What is the answer here?

Your mentioning building and poor housing Lincslass has made me think about the shortage of housing for immigrants and for the population in general. We all know housing is short and one of the reasons for this is second home ownership.

The last English Housing Survey estimated that 772,000 households had a second home in 2018/19. Of those, 495,000 were in the UK, an increase of 77% in the past 10 years. That's over 380,000 UK homes taken out of the market between 2008 and 2018.

Now obviously people have an absolute right to have a second home if they wish, but if those homes could be owned or even rented long term by another family perhaps an immigrant family then at least the homes wouldn't be standing empty hollowing out rural and coastal communities.

My remote coastal town has many second homes. Young people can't afford to buy or rent here and so move away. The population ages, schools close, bus services are scrapped and there are no young people to provide essential services e.g. builders, plumbers, chefs, carers. Young immigrant families would fill an ever increasing gap here and their children would breathe life into the place.

www.insidehousing.co.uk/comment/comment/we-need-to-address-the-problem-of-second-homes-72386

Jackiest

This may explain the increase in numbers.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/nov/12/brexit-easier-small-boat-crossings-to-reach-uk-refugees-say

There are a few explanations, to my mind, as to why these people leave the safe country of say France, they have been refused asylum in said country of departure, so UK, may be their last hope. Family already here, in which case once processed should be sent to said family, English is spoken, not always though. We have no ID system, so easier for them to work under the radar. Saying that, people should be treated humanely, but how do you accommodate 20,000 people who arrive in a few months. Should we plan our infrastructure to accommodate newcomers, rather than our own poorly housed, how much land would you like us to build over, who is goingo to pay for it??

Calistemon
That’s exactly what I was saying, i thought it was clear. ?

I don’t think there is an answer Sarnia and it seems sometimes that half the world is on the move.
We just have to accept they will arrive, sort out genuine cases and deport others.

Who takes most refugees as a percentage of population?
1.Lebanon – 19.5%
2. Jordan – 10.5%
3. Nauru – 5.9%
4. Turkey – 5.0%
5. Liberia – 4.1%
6. Uganda – 3.7%
7. Malta – 2.7%
8. Sudan – 2.6%
9. Sweden – 2.6%
10. South Sudan – 2.5%

Who takes the most refugees?
Germany – 1,265,000 refugees (1.5% of the total population)
Ethiopia – 943,000 (0.8%)
United States – 773,000 (0.23%
Bangladesh – 675,000 (0.4%)
Kenya – 394,000 (0.7%)
Russia – 453,000 (0.3%)
Cameroon – 416,000 (1.5%)

I wholeheartedly agree with what Varian said.

When immigrants can settle and start work they begin contributing to society, pay tax and provide the services that we are all crying out for - builders, electricians, plumbers, carers, NHS staff, teachers, lorry drivers. Evidence has proven that immigrants are nett contributors to our economy.

This country needs immigrants to compensate for the EU citizens who have left the UK because of Brexit and the thousands of highly skilled Brits who have moved to the EU in the last five years.

Fortunately many immigrants have useful skills and the system should allow them to work and settle as soon as possible.

There seems to be an assumption on this thread that the UK is taking proportionately more refugees and asylum seekers than other countries, whereas actually far more are taken in by other African and Asian countries. Germany also takes more than the UK, and France and Spain are close behind.

Jackiest - thank you for that useful link.

Are the desperate people economic migrants who just want a better life for them and their families or people who are persecuted in their homelands?
If they are economic then why do they insist on the UK? Some have come a long way, why don’t they head for the Arabic countries, surely more wealthy than Europe?
I’m not sure there is any answer when people are so desperate to change their lives.

This is one of the problems Daisend1 which no one seems able to answer.
It’s often said we have a housing crisis but it’s more of a population crisis.

Meanwhile there is the problem on the Polish border with many thousands of migrants trying to get a foothold in Europe.

This may explain the increase in numbers.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/nov/12/brexit-easier-small-boat-crossings-to-reach-uk-refugees-say

Luckygirl Many of them remain in other countries. The hundreds of thousands of refugees leaving their home countries do not all aim for Britain.

So once here how and where do we accomodate those arriving on our shores unless already having relatives with properties.
Do they come with funds to buy property ? doubtful, so who then comes first for rentals ?

JenniferEccles

Why should we stop mentioning Australia’s immigration policy when it worked?
Sarnia asked for sensible workable solutions and Australia found just such a plan.

Australia's policy has worked in that the refugees are kept out of sight and therefore out of mind - on an island. I read the report linked by Alegrias! and it's damning.

I agree with you about the generalisations that are made Sarnia. It is certainly desperate for those people trying to get here.

Alegrias1

Can we just stop trying to say that Australia's immigration policy is in any way something we should be trying to copy?

Is there a reason that young males can't be genuine asylum seekers?

Can you tell on sight?

I think what JenniferEccles is saying is that there appears to be a lot of single men travelling here and that concerns some people. As you say they may be genuine asylum seekers or have family already here that they are trying to reach. We shouldn't generalise that they are all up to no good. Perhaps families with young children seem more deserving of our help. I don't know. It's a desperate situation all round.

Redhead56

I watched a documentary about the lifeboats last week. The staff were getting grief from the public because they rescued migrants from a dinghy.
It was upsetting for the lifeboat staff they just want to save lives. These wonderful volunteers do a brave and daring job unpaid. With no support from the government who are burying their heads in the sand. If the life boat staff are getting abuse for saving migrants it's not surprising they are taking time off. It was sad to see the immigrants there were little children amongst them. It was an upsetting programme to watch and its a situation that is not going away.

I watched this and really felt for the lifeboat crew pulled in two directions. It's a situation that has been going on for too long with no effective procedure and as you say is not going away.

‘The Australian government’s policy is the exact opposite of what countries should be pursuing’ - Anna Neistat

www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/australia-conditions-nauru-detention-centre-amount-torture?utm_source=google&utm_medium=grant&utm_campaign=BRD_AWA_GEN_dynamic-search-ads&utm_content=

JenniferEccles

Why should we stop mentioning Australia’s immigration policy when it worked?
Sarnia asked for sensible workable solutions and Australia found just such a plan.

Ask the people losing their sanity on Nauru if it worked.

I agree that the people at the helm of this "trade" who are making a lot of money out of others' misfortune are to be despised.

Would that this were a simple problem.

My feeling is that if someone is prepared to risk their life in a rubber dinghy in the freezing channel then it might be reasonable to assume that they are desperate. That they are escaping from something that is so awful that they are prepared to risk their lives to get away.

But it begs the question as to why Britain? Presumably they have stopped off in a number of other countries en route. But they choose to plough on and risk the boat trip in order to get to Britain.

It may be that it is because they expect to be treated with humanity and kindness here, which is something we should be proud of; but I assume that other European countries might be expected to do the same.

I do not buy the headlines that talk of us being "overrun" or of our infrastructure being on its knees. There are inadequacies in various services (health, education etc.) but they were there before immigration became so headline-grabbing.

I do not know what the answer is - but I do know that we cannot turn back people whose lives are at risk afloat on flimsy boats. It would be inhuman.

Why should we stop mentioning Australia’s immigration policy when it worked?
Sarnia asked for sensible workable solutions and Australia found just such a plan.

www.refugeecouncil.org.au/asylum-policies/

Can we just stop trying to say that Australia's immigration policy is in any way something we should be trying to copy?

Is there a reason that young males can't be genuine asylum seekers?

Can you tell on sight?