Val McDermid, Raith Rovers and the Rapist

I know it's not illegal 25Avalon I'm just wondering why the other club and it's staff and supporters weren't much bothered about his crime.

Doodledog Only you could have taken a post suggesting that the way football treats young boys who eventually become rapists is somehow support for rapists. What I was suggesting was that if someone is putting money into an organisation that produces damaged young men (and surely if men become wife abusers, rapists and aggressive in their early 20s, not to mention drunks and drug users, they are damaged) and makes millions of pounds from these young men. the least they could do is do something to prevent that happening. Which isn't excusing rapists or making life easier for them it is addressing a problem at its root and hopefully protecting far more young women than ranting at one footballer or one club could ever do. You just get rid of one rapist and leave the others in development. Because that is what taking boys as young as 9 or 10, teaching them they are special, training them in aggression and conflict and giving them inflated egos whilst paying them huge sums as they reach their late teen does, and will continue to do, whatever happens to Goodwillie.

There is no need to get personal. It's clearly not 'only me', as can be seen from other comments, and I didn't say that 'the way football treats boys is somehow support for rapists'. I said that telling someone that she should be spending her own money on initiatives to socialise men, or on rehabilitating rapists so that they can go back to well-paid jobs is an insult.

I understand about addressing problems at their root, but that is not VM's (or any other donor's) responsibility. Socialisation of boys is the responsibility of parents and schools, with the law as a deterrent if that fails. It is not for anyone to tell a donor where she should put her support. If a fan wants to support a football team she should be able to do just that, without having to take responsibility for the way the players behave, any more than a theatre-goer who sponsors a theatre should be told that they should divert some of their money into the re-education of predatory actors. I applaud her for her actions, which seem to have given 'the incident' the publicity that has forced the club to make a U turn.

Chewbacca, there is currently a high profile, unnamed rugby player accused of rape.
and there have been other incidents.
www.theguardian.com/news/2018/dec/04/rugby-rape-trial-ireland-belfast-case

It’s not illegal Aveline, but morally it’s a cesspit.

25Avalon

I don’t like Joey Barton or Lee Bowyer either but they have been allowed to progress.

I hadn’t forgotten past misdemeanours of this disreputable pair, either. Another example of the lack of any moral compass in football.

I thought he'd been playing for another Scottish club for some time. Was that somehow OK?

Although Raith Rovers have done a Uturn they have a signed contract with the player so he will be able to sue them. He will probably do this as no one else is going to want to sign him.

Sarnia….as a footie aside, I hope you are watching what is coming through because of GFC. It’s sparked a huge resurgence in the youngsters and a lot of GY coming on the latest was to Wigan last week.

Galaxy that is a possibility. But no one is pouring money into those jobs, whereas huge amounts are being spent on these boys in training/physiotherapy costs etc. It seems therefore reasonble that some money should be paid towards looking at the problem and who knows there could be a knock on effect for all boys and men.

Is it though?, it may be but what is the rate of violence and sexual violence amongst plumbers, builders and other Male dominated professions. I want to know what the problem is and if its male violence rather than football then we need to look at addressing that.

Doodledog

That does speak volumes, Sarnia.

As for the idea that Val McDermid should have given money to make life easier for male rapists - words fail me. She is a feminist, not a male apologist, for goodness sake. It is absolutely not her responsibility to support schemes to stop men from raping - we should be able to rely on the law for that.

Doodledog Only you could have taken a post suggesting thatthe way football treats young boys who eventually become rapists is somehow support for rapists. What I was suggesting was that if someone is putting money into an organisation that produces damaged young men (and surely if men become wife abusers, rapists and aggressive in their early 20s, not to mention drunks and drug users, they are damaged) and makes millions of pounds from these young men. the least they could do is do something to prevent that happening. Which isn't excusing rapists or making life easier for them it is addressing a problem at its root and hopefully protecting far more young women than ranting at one footballer or one club could ever do. You just get rid of one rapist and leave the others in development. Because that is what taking boys as young as 9 or 10, teaching them they are special, training them in aggression and conflict and giving them inflated egos whilst paying them huge sums as they reach their late teen does, and will continue to do, whatever happens to Goodwillie.

Jerseygirl is new and finding her way about! ?

Jerseygal

Ministers have announced plans to scrap an order forcing all NHS staff in England to get vaccinated against Covid, in a U-turn that will prevent an exodus of thousands of frontline health workers.

Just a chance you're on the wrong thread here.

Ministers have announced plans to scrap an order forcing all NHS staff in England to get vaccinated against Covid, in a U-turn that will prevent an exodus of thousands of frontline health workers.

Blondiescot

I was just about to post an update on that, Sarnia. It is a U-turn for the club, who've clearly only now realised the catastrophic implications of this. However, I do think there are a lot of questions still to be answered though - such as who authorised this signing in the first place, given the concerns which had previously been expressed, and who drew up the press statement regarding the signing, which simply dug an even deeper hole. Given that the new statement refers to the whole thing as an 'unfortunate episode', I think the club needs a new PR person, for starters!

Too true. It shines a poor light on a club that they were prepared to sign someone who has committed such an awful crime because their league table position is more important than anything else. Last night's game only had 60% of their supporters. I wonder if that prodded someone into action this morning. The current crop of footballers with serious charges being investigated need to be made an example of, if found guilty and never be allowed near a club again. We need a few more Karren Brady's in the Board Rooms.

That does speak volumes, Sarnia.

As for the idea that Val McDermid should have given money to make life easier for male rapists - words fail me. She is a feminist, not a male apologist, for goodness sake. It is absolutely not her responsibility to support schemes to stop men from raping - we should be able to rely on the law for that.

I was just about to post an update on that, Sarnia. It is a U-turn for the club, who've clearly only now realised the catastrophic implications of this. However, I do think there are a lot of questions still to be answered though - such as who authorised this signing in the first place, given the concerns which had previously been expressed, and who drew up the press statement regarding the signing, which simply dug an even deeper hole. Given that the new statement refers to the whole thing as an 'unfortunate episode', I think the club needs a new PR person, for starters!

Raith Rovers have issued an announcement that Goodwillie, a convicted rapist, will not now play for the club. The statement says In reaching our original decision we focused far too much on football matters and not enough on what this decision would mean for our club and the community as a whole. That speaks volumes.

Why would you have been happier with Val McD if she insisted any support she gave was used to develop programmes to support and prevent rape or assault

The Raith home attendance last night was 60% of their average, so the paying public weren't too thrilled either.

Add this one to the list of 6 footballers being investigated for rape and sexual assaults:

A 31 year old Everton footballer arrested for alleged child sex offences has had his bail extended for a fourth time. The millionaire footballer, who plays for his country, had his home raided
The Premier League player, who cannot legally be named, is now bailed until April 17 2022.

I'd have been happier with Val McDermid if she had insisted any support she gave should be used to develop such programmes.

Why is it the responsibility of Val McDiarmid to do that? Why is it the responsibility of any woman to do that? Men are the rapists and sexual abusers; it's men who should be addressing the problem and it's them who should be building in the safe guards to ensure that any man who has been convicted of such crimes has no future in football. Women also play football but I'm struggling to come up with one single occurrence of a female footballer who has raped or sexually assaulted a man but you can correct me if I'm wrong trisher.

I've searched extensively and can find only one rugby player who has been accused of sexual assault and the same for cricketers. This would seem to indicate that the problem lies within the sport of football itself. And it's for them to sort out - not the fans, not it's sponsors and most certainly not the victims.

I would need to know the statistics before being concerned that it is football as a profession that is the issue. The rates of assault may be the same in any Male dominated profession it's just if you are a plumber it wont make the front page. Its possible that the entitlement that can come with fame and success may exacerbate it but it's very difficult to say that it is the profession as such that is the issue.

Can't help but compare these footballers to certain Officers in the Met. Such a sense of entitlement and feeling they are above the law. Institutional misogyny, racism etc seems rife.

I do think football as a whole needs a thorough rethink. I don't think it is healthy that children as young as 9 or 10 are started on the route to professional play and are subjected to regimes that promote aggression, rivalry and the need to win. Football has probably caused as much damage to some of the men involved in it as they have caused to women. That doesn't excuse Goodwillie's behavour but it does mean that those running and organising the game and making vast sums of money should be prepared to develop systems and support that not only deal with men already convicted of rape or assault but build in safe guards to prevent this happening over and over again.
I'd have been happier with Val McDermid if she had insisted any support she gave should be used to develop such programmes.