Woman found guilty of raping two women. Remanded in custody for sentence end February

So you want all trans people, who may not be members of the same organisation or even a member of any organisation at all, to affiliate themselves with disgusting behaviour by apologising/denouncing it?

You want them to shoulder the blame by doing that? To soothe your feelings on the matter they must take personal responsibility for a criminal element that exists in every demographic?

No that's not a reasonable expectation at all

On a singular personal level, trans people can and do call out the things you describe and are outraged by it.

Some do not mention it at all for fear of attracting unwanted attention

Some trans people are not "out"

Some trans people are minors

Having the expectation that they all do it in such a way as you personally get to hear it is unrealistic and unfair

Especially if you are not actually visiting the places you can hear trans people speak and get to know them

If the trans gender community doesn't stand against the few who think it's acceptable to threaten to rape, murder, behead women they accuse of being terf then yes, their silence is condoning this despicable behaviour, and doing absolutely nothing positive for their cause.

Their silence is deafening isn't it. They want to identify as women and yet say nothing in defence of the natal women they wish to identify as.

VioletSky

Oh come on Mollygo

Just because I am a parent

That was low

But you said it. VS.

VioletSky

Iam

Have you spoken to all of them?

How do you know they haven't?

Does it have to be to you personally?

Iam64
I stand with Mollygo - I’m waiting for the trans community to state thst threatening to rape, murder, behead women they accuse of being terf is just wrong.

What, do you want to line these people all up and demand they swear officially or something.
Why would they need to do that?
They make all their other statements public. They gather together in crowds to attack females and announce it to the media who are in attendance or post them for the admiration of the TSP on Twitter or Facebook.
Is using technology not suitable for trans to say that the actions of some abusive, cheating, or the latest excuse according to . . . fake trans is wrong?
Why is it not suitable? They could even do it anonymously in the same way as many of them perpetrate the attacks and threats.

Husband "so what's on the trans agenda tonight then?"

Me "Apparently someone from the trans community needs to apologise for rapists existing and denounce all hate speech towards those who claim GC feminism on behalf of all transpeople"

Husband "people need to apologise for things they haven't done and denounce things they haven't said?"

Me "yep"

Husband " surely someone has to tell them how ridiculous that sounds"

Me *puts hand up

Who is appointed spokesperson for transpeople?

Do women have an appointed spokesperson? Or men? Or red heads?

Wyllow3

The nature of the wording and attitude expressed in the whole post, Callistemon21.

In the context of the whole post, it feels like a demand, given that "waiting" is pretty much the same in terms of what it actually asks.

It implies that a response should be forthcoming:

I wished to make the point that this is not reasonable in my opinion.

I think it's a fairly reasonable expectation that a spokesperson might make a public statement condemning this and assuring the public that this is not on their agenda.

Crikey the language has changed already, so far today I have heard two politicians on TV refer to this man as a he, and BBC news has just allowed the term trans identified males to be used.

The nature of the wording and attitude expressed in the whole post, Callistemon21.

In the context of the whole post, it feels like a demand, given that "waiting" is pretty much the same in terms of what it actually asks.

It implies that a response should be forthcoming:

I wished to make the point that this is not reasonable in my opinion.

Oh come on Mollygo

Just because I am a parent

That was low

VioletSky
Realistically there should be a seperate prison for that type of offender but there is probably some question of whether that infringes on their rights to visitors etc

But personally I would put safeguarding above rights as we do in many other situations

HMP Whatton (Nottinghamshire) is where male sex offenders are usually placed as far as I can tell - certainly in the Midlands.
I worked with a number of men who were released from Whatton.

VioletSky

I'm not going to apologise on behalf of parents murdering their children just because I am one Mollygo

That's not logical

What I can do is safeguard children

You are a parent who murdered children?
I wouldn’t have believed it, but if you say you won’t apologise on behalf of parents who murder their children because you are (such a) one . . .

VioletSky

OK so what's the problem then? Is the problem that we agree on something?

Are you saying that you agree that men will feign trans status in order to access women's spaces?

waiting is not demanding, Wyllow.
How did you extrapolate that from what Iam64 said? 🤔

I'm sure your friend would not approve of such threats of terrorism but a spokesperson could stand up and assure us all that such violence is roundly condemned by the transgender community.

Or should we be left to believe that a deafening silence might mean tacit approval of such threats?

OK so what's the problem then? Is the problem that we agree on something?

VioletSky

You are turning it into a logic puzzle based on my stance being the wrong one in your mind doodledog

You dint have to respect my feelings on this but considering them will help you understand a different point of view

It's not a logic puzzle. It's an obvious contradiction.

According to your comment above, your stance is that a man who fakes having gender dysphoria to access women's spaces 'is not a transwoman'.

I agree - which is why I don't think that men should be able to access women's spaces - there will be men who are not transwomen who fake gender dysphoria in order to do it.

And those who don't even bother to do that, but just say 'I am a woman' and are allowed in.

Iam64

I stand with Mollygo - I’m waiting for the trans community to state thst threatening to rape, murder, behead women they accuse of being terf is just wrong

What, do you want to line these people all up and demand they swear officially or something.

Why do I have some kind of right or indeed necessity to ask my one trans Quaker friend "what is her position on this that and the other?"

she's a Samaritan and 70. she has friends who are and aren't trans and I have no right to demand what you are asking.

Iam

Have you spoken to all of them?

How do you know they haven't?

Does it have to be to you personally?

I stand with Mollygo - I’m waiting for the trans community to state thst threatening to rape, murder, behead women they accuse of being terf is just wrong

I'm not going to apologise on behalf of parents murdering their children just because I am one Mollygo

That's not logical

What I can do is safeguard children

The accused has been transferred to a male prison. On R4 news today.

I'm in favour of self ID but not of convicted offenders using other's genuine need to change gender as an excuse to possibly offend further.

Iam64

Who are you asking VioletSky

Open question

VioletSky

So, if trans people respect women's safe spaces

Can you respect their pronouns?

VS is this yet another diversion.
If all trans people respect female safe spaces, . . .

Then using a plural pronoun for a singular person might become more acceptable.

Do you think the first premise is likely?

If all trans people stood up and said that what the few violent, lying, fake trans and the TRA are doing is wrong, that would be an even greater incentive.

I won’t hold my breath, waiting for that, and neither should you.

You are turning it into a logic puzzle based on my stance being the wrong one in your mind doodledog

You dint have to respect my feelings on this but considering them will help you understand a different point of view

VS I have read back, and this is what you said:

Any man pretending to have gender dysphoria in order to have access to victims is not a trans woman.

So. When we say that there are men who fake being transwomen in order to access women's spaces we are (a) wrong, and (b) transphobic. But when you say it it is (right, and (b) kind?

This is like plaiting fog.