.

MayBee70

Heseltine, who I have great respect for due to his outspokeness on brexit, has said Johnson is safe because they’ve got time before the next election to start throwing money at the electorate to appease them. I hope he’s wrong.

I hope so too, but I suspect he isn't wrong. I've been saying for ages that they'll start throwing high profile sweeties at the red wall seats a few months before any planned election. Boundary changes are going to make it more difficult to beat them.

Well, BJ can't have that much of an instinct for public opinion, Urmstongran or he wouldn't have made such a serious and glaring mistake in the first place. And I don't think a U turn can really be described as moving on - it's fast-pedalling back to where he started, with a face weighed down with mud.

Personally I had, until very recently always been a conservative voter, based primarily on my mother’s argument that ‘you now have something to conserve’, having struggled to buy my own house and always worked to support the wife and children that we decided to bring into the world and never taking ‘benefits’ to support my lifestyle. However, since Johnson, who I DID vote for to make sure that the wish of the majority to enable Brexit became the law, I have turned away from that particular view of the world, and I do not really consider BJ or JR-M to be true conservatives anyway and will, for the foreseeable future, vote Green, IF they put up candidates in my Borough.

However I do accept that this probably means, in my leafy southern English town, that I am really wasting my vote.

It is a sad world we now live in.

Not acid, no.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.scotsman.com/news/politics/journalist-boris-johnson-discussed-helping-have-assaulted-demands-apology-1413245%3famp

Most voters couldn’t care less about this issue I bet. Some will think (if at all) that it is a media-led storm.

. At least he didn't threaten anyone with an acid attack.

Heseltine, who I have great respect for due to his outspokeness on brexit, has said Johnson is safe because they’ve got time before the next election to start throwing money at the electorate to appease them. I hope he’s wrong.

Boris has an instinct for public opinion which is more accurate than that of most other politicians. This is why he wins almost all the elections and votes he takes part in. If he loses on an issue, he U-turns quickly and moves on. You may call it unprincipled but he is successful. Who do you think is cleverer?

Dickens

I don't believe it will make one iota of difference to many of those who voted for the Tories under Johnson.

He rallied the "Get Brexit Done" crowds, the "anyone but Corbyn" voters, with his blustering confidence, his smiling buffoonery. He knows his audience well and knows how to play to the gallery, and I suspect he'll manage to turn the tide against those who are critical of his judgement and that of the rest of the party in allowing these two back into the fold. Such criticism will be regarded by the party's supporters as simply "Tory - or Johnson - bashing" and will be largely dismissed. Then of course, there'll be the usual 'whataboutery' and "all politicians are the same" schtick.

Breaches of the ministerial code are not really taken that seriously by the electorate. That's where we're at. Both parties have / have had their rogues, but I don't think anyone really cares.

I care !! It saddens me to think that Johnson could set the Queen on fire and some people would still support him !

He’s only apologising because he got found out. As for ministers in tears but still voting for the government, reminds me of the Milgram experiment. Chilling.

Nadhim Zahawi, the Education Secretary, insisted the ambition of reforming the wider process of investigating MP standards was right, tacking it onto a vote about the long-standing North Shropshire MP was not the right approach.

"I take collective responsibility, I am part of the Government, I am part of the Cabinet," Mr Zahawi told BBC Breakfast. "I also take collective responsibility to say we made a mistake... We shouldn't have conflated the issue of fairness... with the specific case of Owen Paterson."

He added: "All I can say is I am sorry, we made that mistake, but it was right to move quickly and actually it is much more human. I would prefer a leader who is able to reflect and come back and say 'we made a mistake', rather than just ploughs on."

I have voted conservative all my life but won’t be doing next time if we still have the same government. I am dismayed at the dishonesty and lack of empathy towards the poorer in our society. Moral ethics seem to have gone out of the window in any attempt to achieve their own ends. The career politicans we have now have no understanding at all of real life and are totally out of touch.

The biggest problem is Boris and his team of yes men. He threw away people with years of experience and government expertise in order to surround himself with people who would do as he says rather than challenge him. Don’t even get me started on the arrogant Rees Mogg!

I have no idea which party I will vote for but I do admire Keith Starmer and his moral code and Jess Phillips who understands real life.

I am sure I am not alone and there may be a huge shock at the next election.

Interesting article in the inews today highlighting a number of tory MPs who have been investigated by the Standards Committee and the results of their investigations (sometimes quoting the opinion of the Standards Commissioner).

Two things strike me

1) that most of the complaints are about quite 'low level' infringements, such as late filing of members' interests and declaration of donations, or misuse of official Parliament notepaper. Apologies, rectification of errors and promises to be good in future are the most common outcomes. (I couldn't help thinking that the committee's work must be quite boring most of the time)

2) It rather makes a mockery of a poster's rather childish claim yesterday that only 'Remainer' MPs are let off easily..

Well, three things, really. All these 'investigated' and mildly sanctioned MPs voted to replace the current arrangements for maintaining standards in Parliament They must think that their little fiddles were not worth bothering about

inews.co.uk/news/24-mps-official-complaints-voted-overturn-sleaze-watchdog-what-they-did-1284387

I agree Scones but deep within me is a belief in karma, and despite it all, a belief in basic human decency, and I really, really hope that Johnson becomes seen as a toxic character, one who is poison to people's careers and social standing. I realise this sounds naïve, but a person's stock can fall spectacularly, look at Weinstein; extreme example of course. Grifter is the perfect description of Johnson. There again, if he spends his time sponging drinks from buddies in the Garrick Club, it is unlikely that our paths will cross

The tightly knit web of old school chums, bullies, Bullingdon boys, people on the make, money, newspaper owners, politicians and business will surely mean that our PM is never on his uppers.

Arrogance and the ability to play that network of self servers is how a grifting charlatan like Johnson got where he is and why he will never be out of the spotlight or short of three or four houses and a Garrick Club meal ticket.

growstuff

The trouble is that Johnson got rid of anybody who was remotely competent, so there isn't anybody in the current Cabinet with the experience to be PM.

I agree. The lesson to all the Tory MPs is they have to choose their career or their conscience it would seem, as we all know, some big names were ousted for going against Johnson. I really hope would like to think that some of those decent Tory MPs are getting together with a plan to get rid of Johnson and his sycophants before even more damage is done. I want to see Johnson disgraced and humiliated, leaving Parliament without a career as an after dinner speaker lined up, his only future appearances in a court of law, as a defendant.

If she has any sense, she wouldn't want to return.

Can’t we have Theresa May back? (can’t believe I ‘m wishing for this!)

The trouble is that Johnson got rid of anybody who was remotely competent, so there isn't anybody in the current Cabinet with the experience to be PM.

Urmstongran

In today’s Telegraph.

Have you worked out why the two things should not have been put together in the same bill yet Urmstongran?

Lincslass

Whitewavemark2

The trouble is that it isn’t just Johnson who is embroiled. In sleaze.

Look how many Tory MPs have been involved with mates and covid contracts.

The whole swamp ( to coin a phrase) needs emptying.

I totally agree, but who of those who didn’t vote for this are willing to stand. Beginning to despair.

Sunak abstained. I believe he's a (the?) favourite to be the next Tory leader. Personally, I don't think he's had enough experience as a politician and don't think he'd be that good. It depends how many allies he has. He's been quite careful not to make many enemies. Who knows?

The other favourite is Liz Truss, who voted with the government. I think she'd be an absolute disaster, but (again) what do I know? She wouldn't be worse than the current incumbent (could she?)