So, who votes for a government that improves the lives of Bankers, and ensures the excessive profits of energy companies, but needs all the "levelling up" money to pay for the holes in Brexit?

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

I would love to learn GSM. Particularly why it is seen to be the main, if not for some the only, vehicle of importance to the economy.

karmalady

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

absolutely. London would not be wealthy without financial services and that would trickle down to everywhere. Many people can only see what is in front of them and don`t have much knowledge about the financial services

The flaw in your argument is that 'trickle down' doesn't work. The last 12 years of tory government has been based on Trickle down' and all it has done is seen an increase in inequality and a drop in the real value of wages.

Increasing the incomes of people who already have enough to pay for all the necessities of life and the non necessities isn't going to encourage them to spend more into the domestic economy, because they don't need to.

OTOH, as I have pointed out to deaf ears so many times before, increasing the wages of the 'ordinary' workers leads to economic growth as they consume more of the goods and services provided by the domestic economy. Hospitality, sport, leisure activities, hairdressers, clothes retailers etc. etc.

We will never achieve any sort of fairness and equality in this country if people insist on approving the greed of the already wealthy and close their eyes to simple economic truths.

I’m sure this will be a real vote winner for the Tories.

I can just imagine voters in the red wall constituencies struggling with the cost of living saying “ those bankers really need a massive yearly bonus”

It seems strange that this seems to be the only benefit of Brexit the government can come up with, most people would, I’m sure, rather they tackle the crisis in the utilities, brought in stricter regulations on discharging sewage into our waterways for one.

Trickle down is a myth. It has never ever happened. Just a sop to persuade voter to go along with inequality and policies that ensure the wealthy keep more of their vast wealth

Financial services aren't all about investment banking.

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

Oh I'm quite aware of how important they have managed to convince some people they are. I also know it's an international market. I simply question the necessity of paying bonuses at such high levels because someone has achieved a certain position. Are there really not efficient people who would work for less?
And I will reveal a personal perspective I have a relative who worked independently in finance, provided a service to banks he charged for, and went off abroad at one point when a foreign bank made him an offer he couldn't refuse. The point being that he was more able than those getting banker's bonuses in this country, but chose to work independently and paid tax accordingly. His income came from services he provided to banks and individuals and not because he was head of anything.

karmalady

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

absolutely. London would not be wealthy without financial services and that would trickle down to everywhere. Many people can only see what is in front of them and don`t have much knowledge about the financial services

Trickle down economics doesn't work. I'd love to know who these "many people" are.

Trickle-down economics assumes that investors, savers, and company owners are the real drivers of growth. It expects these entities will use any extra cash from tax cuts to expand businesses. Investors will buy more companies or stocks. Banks will increase lending. Owners will invest in their operations and hire workers. All of this expansion will trickle down to workers. They will spend their wages to drive demand and economic growth. (Source: Wharton School of Business. "Does Trickle-down Economics Add Up – or Is It a Drop in the Bucket?")

Unfortunately, as far as I am aware, this has never worked. Owners, overall, do not use the tax cuts to expand their business, hire more people or pay better wages. They hoard their wealth and vote Conservative. While they hoard they ask governments to subsidise the wages of their employees that they say the company still cannot afford to pay a real living wage.

Glorianny

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

Oh I'm quite aware of how important they have managed to convince some people they are. I also know it's an international market. I simply question the necessity of paying bonuses at such high levels because someone has achieved a certain position. Are there really not efficient people who would work for less?
And I will reveal a personal perspective I have a relative who worked independently in finance, provided a service to banks he charged for, and went off abroad at one point when a foreign bank made him an offer he couldn't refuse. The point being that he was more able than those getting banker's bonuses in this country, but chose to work independently and paid tax accordingly. His income came from services he provided to banks and individuals and not because he was head of anything.

You are making the same point as I have Glorianny - there are foreign banks paying far more than British ones have been able to - but many of them operate and hire in the UK. We need British banks to be competitive, not hamstrung by a bonus cap.

I see Coffey has advised health workers to avoid the Oxford comma.

If I was a health workers I would reciprocate the kind thought with the advice to avoid cigars, pies, and too much fizz.

Ooooh I’ve used the Oxford comma.

Back to the OP- plenty here on GN it seems! (not me for sure).

growstuff

karmalady

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

absolutely. London would not be wealthy without financial services and that would trickle down to everywhere. Many people can only see what is in front of them and don`t have much knowledge about the financial services

Trickle down economics doesn't work. I'd love to know who these "many people" are.

This isn’t only about money trickling down, growstuff, though there would be an element of that. It’s mainly about maintaining a competitive edge for UK financial services, which are vital to the economy, and increasing tax income without raising taxes.

However, anyone who calls for über left politicies by the LP has to take part of the responsability. If LP members refuse to vote tactically, and refuse to back KS and left of centre politicies which will further damage industry and finance - then even this catastrophic Cons Party might even get in again.

This is a really crass idea to even contemplate when so many in the country are going to suffer real economic hardship this year.
It’s a vote winner for sure ?.
It’s all been said about trickle down economics, and wage rises for the “serfs” but I would have loved double my salary as an annual extra, even if capped when I worked in the health service. There’d be no shortage of staff that’s for sure.
Why can’t we reward people financially according to their benefit to society?

Germanshepherdsmum

Glorianny

Germanshepherdsmum

It seems that some posters are unaware of the importance of our financial services industry to our economy.

Oh I'm quite aware of how important they have managed to convince some people they are. I also know it's an international market. I simply question the necessity of paying bonuses at such high levels because someone has achieved a certain position. Are there really not efficient people who would work for less?
And I will reveal a personal perspective I have a relative who worked independently in finance, provided a service to banks he charged for, and went off abroad at one point when a foreign bank made him an offer he couldn't refuse. The point being that he was more able than those getting banker's bonuses in this country, but chose to work independently and paid tax accordingly. His income came from services he provided to banks and individuals and not because he was head of anything.

You are making the same point as I have Glorianny - there are foreign banks paying far more than British ones have been able to - but many of them operate and hire in the UK. We need British banks to be competitive, not hamstrung by a bonus cap.

Neither the UK nor the EU could have afforded what he was offered Gsm. As I said he was already successful in private finance where the rewards are much greater. The country he went to has much greater resources.
Capping bonuses is largely irrelevant as far as recruitment is concerned. The question is the individual's ability to take risks, or settle for security. But as I said there are very few top level banking jobs and a lot of people with the abilities to do them. Why pay more than you have to?

There are plenty of jobs in finance which pay vast bonuses Glorianny. Look at all the traders for a start. It isn’t just head honchos getting vast bonuses. The US banks for instance will offer very attractive packages, just as the US law firms in London do - something of which I have direct experience. Most people seeking a job would be attracted to the employer offering the best pay package.

Farzanah

This is a really crass idea to even contemplate when so many in the country are going to suffer real economic hardship this year.
It’s a vote winner for sure ?.
It’s all been said about trickle down economics, and wage rises for the “serfs” but I would have loved double my salary as an annual extra, even if capped when I worked in the health service. There’d be no shortage of staff that’s for sure.
Why can’t we reward people financially according to their benefit to society?

‘We’ aren’t rewarding bankers, their employers are. Don’t you think that boosting our financial services industry, vital to the economy, and at the same time raking in a lot more tax, is a good idea?

You need to look beyond envy of bankers’ bonuses to see the benefits to the economy of this move.

Don’t kick those who chose a different, more financially rewarding, career. They pay one hell of a lot of tax.

Germanshepherdsmum

There are plenty of jobs in finance which pay vast bonuses Glorianny. Look at all the traders for a start. It isn’t just head honchos getting vast bonuses. The US banks for instance will offer very attractive packages, just as the US law firms in London do - something of which I have direct experience. Most people seeking a job would be attracted to the employer offering the best pay package.

It’s not that straightforward though is it, you have to want to emigrate, and be accepted by another country, uproot your family, usually on a fixed term basis. It’s all smoke and mirrors because there would be sufficient people of high enough calibre who chose to remain in the UK without the cap being lifted. It’s a political decision, not a decision born of necessity.

Germanshepherdsmum

There are plenty of jobs in finance which pay vast bonuses Glorianny. Look at all the traders for a start. It isn’t just head honchos getting vast bonuses. The US banks for instance will offer very attractive packages, just as the US law firms in London do - something of which I have direct experience. Most people seeking a job would be attracted to the employer offering the best pay package.

Of course there are ways of making more money, which is why it isn't about the level of bonus. It's about job security. Some very able people are risk averse.

You need to look beyond envy of bankers’ bonuses to see the benefits to the economy of this move.

Here's the thing.

Not everyone who wants to see things get better for everyone in society is jealous of the people with a lot of money. I think its just the people with a lot of money who think that.

Don’t kick those who chose a conscience above a Lamborghini. Your tax bill isn't a measure of how good a person you are.

The tax is a bit more useful to society than the Lamborghini volver.

Is the banker with the Lamborghini more use to society than the care home worker?

You need to look beyond envy of bankers’ bonuses to see the benefits to the economy of this move.

Benefit 'to the economy' is completely different from benefit to the people who live in that economy.

No one is 'envious of the bankers'. You are so boring, GSM, trotting out tory mantras which bear no relation at all to the truth. People who can barely afford to live and support their families are too busy working hard to make their money stretch as far as they can possibly stretch it to have time to be envious of anyone.

GDP might be stratospheric, but if only a small section of society actually benefit from it, it cannot be a measure of the health of that society.

Worshiping the acquisition of individual wealth when millions are on dire need is pathetically heartless.

volver

Is the banker with the Lamborghini more use to society than the care home worker?

What do you think his taxes pay for? We can’t all work in care homes can we?