Julia Hartley-Brewer v Stella Creasy

..and again...ouf...

My friend has five well adjusted and delightful children. She tool maternity leave when she was entitled. She's the International Sales Directory for a transnational company, an elder of the church, sits on the board of her youngest child's school and is a trustee for an Asian-based charity.

I didn't have to google her either, she's a real person. No nanny either.

I must remind her that her life has been misguided, she should have stayed at home with her children for 20 years.

I am not criticising people who decide not to work for whatever reason they have for making that decision, but it would be lovely if you could offer the same understanding to people who make other decisions.

took maternity leave.

No tools involved

I bet she has a cleaner!!

volver

..and again...ouf...

My friend has five well adjusted and delightful children. She tool maternity leave when she was entitled. She's the International Sales Directory for a transnational company, an elder of the church, sits on the board of her youngest child's school and is a trustee for an Asian-based charity.

I didn't have to google her either, she's a real person. No nanny either.

I must remind her that her life has been misguided, she should have stayed at home with her children for 20 years.

I am not criticising people who decide not to work for whatever reason they have for making that decision, but it would be lovely if you could offer the same understanding to people who make other decisions.

I do. To be honest it really isn’t of any interest to me what people do. This is just supposed to be about an exchange of ideas and opinions. If it winds people up, there’s no point.

I shall follow GSM, and take myself off.

Have a good evening

No idea. Possibly.

You know what they say - if you want something doing, ask a busy woman.

Of course, there wouldn't be any point in trying to wind people up, would there?

"You can’t put your children first if you’re working. It’s just basic common sense."

I know several women who have spent years working very hard at jobs they didn't want to do in order to pay for the best education they could afford for their children. Surely that is the very definition of working and putting your child first.

I've never worked with a mother who didn't make it entirely clear that their children's welfare was her absolutely first priority.

volver

No idea. Possibly.

You know what they say - if you want something doing, ask a busy woman.

Not cleaning, though.

Callistemon21

I bet she has a cleaner!!

I'd need a cleaner, chef, butler, driver and a LOT of coffee. And wine!!

Coastpath

Callistemon21

I bet she has a cleaner!!

I'd need a cleaner, chef, butler, driver and a LOT of coffee. And wine!!

I had a rota for my DC, the problem was they were always rushing off somewhere important!

DiscoDancer1975

DaisyAnne

DiscoDancer1975

I’ve come to the conversation late, so apologies if I’ve missed something. I was a SAHM, and the thought of working whilst bringing up my children wouldn’t have occurred to me, even if my husband had wanted me to. If that makes me a 1950’s mum...then so be it.

In my opinion, and that’s all it is, children come absolutely first, and unless you need to put food on the table, a mother’s job is her children. If you want a career, it should go on hold, or you don’t have them. Children are so precious, and the best gift of all. Work...you can do anytime.

My doctor once said to me, she often sees women who have regretted working, but none who have stayed at home. She was a working mum herself....and said she sometimes feels she doesn’t do either job properly.

I think the government needs to be paying mums to stay at home, instead of paying other people to look after their children while they work.

Children first....always

So are you suggesting that only you and those who stay at home actually know how, and make sure, they put their children first?

Know how what? You can’t put your children first if you’re working. It’s just basic common sense.

So you are saying that all and only "stay at home mothers", in all circumstances, know best how to bring up their children. And you are also saying all and only "stay at home mothers" put their children first and always do so.

And just how many years must the mother stay at home, not working, to be this miracle worker?

Oh well I come from a long line of women who didn't put their children first then. My mum worked, my gran worked, I worked. We don't seem to have produced neurotic and deprived children but then how would I know? I suppose I am one.

I did everything
sahm
part time
full time
carer
student
add rotation
do I get a special medal?

At 1am with a baby if i was asked to travel t somewhere to vote and the baby was awake and needed feeding i would have took the baby. I don't think it is a big deal

Discodancer1975Thats the thing about working mothers we do all the other stuff as well ..and fit in things some SAHM 's dont .My children are well balanced, sociable good hearted and hard working .Is there anything I could have done better by staying at home with them for years ?
I wasn't short of time,I ran every morning before breakfast for 5 or 6 miles with my sister, until my 40's I weight trained 2 evenings a week ,I did all the PR and book keeping for two businesses and worked in them during the day and on Saturdays . I trained the staff,My children did music lessons and Brownies/Boys Brigade etc ,they had friends for sleepovers and on my Wednesday afternoon off we often had the two wee girls from the corner shop to play in our garden ...their mother took them to work with her to!!
I cooked eveything from scratch oh and did a city and guilds part time course in Professional Cookery ...I got a distinction I did ALL the housework and shopping .I looked after my mum from I was 40 when my Dad died .

I have never had a cleaner .

My children were neither deprived nor neglected and I resent your asserion that only SAHM 's care for children properly .

Hooray for all those women who had more than 24 hours in each day and easily managed more than most other women! Your Oscar equivalent is waiting at the exit. For us normal humans it was often a struggle to fit it all in and still find time to sleep. So much for the sisterhood, you're wrong if you did and wrong if you didn't! Priorities differ, lifestyles differ, capabilities differ, yet somehow we're all judged on a rigid scale that never ever is applied to the male species

paddyann54

*Discodancer1975*Thats the thing about working mothers we do all the other stuff as well ..and fit in things some SAHM 's dont .My children are well balanced, sociable good hearted and hard working .Is there anything I could have done better by staying at home with them for years ?
I wasn't short of time,I ran every morning before breakfast for 5 or 6 miles with my sister, until my 40's I weight trained 2 evenings a week ,I did all the PR and book keeping for two businesses and worked in them during the day and on Saturdays . I trained the staff,My children did music lessons and Brownies/Boys Brigade etc ,they had friends for sleepovers and on my Wednesday afternoon off we often had the two wee girls from the corner shop to play in our garden ...their mother took them to work with her to!!
I cooked eveything from scratch oh and did a city and guilds part time course in Professional Cookery ...I got a distinction I did ALL the housework and shopping .I looked after my mum from I was 40 when my Dad died .

I have never had a cleaner .

My children were neither deprived nor neglected and I resent your asserion that only SAHM 's care for children properly .

Wow....what a trooper!! Sounds exhausting.

Rosie51

Hooray for all those women who had more than 24 hours in each day and easily managed more than most other women! Your Oscar equivalent is waiting at the exit. For us normal humans it was often a struggle to fit it all in and still find time to sleep. So much for the sisterhood, you're wrong if you did and wrong if you didn't! Priorities differ, lifestyles differ, capabilities differ, yet somehow we're all judged on a rigid scale that *never ever is applied to the male species*

The only people "judging" are those saying you are putting your child second if you have a job.

You haven't commented on the fact that you have put forward, as what you call a fact, your belief that all and only "stay at home mothers", in all circumstances, know best how to bring up their children. And you are also saying all and only "stay at home mothers" put their children first and always do so

I would really like to know how you justify that.

My last post to DiscoDancer

volver

Rosie51

Hooray for all those women who had more than 24 hours in each day and easily managed more than most other women! Your Oscar equivalent is waiting at the exit. For us normal humans it was often a struggle to fit it all in and still find time to sleep. So much for the sisterhood, you're wrong if you did and wrong if you didn't! Priorities differ, lifestyles differ, capabilities differ, yet somehow we're all judged on a rigid scale that *never ever is applied to the male species*

The only people "judging" are those saying you are putting your child second if you have a job.

Indeed Volver. And these judgemental people must have been a part of changing the economy. They are also a part of the unwillingness to support those parents and their children. That is unless they didn't vote. It will not take a leap in the dark to guess how they voted.

There is a party which welcome, with open arms, the judgemental and the holier than thou. We all make choices. It should be possible for us all to do that. Knocking other women's choices - or often the necessities of their lives - is about as low as it gets.

I think you're right DD1975, "You can't put your chiodren first if you're working."

This Stella Creasy wasn't sitting in the commons with her knitting. She was there with her baby. She is elected and paid to be in the HoC to play an active role. Not just 'vote' (which coukd have been done by proxy) but to follow the debate and offer contribution. When baby needed attention Stella would have had to give the baby priority. Same with any job. Awful woman using her child for own selfish poloitcal ambitions. Are social services investigating her?

I said right at the beginning....that it’s just my opinion. Those of you incensed by my thoughts don’t make any sense to me. Why does it bother you so much what I think? We don’t know each other. You all made your choices and I made mine.

I, and many other SAHM’s have been made to feel inadequate over the years, for not being ‘ super mum’ and doing it all. Yet at one time or another, all my children have said how glad they were I stayed at home. So many of their friends weren’t happy that both their parents worked. This is my experience.

I never said only SAHM’s know how to bring up their children . I said they simply don’t have time to be in two places at once. Someone has to be with the children.

My children were never looked after by anyone else, unless you count nursery ( two mornings a week, rising to every morning just before they started school), and school itself. Babysitters if we went out in the evening.

I’m tired of being on threads where you’re taken down for your opinions. It’s just not worth it.

HolySox

I think you're right DD1975, "You can't put your chiodren first if you're working."

This Stella Creasy wasn't sitting in the commons with her knitting. She was there with her baby. She is elected and paid to be in the HoC to play an active role. Not just 'vote' (which coukd have been done by proxy) but to follow the debate and offer contribution. When baby needed attention Stella would have had to give the baby priority. Same with any job. Awful woman using her child for own selfish poloitcal ambitions. Are social services investigating her?

I'll ask you the same question then HolySox. So what you are saying that all and only "stay at home mothers", in all circumstances, know best how to bring up their children. And you are also saying all and only "stay at home mothers" put their children first and always do so.

Is this correct?

saying that saying is that

I ran every morning before breakfast for 5 or 6 miles with my sister, until my 40's I weight trained 2 evenings a week

Obviously someone was at home with the children while you did all that, paddyann.
Like Stella Creasy's DH, my DH was away for months at a time.
I didn't have a Mum handy to step in and my MIL was a widow, working full-time with a teenager still at home.

As the children got older, so I was able to increase my working hours. But yes, I did loll around at home for a while doing sweet FA but knitting and sewing.