So the Final 2 - Liz and Rishi

Visgir1

Dickens. You are right younger people don't care about Politics.
A few do as my DS was elected a Councillor at 23 yrs brought the mean age of the council down considerably.

Working in the NHS, I work with lots of younger people, they don't bother to vote, just not interested.
Majority didn't bother to vote in the Brexit vote.
And if you ask them thoughts on Party gate, they don't really give a toss just think it was a rubbish party, and not a party as such. Apprently they tell me, there is a difference between a "Gathering" and a Party.

These are all a Graduate Professional Health Care practitioners.
All very bright young people who are the future.
Every Political Party needs to be get these younger ones on board before anything changes.

Congratulations to your DS - that's really heartening to hear.

I spent 4 months in hospital and, naturally, got to chat to the nurses etc. And you're right, it seems the majority are really just not interested in voting.

Considering that the NHS and the salaries of those that work in it are political footballs for governments to kick around, I'd have thought there'd be more interest.

Dickens. You are right younger people don't care about Politics.
A few do as my DS was elected a Councillor at 23 yrs brought the mean age of the council down considerably.

Working in the NHS, I work with lots of younger people, they don't bother to vote, just not interested.
Majority didn't bother to vote in the Brexit vote.
And if you ask them thoughts on Party gate, they don't really give a toss just think it was a rubbish party, and not a party as such. Apprently they tell me, there is a difference between a "Gathering" and a Party.

These are all a Graduate Professional Health Care practitioners.
All very bright young people who are the future.
Every Political Party needs to be get these younger ones on board before anything changes.

... Good Morning Urms!

If 'a week is a long time in politics', then 18 months is... well... a virtual lifetime away .

I just wish there wasn't so much voter apathy. Especially among the young. I've spoken to too many young people who say things like, "Oh, I don't really bother about politics". A young nurse asked me a few weeks back if Boris Johnson was a Labour or Conservative MP . I'm relieved she knows more about nursing...

Universal Suffrage was a hard-won battle (especially for women). They must be sighing in their graves and doing an eye-roll.

Good morning all. Just read a batch of posts on here - it’s a busy thread! I suppose there’s nothing we can do about the change on leadership of the Tory party (apart from moan) but hang fire for 18 months and we will all get the opportunity to vote in a general election. Now THAT will be very interesting.

Callistemon21

nanna8

As a total outsider I think they both look very dodgy indeed. Can’t they get anyone better than those two ?

That's what my Australian relatives said about the choice there ?

...and your relatives are right IMO

Talk off the record to people from Singapore and it is not such a happy little place. It looks great to us tourists and feels safe ,clean and orderly but at a price. I wouldn’t like to think the UK would go down that road or that Orchard come to that.

I can't argue with the sentiment

Have just posted this picture on another thread and the devil in me couldn't resist posting it here too.

Only those who have been members of the Conservative party for at least 3 months get a vote in the upcoming leadership election.

At least the Lords seem to be attempting to block Johnson from creating so many peers. I’m not sure that I can face watching Truss and Sunak tomorrow night but needs must.

I'm inclined to agree, Lovetopaint.

Roll on the GE, and let's hope whoever it is doesn't erode democracy further, to the point that there is no need to have one ?

These posts have depressed the hell out of me. All we can hope for is the leader who does the least damage to the country before the next GE. That has to be Sunak.

That's chilling, Maisie. Seeing it all listed like that shows how far things have gone.

Good twitter thread listing the actions of this government to limit democracy:

twitter.com/RussellEngland/status/1421474756449247238

DaisyAnne

Prentice

Mr Johnson will go, he has said so and really has had no choice but to resign, and has written a letter to that effect.
He has said goodbye in Parliament too.
It would be a conspiracy theory to believe that he will stay in Number 10.
The new PM will be announced early in September.

I think keeping an open mind about what someone, who has already shown he can act well beyond the bounds of acceptable behaviour, would do. I don't think that means we are conspiracy theorists.

Also, we have illustrations around the world of countries turning away from liberal democracy. Parliament is our legislative body. That is why people become MPs - to be able to change the law and move it in the direction they wish it to go.

Governments, including ours, show a rise in attempts to use the law to discriminate against specific individuals or groups. In the last 12 years, MPs have extended their actions to remove legal protection of our basic rights, such as freedom of assembly and free speech. They have also been underwhelming in provision of collective security against all forms of threat while dancing on the international stage via Ukraine. They have just about destroyed the final leg of liberal democracy by ending any thinking about equality in the distribution of our country's economic and social benefits.

Some in this government have said they want to turn the UK into Singapore on Thames. Singapore is a country which has rejected liberal democracy in favour of a one-party state. The people in Parliament who talk up Singapore want just that. Johnson wants it as long as he can lead it.

Burying your head in the sand is simply the lack of imagination that allows dictators to rise and thrive.

Excellent post DaisyAnne

Explain the need for PR to Kier Starmer.

Here here Farzanah.

Someone needs to e plain this to Kirr Starmer.

As I see it we have no checks and balances system in place for our legislative body.
If a PM is elected with a huge majority as recently then they and the cabinet, chosen by the PM has carte blanche to do what they like as described by DaisyAnne.
They are supported by the Whips who have extraordinary power.
I believe Lord Hailsham and more recently Rory Stewart described the system as “elective dictatorship”.
I believe we need electoral reform. Our First Past the Post system is not representative, and leads to a dysfunctional political system.

Prentice

Mr Johnson will go, he has said so and really has had no choice but to resign, and has written a letter to that effect.
He has said goodbye in Parliament too.
It would be a conspiracy theory to believe that he will stay in Number 10.
The new PM will be announced early in September.

I think keeping an open mind about what someone, who has already shown he can act well beyond the bounds of acceptable behaviour, would do. I don't think that means we are conspiracy theorists.

Also, we have illustrations around the world of countries turning away from liberal democracy. Parliament is our legislative body. That is why people become MPs - to be able to change the law and move it in the direction they wish it to go.

Governments, including ours, show a rise in attempts to use the law to discriminate against specific individuals or groups. In the last 12 years, MPs have extended their actions to remove legal protection of our basic rights, such as freedom of assembly and free speech. They have also been underwhelming in provision of collective security against all forms of threat while dancing on the international stage via Ukraine. They have just about destroyed the final leg of liberal democracy by ending any thinking about equality in the distribution of our country's economic and social benefits.

Some in this government have said they want to turn the UK into Singapore on Thames. Singapore is a country which has rejected liberal democracy in favour of a one-party state. The people in Parliament who talk up Singapore want just that. Johnson wants it as long as he can lead it.

Burying your head in the sand is simply the lack of imagination that allows dictators to rise and thrive.

It certainly isn’t funny and we will be stuck with this lot for the next couple of years.
I wonder if in other European countries their tabloid press are as influential in the outcome of elections as in the UK?

???

But it isn't funny, is it!!

No, I don't think if they vote twice both votes will be counted! It's just the latest one to arrive. That is assuming that the party has an adequate computer system to work that...

Even if it does work though, it means that they can change their minds up until the last minute. If the party is run like that, how on earth can they think they can run the country properly? We have the evidence to show that they can't.

mokryna

Now the conservatives have changed the rules allowing Tory 160,000 Conservative Party members members to vote twice incase they have changed their minds.

What ?????

Now the conservatives have changed the rules allowing Tory 160,000 Conservative Party members members to vote twice incase they have changed their minds.

Prentice

Dickens

Prentice

Mr Johnson will go, he has said so and really has had no choice but to resign, and has written a letter to that effect.
He has said goodbye in Parliament too.
It would be a conspiracy theory to believe that he will stay in Number 10.
The new PM will be announced early in September.

It would be a conspiracy theory to believe that he will stay in Number 10.
The new PM will be announced early in September.

So those MPs who are backing a move to get Johnson onto the Ballot paper, and whose comments have been reported in the media, are a figment of the imagination?

Which MPs and what is the evidence that it would happen?
No, it is the rumour mill at work.
Even if his name appeared on the ballot papers, and really, really cannot believe that, he stands no chance at all of being chosen.
It is a done deal as they say, that he is leaving office.

Lord Cruddas told the newspaper that a significant part of the membership still wants the option of voting for the leader who triumphed at the 2019 general election.

“We think it is only fair because Boris was the members choice back in 2019 and he has been constructively removed by the Parliamentary Party without referral to the membership,” he said.

... those are his words.

The senior Tory donor added: “By adding Boris to the final ballot to make it a three-horse race means that the winner will have the backing of the membership. (source: The Independent, 4 days ago).

... and so are those.

It has also been reported in The Daily Mail and the Express.

There are something in the region of 2,000 members who have written to the party chairman to demand they are given the option of voting for Boris Johnson in the leadership ballot.

Whether this move has any chance of being successful is a moot point. But it is neither a 'conspiracy theory' nor part of the rumour mill.

Johnson is still extremely popular with some party members and MPs - and obviously that beneficent donor, Cruddas - so I am not at all surprised at the move.