Port of Dover

MaizieD

^Nothing good will be achieved if we don’t start to work together, and yes, trite it may be, but move on.^

I'm sorry, Prentice, but that is an oft repeated but completely meaningless statement. What 'work' are we meant to be 'working together' at?

Trite and meaningless statements won't make me any less angry that things I valued about being in the EU have been taken from me, and that my country has been dragged into the mire by the most dishonest, corrupt and self seeking PM I have ever known, all in the name of Brexit.

Nor will they make me like or respect the devotees of the Brexit cult.

"Move-on" in this context I believe means the same as "get over it". I've been exhorted to do both as a Remainer. I've also been told I should "get behind" Brexit and variations on the theme of "make this country great again".

My partner and I, both in our 8th decade, continued to run our small technical consultancy agency in a specialised field. Most of our customers are based in Europe. We did it because it helped us to keep up to date with technology and in contact with colleagues from our previous employment. It also provided an extra income which put us firmly in the tax bracket. We thought we were well-prepared for Brexit. The truth is, it has become too time-consuming and cumbersome to continue, so we have fired the one person we employed and closed the business. In the scheme of 'things' this is of little importance, but it was important to us.

I won't "move on" nor will I "get behind" Brexit ( although I'm still not sure what this involves) and the reason I will not be 'getting over it' is because I believe - as someone once said...

"[European Union] EU membership is no longer of key importance to the destiny of this country.” Most of our problems are not caused by Brussels, but by chronic British short-termism, inadequate management, sloth, low skills, a culture of easy gratification and under-investment in both human and physical capital and infrastructure.”

... that person was BORIS JOHNSON. Before it became expedient to do an about-turn.

If you look at - research - some of the tactics used by the Leave campaign... Dominic Cummings encouraging the mantras of Brexit - emphasising the now infamous £350 million for the NHS, playing on people's fears over immigration - nothing could convince that the campaign was anything other than one of manipulation and deceit.

I am forced to accept the referendum result. But I am not obliged to respect it, nor the individuals who voted for it.

It went thus:
UK insisted on leaving EU to control borders.
Including single market.
Therefore, passport checks & stamps, like all 3rd countries.
UK wouldn’t pay for more passport booths at Dover, ignoring warnings.
Today, absolutely predictable shitshow.
Bloody French.

I hear that the UK now want the EU to delay the planned biometric checks due to start at the end of September for third country nationals entering the Schengen zone, because it will make queues at UK ports and the Eurotunnel much much worse.

I despair at the government’s lack of sense, foresight, and mitigating actions about these long-expected issues. They grnuinely don’t seem to care about either businesses or ordinary people.

Maudi

21:08MayBee70

Ha ha pull the other one, it's like the Daily Mail, posters who say they never read it ?

I don’t find anything relating to The Mail, The Sun or The Express remotely funny I’m afraid. Just extremely worrying and quite unpleasant.

So as a result of a dreadful war we're profiteering from fossil fuel provision.

And that's mainly because we don't have enough capacity to store LPG for ourselves because the Tory government wouldn't fund the necessary maintenance on the storage facility.

Yay

Nothing good will be achieved if we don’t start to work together, and yes, trite it may be, but move on.

I'm sorry, Prentice, but that is an oft repeated but completely meaningless statement. What 'work' are we meant to be 'working together' at?

Trite and meaningless statements won't make me any less angry that things I valued about being in the EU have been taken from me, and that my country has been dragged into the mire by the most dishonest, corrupt and self seeking PM I have ever known, all in the name of Brexit.

Nor will they make me like or respect the devotees of the Brexit cult.

But it’s bluddy fantastic isn’t it?

“The UK has drastically increased the volume of natural gas being pumped to the EU amid Russia’s war in Ukraine, powering a record monthly rise in goods exports to the continent despite Brexit.

Figures from the Office for National Statistics show EU goods exports rose for the third consecutive month to £16.4bn in April, the highest monthly level in current prices since comparable records began in 1997.”

We should trumpet our successes. ?
Not everyone is aware of this good news. It’s well worth sharing.
?

Oh there’s more than one example! ?

Urmstongran

Oh I don’t know RP - for example we’ve been helping EU countries during their difficulties.

www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jun/13/uk-gas-oil-exports-eu-amid-russia-ukraine-brexit

One example doesn't express the wider picture.

EU exports fall by 46% following UK exit from single market

Britain’s GDP per head has grown just 3.8 per cent since the referendum, while the EU’s has grown by 8.5 per cent.

21:08MayBee70

Ha ha pull the other one, it's like the Daily Mail, posters who say they never read it ?

Resist. Keep on keeping on. Don't help those who seek to wrong you.

From first petition to parliament to the first woman getting the vote took 86 years of activism and persistence.

Maudi

19:11MayBee70

I wouldn't know I'd don't follow that group on Facebook obviously you do, who knew? a secret well not so secret now Daily Express follower.

I’ve no idea why that paper pops up on my page. I assume it must have popped up one day and I replied to something. It is interesting but unsettling to see how Express readers view the world.

Oh I don’t know RP - for example we’ve been helping EU countries during their difficulties.

www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jun/13/uk-gas-oil-exports-eu-amid-russia-ukraine-brexit

Evidence shows that in many respects we are doing worse than other European nations Urmstongran. This has been repeatedly pointed out on Granset and widely in the media.

Prentice Your calm acceptance is admirable and you are so right, arguing amongst ourselves definitely won't help. However the world has often only changed for the better when people resist, keep on keeping on and are not helpful to those who seek to do wrong.

The pressing worries are making sure we do come out of the Covid Pandemic and can manage it, making sure, as Western Europe and the US are trying to do, that Russia doesn’t get away with a cruel and unjustified war in Ukraine and helping the populace through a severe cost of living crisis.
Many many countries now have these same worries.

We should be able to vote again in the next GE.
However, that has been said several times in the past decades. Shame it was allow six years ago.

19:11MayBee70

I wouldn't know I'd don't follow that group on Facebook obviously you do, who knew? a secret well not so secret now Daily Express follower.

Prentice

There is no point to resisting it RichmondPark1
It has happened and old as I am, I refuse to live in the past.
Why argue about it so many years later?
There are so many more pressing worries just at the moment.
How is it possible to keep on keeping on? How is it helpful?
To vent may be cathartic but that is all.

The people behind the vote leave campaign had been doing so for decades. When it comes to politics you can’t just look at the present. You have to learn from the past and think about the future. The pressing worries at the moment haven’t happened overnight but as a result of mistakes made and lessons not learned.

What makes people unable to accept is the fact that we are now facing a decade or more of decline, difficulty and hardship...a decade where it's now clear we will all be worse off

Much of Europe is going to be in the same boat RichmondPark. The pandemic, the war in Ukraine setting off European inflation and much uncertainty over many issues.

There is no point to resisting it RichmondPark1
It has happened and old as I am, I refuse to live in the past.
Why argue about it so many years later?
There are so many more pressing worries just at the moment.
How is it possible to keep on keeping on? How is it helpful?
To vent may be cathartic but that is all.

Naturally I have experienced some racism and xenophobia mainly in the past Maybee it is impossible to have lived a long life and be black without this, but Britain is so much better in this regard than many European countries.There is still a sense of fairness and respect for the underdog shall we say, than elsewhere.I loved it here from the minute we arrived.
London is the best city in the world to live in and Britain the best place overall, dare I say, to me and many others.

Prentice

Yes, it may take a decade or even more. Choices were made and we must live with the results.Britain will do this though, and more, will perhaps come back as a better place.
Certainly not accepting and moaning will not help anyone.

What makes people unable to accept is the fact that we are now facing a decade or more of decline, difficulty and hardship...a decade where it's now clear we will all be worse off. All this for absolutely no discernable benefit.

Britain has no choice to get through this and yet our leaders have absolutely no idea of the desired end result and no plan of how to get there.

Are you saying we should just accept this without complaint? I ask because to me it sounds as though you are trying to shut down argument and resistance to something that almost half of those who voted disagreed with and which was based on a pack of lies spun by those who serve to benefit.

Prentice

Sarcasm, but I do think of Britain as a land of hope and maybe some glory as well.It is my adopted country and I love it.
Many others who have settled here think this too.

I’m happy for you that you came to this country and like living here. But you obviously haven’t experienced the sort of racism and xenophobia that many people have because of brexit.

We went to France in May and earlier this month . We did queue longer than usual but not to these levels . The French did have fewer booths open than the British but I think blaming Brexit is too simplistic. We are not used to travelling at these levels again since Covid eased. ( I voted for Remain by the way)

Theirs is a land of hope and glory, mine is the green field and the factory floor.

Billy Bragg.