Petition : *Update the Equality Act to make clear the characteristic “sex” is biological sex*

Obviously I would not say that to him. But I can think it and say it anonymously, here.

Rosie51

Fleurpepper if your niece went through a male puberty then she most definitely does have a male skeleton, even if that is a 'petite' one. The angle of the pubic arch will be smaller than that of a female skeleton, it's just a fact of nature. Your nephew, before transition to your niece might well have been a very petite male, but would still have had the proportions within the male scale. You really shouldn't get so offended. As for 'Big Pharma", yes USA pharmaceutical companies are making a fortune from the prescription of cross sex hormones, which are a lifetime commitment for transgender people. 50 years or more on daily drugs is a surefire income. Surgeons in the USA involved in transgender surgeries are also coining it in. There's an Irish female doctor who operates in Miami who delights in her TikTok name of 'Dr Teetus Deeletus' and now does 400-500 double mastectomies a year on transgender ftm. Shares photos and videos on TikTok of patients (some young teenagers) with their mastectomy scars and celebrates. If you don't see that as financially driven.....

Thankyou for backing me on the huge profit being made by companies and Dr's who are benefiting from people being Trans.

Having seen and heard the suffering , trauma and difficult risks my friend is going through I don't see his Trans life as a good option for him. I feel that perhaps body positive counselling to accept oneself would be better than body changes.

Fleurpepper

Big Pharma? Pardon? Really?

My niece was always petite, and she transioned aged 18/19. She does not have a 'male skeleton' or pelvis. You would NEVER EVER know. Changed her name and is married to a 'normal' man and his called Mrs /female name/ xyz (her husband's surname.

Yes and as I have already mentioned, I have a friend who has also successfully transitioned , looks a handsome man and is happily married to a woman.

But they will be on a cocktail of prescription drugs for life, which they said they would stop taking if they got pregnant because they are risky and would be risky for a baby. Unless my friend has a hysterectomy he is at increased risk of womb cancer because of these medications, but feels it's worth the risk. He feels he is not ready for the hysterectomy, but feels the pressure of living with the threat. I don't think some people understand the added pressure that comes with having periods as well as being on huge amounts of testosterone, with the added threat of cancer and confusing symptoms of wanting a child but having body dysmorphia and also being at odds with the female body.

I have listened long to my friend's dilemmas and am a supportive friend. I also have concerns about the medications and think many people don't understand the struggles trans people face, which is why I have shared some things.

If a Male goes through male puberty there are numerous differences I am afraid, the angle of the pelvis is one of them, muscle mass etc are also different following Male puberty, it's one of the reasons transwomen in female sports is unfair.

Fleurpepper if your niece went through a male puberty then she most definitely does have a male skeleton, even if that is a 'petite' one. The angle of the pubic arch will be smaller than that of a female skeleton, it's just a fact of nature. Your nephew, before transition to your niece might well have been a very petite male, but would still have had the proportions within the male scale. You really shouldn't get so offended. As for 'Big Pharma", yes USA pharmaceutical companies are making a fortune from the prescription of cross sex hormones, which are a lifetime commitment for transgender people. 50 years or more on daily drugs is a surefire income. Surgeons in the USA involved in transgender surgeries are also coining it in. There's an Irish female doctor who operates in Miami who delights in her TikTok name of 'Dr Teetus Deeletus' and now does 400-500 double mastectomies a year on transgender ftm. Shares photos and videos on TikTok of patients (some young teenagers) with their mastectomy scars and celebrates. If you don't see that as financially driven.....

Big Pharma? Pardon? Really?

My niece was always petite, and she transioned aged 18/19. She does not have a 'male skeleton' or pelvis. You would NEVER EVER know. Changed her name and is married to a 'normal' man and his called Mrs /female name/ xyz (her husband's surname.

Follow the money!

Big Pharma. Getting a bit conspiracy theory-ish.

When I was young it was normal for a girl to be a tomboy or a boy to have long hair. There was none of this torment or need to change oneself that seems to accompany today's kids. I do think that Big Pharma has a part to play, since kids transitioning is lucrative for them and you have people who will need a lifetime of prescription drugs.

I used to say I wished I was a boy because boys seemed to get a better deal in life. Things were still very sexist, but improving. Looking back, I am grateful I was born in that generation so that I was not ushered into a clinic and put on a lifetime of expensive, risky and full of side effects drugs to change gender.

An intrusive question is also recorded as a hate crime for those who wonder why the paedophile wasn’t questioned as to a previous name.

A couple of years ago I saw an article saying how shocking some 'transphobic' stickers were (which said things like 'Women don't have penises') and the local LGBTQ society said "Report every sticker to the police. We need the stats."
Hate crimes which involve someone seeing a factual sticker are not what I'd call crimes.

Yes @Varian as I found out. I had previously always thought that skeletons had to be male or female, as I'd been educated that way.

However, I think people are still Chromosomally male or female, unless someone can correct me on that?

it could do. I can see that that could impact on say height and maybe bone density but not the size of a pelvis.

I suppose it does depend on the age where transition starts.

But they knew she was trans, so had changed her name. Why couldn't they have asked for the original name and run a check on that?
Because they believed it would be discriminatory.
And the crimes were under the previous transwoman name of Katie Dolatowski so nothing would have shown up under his previous male name, unless there were also previous crimes of course.

I don't know but I think if a child takes puberty blockers and /or hormones from an early age then it might alter their skeleton? I have heard that a boy transitioning to a girl may not grow as tall but I don't know what happens to a girl's hips when she is transitioning to a boy.

I have always thought there were either male and female skeletons but perhaps the only difference to this could be when a child begins transitioning early so that maybe their skeleton doesn't develop as it would have? In googling this I read the sad story of David Reimer, forced to grow up as a girl- and now wish I didn't.

I agree with you Smileless when we are looking at competitive sport.

It is for the relevant sports governing bodies to make decisions about whether or not transwomen can realistically compete against other women. I don't think the sporst authorities have a problem with transmen.

I don't see how puberty blockers or any other medical intervention could affect a skeleton being identified as male or female, as my understanding is that the dimensions of the pelvis can never be in dispute.

The only difference I can anticipate there being to skeletons is in the case of a young child who identifies as trans being given Puberty Blockers. In that case it may be harder to identify a person's sex by their skeleton. Although I think it may be impossible to alter a person's basic chromosomes from their birth sex?

DaisyAnne

^There are male and female skeletons and male and female chromosomes. There are also people who are born intersex. Then there are also those who identify with a sex that is not there biological sex, so have chosen to change their appearance with surgery or hormones. All of that is truth.^

It's not truth. It's all you know currently. Do you never expect anyone to discover more, or do you just think you know everything we will ever know?

If someone has discovered some new truth feel free to share it here.

I do prefer to stick to the facts.

It's not truth. It's all you know currently. Do you never expect anyone to discover more, or do you just think you know everything we will ever know?
There might one day be a discovery that in 2017 or thereabouts there was a currently unexplained event that caused an exponential growth in the numbers of people discovering that their so-called 'gender' was wrong. Who knows? There are very many things that the future might bring, but we can't act on them until we find out what they are.

Meanwhile, we are being told that homosexuality is 'same-gender attraction' (with the attended difficulties for lesbians), that Violence Against Women And Girls is 'gender-based violence' (so figures for attacks on transwomen are mixed in with DV and other male on female violence, and nobody can dispute claims that transpeople are 'the most marginalised group in society'), that sportswomen are now competing in a 'gender class' instead of against other women, and so on. I'd rather deal with that now, along with all the other losses of rights, safety and dignity currently being imposed on women, and think about the future when it arrives.

Glorianny

I'm just interested because it seems to me that as most of the authorised channels plainly exhibit tendencies towards the sort of discrimination hate crime stems from, it would be very difficult to collect any sort of figures from them. The police for example are known to be racist, misogynistic and transphobic, so it is highly likely that a lot of people will not report to them. So what you seem to be saying is that the personal experiences reported have no value because they haven't been processed properly. But surely even if you discount some of the reported incidents the increase is worrying?

This should have been the quote at the top of that post

Lathyrus

Yes. I don’t take any report or research at face value without questioning who commissioned it, who carried it our, what where the criteria and methods, who does it advantage/disadvantage.

Not the Government, not stophateuk, not the Milk Marketing Board, if it still exists.

Follow the money
Follow the agenda
Even follow the need to win an argument regardless 😬

I’m not discounting anybody’s personal experience.

You only have to read briefly their methods of triangulation though to see that they have conflated data and failed to differentiate n order to suit their agenda.

Collecting data on hate crime is incredibly difficult but, as we can see from these threads, what one person sees as protecting themselves and their family, another sees as a hate crime against themselves. If you take insistence on
being allowed women only swimming session as an example who is suffering the hate crime. The trans person with the obviously male body or the Muslim woman who is knowingly and deliberately prevented from using that facility.

I would strongly question their conflating Lesbian and Gay hate crime into one figure with trans since we know there has been tension between those groups and incidences of harassment on both sides.

I also very much object to them using the term cis to identify those people who have maintained the gender that is commonly identified with their sex. Numerous protests have been made about this term which is a label used by trans and is not acceptable to gender constant people.
Using it knowing that is a hate crime as much using as any other derogatory term and reveals the underlying bias of the organisation.

So no I don’t think think this is an unbiased report from disinterested parties. I think it is faulty in a number of other respects.

I would I include it with reservations, as part of a range of reports from varied sources, but do not believe it is valid as primary evidence.

Currently what we know about Boris Johnson is that he is a liar, and didnt seem to be able to manage many of the responsibilities of his role, any role to be fair, in the future he may be re elected and prevent world war 3. I reserve the right to comment on his current performance rather than an imaginary one.

Yes DaisyAnne
It's not truth. It's all you know currently. Do you never expect anyone to discover more, or do you just think you know everything we will ever know.
That’s so true about so many things.
In time to come we could have self healing bodies which will eliminate the harm from knife or bullet attacks.
Or medically approved mind-wipes which will eliminate PTSD.

Until that happens we protect people from what exists as ‘truth’ now.