Doctors want a 30% pay rise!

Urmstongran

Hello again volver. Each time I post ...

All I was saying is that I’d agreed maddyone’s family had paid their dues. Quite simple really.

No not each time you post. Only when you post things I want to comment about. Which is how conversations work.

Ilovecheese

You right wingers want a market led society and then object to paying market rates.

Not at all, I am all in favour of paying the right amount for the job.

As long as everyone realises that 30% pay increases will fuel inflation, force the B of E to increase interest rates, prices will rise in all sectors etc.

Large pay increases will add to inflation.

You right wingers want a market led society and then object to paying market rates.

The whole of the public service sector has taken the brunt of austerity. Tory birds are coming home to roost in my opinion.

Hello again volver. Each time I post ...

All I was saying is that I’d agreed maddyone’s family had paid their dues. Quite simple really.

No, hold on here.

The families of people we know (even online ) are OK, but those others I know nothing about....they're not worthy!!!

Absolutely in your family’s case maddyone. I don’t blame them and they’ve more than paid back their dues to the taxpayer via the NHS.

volver

^Will any pay rise however well deserved, shorten the backlog?^

Not giving them a pay rise or improved conditions will lead to people leaving the profession and that can only have one impact on the backlog.

Quite!
Doctors are leaving in droves and why not? They have transferrable skills and the skills are exactly what other countries are looking for. They pay more and offer better working conditions. Why not take advantage of that, no doubt many of you would, if you’d undergone the ten to twelve years of training.

Urmstongran

^I also wonder if we are expected to subsidise the training of these doctors before they start practising in the private sector?^

A point I made earlier MaizieD.

In future, GPs will have no choice but to work in the private sector.

Maya1

I think we must be lucky that we live close to Addenbrookes and Papworth hospitals. We have had to use these hospitals numerous times.
They saved my brothers life, he had a liver transplant in Addenbrookes and Papworth kept him alive with only a 40% capacity lung disease.
Addenbrookes have been fantastic with my husband who also had to have a double transplant 11 years ago.
Through out the pandemic they kept in touch with and saw him where ever possible.They have never let him down.
All the staff at both hospitals are always professional, kind and rushed off their feet. As far as l am concerned they deserve a pay rise.
We feel that we so lucky to have them and are so grateful.

I spent three hours with a consultant at Addenbrooke's yesterday.

Urmstongran

Yes - hospital doctors. Who admittedly have taken much of the workload in A&E these last 2 years.

But still. 30%? The BMA members are considering strike action.

But they're not asking for 30%! They're asking for an above-inflation pay award.

Allsorts

No one I know has seen a GP. Are they still in surgeries? Hidden away in a safe corner, who knows. Everything is passed on to A and E. Everyone else working as normal, loads working very long hours and still can't feed their families. I don't feel sorry for GP. If they were paid for every patient they see I wonder how much they would get. Working from home should be banned. The real heroes are A and E they are coping with everything, they must be on their knees. Shop assistants and other low paid workers carried on all through the worst of the pandemic. I used to thank them, they were just as worried about Covid as we all were, I daresay the doctors were glad of them, so they should treat them.

GPs carried on through the pandemic too!!

Casdon

It’s like Groundhog Day. To repeat, for the second or third time on this thread this pay award is NOT about GPS. GPs are contractors, not NHS employees. It is about hospital doctors.

And Sajid Javid wants to phase out GP partnerships.

Junior doctors work themselves into the ground for half the average pay of a train driver. Can this be right?

I watched my OH sink mentally under the weight of the work - conditions are slightly better now, but the stress is unimaginable. Do we want them all to emigrate to better paid countries with better working conditions? - after we have helped to fund their training.

No-one can blame them for being unhappy about this situation. And no-one should be criticizing them for not working hard enough, when the problems of access to medical services are structural/administrative/political rather than absence of hard work on their part. This government wants the service to be privatised and is happy to watch front line services run down in pursuit of their aim - and let the staff take the flack for things that are not their fault.

Urmstongran

Semantics MaizieD the taxpayer still funds the bulk of the training then the NHS doesn’t get to benefit properly, whether by doctors choosing to go into private practice or abroad. NHS contracts do limit hospital doctors to just 10% of their work. I am more concerned about those who train up then leave (for whatever reason).

Did you know that currently there are more foreign-trained doctors being registered than UK-trained doctors? Let's hope all those other countries don't begin to hang on to their own doctors!

I think we must be lucky that we live close to Addenbrookes and Papworth hospitals. We have had to use these hospitals numerous times.
They saved my brothers life, he had a liver transplant in Addenbrookes and Papworth kept him alive with only a 40% capacity lung disease.
Addenbrookes have been fantastic with my husband who also had to have a double transplant 11 years ago.
Through out the pandemic they kept in touch with and saw him where ever possible.They have never let him down.
All the staff at both hospitals are always professional, kind and rushed off their feet. As far as l am concerned they deserve a pay rise.
We feel that we so lucky to have them and are so grateful.

Will any pay rise however well deserved, shorten the backlog?

Not giving them a pay rise or improved conditions will lead to people leaving the profession and that can only have one impact on the backlog.

Perhaps I worded it badly. I support their pay rise but I’d be more enthusiastic if . . .

Casdon that’s a bit unfair of you. I’m aware of what medical staff did during the pandemic and I did acknowledge that.

I’m well aware they don’t have magic wands and I’m well ware of the length of the backlog.

Hopefully you are fit and well, but if you’re ever in pain, long-standing pain, you may find yourself more interested in getting that dealt with.
Will any pay rise however well deserved, shorten the backlog?

And some companies are taking our money in inflated prices and making massive profits which go in inflated executive wages and dividends to shareholders. They should be taxed,; dividends should be taxed at the same rate as PAYE. Executive pay rates should be capped.

Totally agree. Until this is better and more widely understood, this Government will persist in its divide and rule policies.

Mollygo

If I could get to see a hospital doctor for a problem since the start of Covid, I’d vote for their pay rise. Hospital staff went above and beyond during Covid, but I’m still waiting to get to the top of the backlog pile.
A recent letter said that, in about 3 months, they’d be able to let me know when I could expect an appointment, though there could be a wait of several weeks.

That’s unfair Mollygo. Hospital doctors are working incredibly hard to clear the backlog. It’s through no fault of theirs that the NHS was overwhelmed by Covid, many medical staff themselves died trying to manage very sick patients. Patient numbers in hospital beds, in theatres and in clinics have had to be reduced (and still are being) to keep the vulnerable, who are the majority of hospital patients, as safe as possible. Doctors, and other hospital staff are working flat out, they are prioritising, they fully understand how worried people are about their conditions - but they don’t have magic wands to make it right.

I just wish people were more compassionate about how beleaguered the NHS is at the moment, and less compassionate about this pathetic government who don’t understand, and don’t care what the consequences of their policies are.

The NHS hospital out patient backlog is eye watering Mollygo.

Semantics MaizieD the taxpayer still funds the bulk of the training then the NHS doesn’t get to benefit properly, whether by doctors choosing to go into private practice or abroad. NHS contracts do limit hospital doctors to just 10% of their work. I am more concerned about those who train up then leave (for whatever reason).

If I could get to see a hospital doctor for a problem since the start of Covid, I’d vote for their pay rise. Hospital staff went above and beyond during Covid, but I’m still waiting to get to the top of the backlog pile.
A recent letter said that, in about 3 months, they’d be able to let me know when I could expect an appointment, though there could be a wait of several weeks.

Yes - hospital doctors. Who admittedly have taken much of the workload in A&E these last 2 years.

But still. 30%? The BMA members are considering strike action.