Sunak due to announce new financial measures, at 11am today.

Under the 10% definition of fuel poverty, households are considered fuel poor if: They have to spend more than 10% of their income* on maintaining an adequate level of warmth.

*income is net income after tax and NI deductions, includes income from benefits and takes account of council tax payments.
(cse.org.uk) More can be found here

Housing Benefit definitely was on the list. I am a little concerned about the "high bills" bit - frankly everyone is going to have high bills with the energy price cap due to increase by around £800 in October. Not sure how they are going to quantify that - I live alone in a one bedroom flat so my bills are clearly not as high as someone in a three bedroom house, but they are high for my circumstances. Sounds like an unnecessary complication for a scheme that has worked reasonably well in recent years.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

It looked like we were all winners, didn't it, biglouis. Yet again the losers only show up later and they are those suffering the most.

OldnProud, if the lady riding the buses is on Pension Credit, this group will still get the £150 automatically.

I wish I could think of a campaign where we could encourage everyone to check whether they should be getting benefits or not. A sort of "I checked for benefits" shout. Or even "I got three friends to check for benefits".

Housing Benefit and Council Tax Support are also means tested benefits but are not mentioned in the list.

So, basically, if I understand correctly, there might lead to the bizarre situation where some of the poorest, who have had no choice but to cut their energy usage down to the bare bones since energy prices rocketed, who have not dared to heat their homes or use their ovens, and whose bills are now relatively low because of that, could actually find themselves penalised for their sacrifice?

That does appear to be the case OldnProud. The others who will suffer a great deal will be those who just don't fit this even more complicated test - those who are just above it. I am trying not to get upset but I do believe people will die.

DaisyAnneSun 29-May-22 23:43:56
...To keep getting the rebate, you'll need to have high energy bills AND be eligible for one of the qualifying means-tested benefits. [Source: Money Saving Expert], ...

...They have said it is intended the Warm Home Discount will go to more people with high energy bills which is a good thing. However, others who have received it in the past, may not get it...

That is very interesting, DaisyAnne.

So, basically, if I understand correctly, there might lead to the bizarre situation where some of the poorest, who have had no choice but to cut their energy usage down to the bare bones since energy prices rocketed, who have not dared to heat their homes or use their ovens, and whose bills are now relatively low because of that, could actually find themselves penalised for their sacrifice?

I'm thinking of the woman who rides the bus all day to keep warm. She and others like her might no longer be spending a big enough percentage of their income on energy (if that is how they will calculate it) to be eligible!

I think they will (for electoral purposes) have to stick to the promise of updating pensions, and certain other benefits, by September's inflation rate, from next April.

However, I'm sure they will find a way of clawing it back in other ways.?

The Warm Home Discount is a separate issue - this has been increased to £150 and has to be applied for through your energy company, applications usually open in October.

They have said it will increase Saetana. Again, I won't hold my breath.

If you are on Pension Credit, you are in the "core" group and it remains the case that you do not have to apply.

However, if the changes happen as they have said they will, from July, this payment will increase to £150. However, only those with high energy costs who claim a means-tested benefit will be eligible under the changes. Those with disabilities who only claim personal independence payments, attendance allowance or disability living allowance, which are not means-tested, will no longer get the warm home discount - affecting 290,000 existing claimants. To keep getting the rebate, you'll need to have high energy bills AND be eligible for one of the qualifying means-tested benefits. [Source: Money Saving Expert]

They have said it is intended the Warm Home Discount will go to more people with high energy bills which is a good thing. However, others who have received it in the past, may not get it. All this makes the benefits system yet more difficult to negotiate and will mean those who are depressed, anxious, don't have access to the internet, etc., may well just give up.

There is a useful chart here showing the Before July 2022 and After July 2022 position.

Sunak has confirmed that the pensions triple lock will be reinstated next year and benefits will be uprated by whatever the inflation rate is this coming September. This means most of us on here will get a substantial rise next April in addition to all the one-off measures.

No, it doesn't Saetana. If I believed it did I would have to believe they had kept their election promise which simply said "We will keep the triple lock." They didn't, did they?

Sunak has confirmed that the pensions triple lock will be reinstated next year and benefits will be uprated by whatever the inflation rate is this coming September. This means most of us on here will get a substantial rise next April in addition to all the one-off measures.

The Warm Home Discount is a separate issue - this has been increased to £150 and has to be applied for through your energy company, applications usually open in October.

Oh and the "windfall tax" on excess profits is not a one-off - it will remain in place until oil and gas prices have returned to something approaching a normal level (sunset clause). This is why it will raise far more money than Labour's one-off windfall tax.

That's good news, I will finally get my pension next April, it's been a very long six year wait.

DaisyAnne

DiamondLily

The reinstatement of the pensioner's triple lock starts about mid April 2023.

I shan't hold my breath.

It will be done. If they don’t they won’t have any chance at all in the next general election, as they will be totally reliant on the pensioner vote.

DiamondLily

The reinstatement of the pensioner's triple lock starts about mid April 2023.

I shan't hold my breath.

Saetana
Sunak said several weeks ago that he was waiting for Ofgem to give an estimate of how much the energy cap was going to rise in October before he announced further measures. This has happened and further measures have been announced. Some people will never be happy, regardless of how much the government does. The "windfall tax" will raise far more than Labour's idea for one, and energy companies can offset some of this tax by investing more in UK gas, oil and renewables.

I'm sorry but you have been taken in by Sunak's statements. Companies already get tax relief for their costs which will include the cost of investing in renewables, repairs to existing plant etc etc. They will even get the 100% investment allowance for capital equipment. The ceiling for this has been temporarily increased to £1 million pa.

There is also relief for R & D costs up to 130% on top of the 100% of the actual costs that would be claimed in a company's accounts. The rules are a b it stricter but nevertheless the relief is available.

We will have to do the best we can because BJ isn’t likely to be going anywhere soon, it’s only his own party that can depose him and there is no widespread move to do that.

There's absolutely nothing we can do about Johnson so how do we do he best we can?

Windfall tax is paid by energy production companies Shell BP etc, principally offshore oil and gas, do we produce much onshore currently?.

Energy sales companies SSE, EDF would pay corporation tax on UK Profits in the normal way, they all don’t produce energy, they sell it to consumers. Some are non fossil energy producers benefiting from the high prices.

volver

Oldnproud

I had assumed that it was the companies who actually produce gas and oil (the likes of BP / Shell) who were hit by the windfall tax, not the companies we actually buy our domestic energy from. Have I got that wrong ?

I think you're right Oldnproud.

So the profits they have already made are subject to the windfall tax, but they can avoid the tax if they invest in more fossil fuels. But the £400 goes via our electric bill, to the utilities provider. E.g. SSE, who made £6.8bn profit last year.

Is that right?

As I understand it - but I could easily be wrong - the £400 is to be credited to our account with our energy company, in the same way that our direct debits are. Yes, the energy company will have it at their disposal temporarily, just like they do with any excess credit we build up with them normally, but when everything eventually balances out, they will be no better off than if the customer had payed with their own money rather than this hand-out. Maybe!

Oldnproud

I had assumed that it was the companies who actually produce gas and oil (the likes of BP / Shell) who were hit by the windfall tax, not the companies we actually buy our domestic energy from. Have I got that wrong ?

I think you're right Oldnproud.

So the profits they have already made are subject to the windfall tax, but they can avoid the tax if they invest in more fossil fuels. But the £400 goes via our electric bill, to the utilities provider. E.g. SSE, who made £6.8bn profit last year.

Is that right?

I had assumed that it was the companies who actually produce gas and oil (the likes of BP / Shell) who were hit by the windfall tax, not the companies we actually buy our domestic energy from. Have I got that wrong ?

DiamondLily

The reinstatement of the pensioner's triple lock starts about mid April 2023.

Thank you

volver

^A lot of it will go into to the energy company profits which is why they have had a Windfall Tax, however they can avoid that if they invest in fossil fuel development in the UK.^

That will increase the self sufficiency for UK energy, a very useful investment for our future.

They can claim exemption if they want to invest in fossil fuel development? Is that right?

The lunatics certainly have taken over the asylum.

Yep

A lot of it will go into to the energy company profits which is why they have had a Windfall Tax, however they can avoid that if they invest in fossil fuel development in the UK.

That will increase the self sufficiency for UK energy, a very useful investment for our future.

They can claim exemption if they want to invest in fossil fuel development? Is that right?

The lunatics certainly have taken over the asylum.