Are young people turning gay?

Lathyrus

They’re called Bi, that’s what the B stands for.

No I think that fitting people into the label you feel comfortable with.

Bi surely means an attraction to both sexes.

But it’s perfectly possible for someone to be heterosexual at one stage of their life and then homosexual at another, without being attracted to the other set at either of those times.

Fluid, in fact.

As my cousin said about his life. “It was always about the person, not what sex they were”.

Exactly so, Lathyrus.

Chestnut

Doodledog You have just written exactly what I was thinking of writing. Are we telepathic? I was just reading about a woman whose husband announced he was gay (not bisexual) after 18 years of marriage and two grown up children. That fits your last comment.

Yes, Chestnut, it definitely happens. It's not really a case of someone being attracted to both sexes, but of changing from one to the other after, in some cases, a very long time of knowing that they are straight*. If people with this experience don't identify as bisexual, why should others have the right to label them as such?

All I'm saying, really, is that I don't think that the idea that people can't 'turn gay' is 'obvious' at all. I don't know, but I think it's unlikely that people can be 'turned' gay, and certainly not in the way Section 28 claimed would happen if they were 'encouraged' by gay teachers, but I do think that people's sexuality can change over time.

*I haven't come across a case of it happening the other way round (ie from gay to straight), but there is no reason I can think of why it wouldn't.

They’re called Bi, that’s what the B stands for.

No I think that fitting people into the label you feel comfortable with.

Bi surely means an attraction to both sexes.

But it’s perfectly possible for someone to be heterosexual at one stage of their life and then homosexual at another, without being attracted to the other set at either of those times.

Fluid, in fact.

As my cousin said about his life. “It was always about the person, not what sex they were”.

Well you might call 'them' 'Bi', Glorianny. Do 'they' get a say in it?

And what would you tell 'them' that 'they' should call themselves if they never go back to being straight?

Maybe 'gender' can be fluid - I don't believe in it, so I do't have an opinion, really. For me, it is a social concept, pure and simple, and has no bearing on the reality of sex. I also see no relationship between gender and sexuality, so the fact that one can be fluid doesn't impact on the other.

Doodledog

*Well, obviously thinking people can turn gay isn't great and obviously isn't true.*

Is it?

There are people who have lived happily as straight until they meet and fall for someone of the same sex. Are you saying that 'obviously' they were always gay, and didn't realise - that you know better than they do about their sexuality? Or would you say that they were lying? Or what, exactly?

I don't know why it matters, really. Sexuality can absolutely be fluid. I don't think there is any doubt about that outside of fundamentalist viewpoints. Sex, OTOH, is immutable, although so-called 'gender' is another matter. It is when people persistently conflate sex, gender and sexuality and assume that what applies in one case must also apply in another that confusion arises.

Doodledog They're called "Bi" it's what the B stands for.

If sexuality can be fluid I wonder why gender can't?

Doodledog You have just written exactly what I was thinking of writing. Are we telepathic? I was just reading about a woman whose husband announced he was gay (not bisexual) after 18 years of marriage and two grown up children. That fits your last comment.

Well, obviously thinking people can turn gay isn't great and obviously isn't true.

Is it?

There are people who have lived happily as straight until they meet and fall for someone of the same sex. Are you saying that 'obviously' they were always gay, and didn't realise - that you know better than they do about their sexuality? Or would you say that they were lying? Or what, exactly?

I don't know why it matters, really. Sexuality can absolutely be fluid. I don't think there is any doubt about that outside of fundamentalist viewpoints. Sex, OTOH, is immutable, although so-called 'gender' is another matter. It is when people persistently conflate sex, gender and sexuality and assume that what applies in one case must also apply in another that confusion arises.

VioletSky

I don't say anything I don't mean

I do hope you have a lovely evening

I don't generally wish ill on anyone

It's just a waste of energy

You say that as though it's not something that we could all say. I very much doubt anyone here is telling lies, wishes harm on anyone or hopes that others have a rubbish evening. At times, I think we all feel that these discussions are a waste of energy, too .

The point is that we see things differently. IMO telling a child to go behind her parents' back, give a private email to an organisation with extremely dodgy personnel on its books, and providing her with the wherewithal to bind her breasts is absolutely wishing ill on her, as is counselling unhappy children that they are 'born in the wrong body'.

I mean what I say when I say that, but of course I think that those who disagree believe their viewpoint too. Similarly, the fact that I have a different POV doesn't mean that I hope those with a different one don't have a lovely evening - why would it?

This sort of virtue-signalling is really irritating, and the assumption that there is any sort of link between having a particular opinion and being a 'kind' person is just nonsense, and posturing about being 'one of the good guys' is where the waste of energy comes in.

Mollygo Another exception might be anyone who says or supports the idea that children are ‘turning gay’, when you either are gay or you aren’t.
I did explain earlier that the OP was a bad choice of words and should have said 'Are more people gay than in the past?' or something like that, not to imply that young people are deciding to become gay.

Rosie51

VS LGBAlliance believe the science that it's impossible to change sex. Therefore they don't think a man can be a lesbian, or a woman can be a gay man. They are in no position to advocate for people that believe the opposite. Do you expect Hindus to advocate for and include Jews in their groups? If a Christian wanted to join a Muslim group and demand complete acceptance of and adherence to Christian beliefs, would you support that?

Possibly not. But as has been said many times on all these threads there are trans people who would completely agree with LGB alliance and behave respectfully to everyone, so surely they should be allowed to join? Or are you saying all trans people believe they change sex? Don't some of them believe it's just gender and isn't that different? Assuming all transpeople think or behave the same and banning them completely can be nothing but prejudice.

I also know enough about religious groups to know that none of the groups you refer to, apart from very fundamentalist organisations, would ban anyone from their meetings and would, and do, greet and welcome people from other faiths who want to learn about them. Saying they don't is either ignorance or prejudice.

VS LGBAlliance believe the science that it's impossible to change sex. Therefore they don't think a man can be a lesbian, or a woman can be a gay man. They are in no position to advocate for people that believe the opposite. Do you expect Hindus to advocate for and include Jews in their groups? If a Christian wanted to join a Muslim group and demand complete acceptance of and adherence to Christian beliefs, would you support that?

VS
And supporting binders as doing no harm rather than sometimes being a better option than other types of harm is not great either.
And yet you supported binders.
As you are fond of saying,
“Oh dear.”

Well, obviously thinking people can turn gay isn't great and obviously isn't true

And supporting binders as doing no harm rather than sometimes being a better option than other types of harm is not great either

But wishing ill on anyone won't achieve anything

I don’t generally wish ill on anyone either, though I make an exception for anyone advocating/supporting the supply of binders to teenage girls, especially with the message that they’ll do no harm. Another exception might be anyone who says or supports the idea that children are ‘turning gay’, when you either are gay or you aren’t.

I don't say anything I don't mean

I do hope you have a lovely evening

I don't generally wish ill on anyone

It's just a waste of energy

Ah well, off I go to have a cup of tea and phone a friend.

Have a lovely evening.

(Recognise that one too??)

VioletSky

Honestly glorianny

I've never come across anything like this before, it's outside my realm of experience in 46 years

Oh come. It’s ne of your favourite techniques.

Plenty of evidence of that.

Just another thing you’ve forgotten you posted I guess.

I wasn’t rude. Do you think I was trivialising a post.

Like you and violetsky did just a while ago?

Sauce for the goose eh?

Honestly glorianny

I've never come across anything like this before, it's outside my realm of experience in 46 years

VioletSky

Here you go, the full list in a picture in this article

www.pinknews.co.uk/2021/04/29/lgb-alliance-uk-pride-organisers-network-charity-commission-letter/

As I said

I wonder if Lathyrus will apologise for being so rude. After all being considerate to other posters is always important to her.

Lathyrus the full objection letter is pictured in the article

That is what I was looking for

April 2021? Hardly current.

Pink News. Hardly objective.

You’ll have to do better than that.

The Medieval satellite? Conspiracy Theory News.

Just about as valid

Took me a minute to find it

That's enough Internet for today

Here you go, the full list in a picture in this article

www.pinknews.co.uk/2021/04/29/lgb-alliance-uk-pride-organisers-network-charity-commission-letter/