Braverman's propaganda

I've traced some of my family lines back 13 generations and I'm about as "English" as anybody could be.

Go back a little further and some of those pesky foreigners creep in.

I posted this on the genealogy forum a few days ago:

www.historytoday.com/archive/englands-first-refugees

It could have been written about the situation today.

volver3

Gosh, what a memory you have tickingbird. You're a bit confused though.

My ancestors came in from Doggerland, (I think you laughed about that...or maybe it was somebody else...). Whatever, the fact that on at least one line I have genes that can be traced back to the original settlers on these Isles does not mean that I don't have genes from later settlers. I certainly have Irish ancestors. Probably some Vikings too. Incidentally 10,000 years ago there was no England or Scotland. Maybe you missed that bit.

What you also missed is that no-one is advocating open borders and that Brexit has made it more difficult to deal with the people arriving on our shores.

There wasn't even a country called "England" until about 1000 years ago.

tickingbird

^What are they doing that is illegal?^

Entering a country without a passport or documentation - illegal by any country’s laws I imagine.

You imagine wrong!

It is not illegal to enter a country without a passport or documentation, provided an immediate application for asylum is made.

tickingbird

^What are they doing that is illegal?^

Entering a country without a passport or documentation - illegal by any country’s laws I imagine.

Ah, your imagination letting you down a bit there tickingbird. It's not illegal to arrive undocumented in any country with the intention of claiming asylum.

More broadly, I think this is where the propaganda of Braverman and her peers has most succeeded.

Much of the population think that it's illegal to arrive here in a small boat. They also think we are being overrun by migrants out to get something over on us. And that being put up in the 4* hotels is every migrant's dream

They also never give a second thought to the fact that everybody wants people removed from the country if they do not have a reasonable claim to settle here. And that the people who come here are being used by the Tory government to cause division in the UK population.

I don't suppose I should be surprised that so many of the UK population are so gullible, but it is still a disappointment to me.

tickingbird

^My ancestors came in from Doggerland, (I think you laughed about that...or maybe it was somebody else...). Whatever, the fact that on at least one line I have genes that can be traced back to the original settlers on these Isles does not mean that I don't have genes from later settlers. I certainly have Irish ancestors. Probably some Vikings too. Incidentally 10,000 years ago there was no England or Scotland. Maybe you missed that bit^

No volver it is you that’s confused. I didn’t laugh and didn’t comment either AND that isn’t what you posted at the time. Am I surprised? No. Same old, same old…..,

Oh, I know why you're confused!

All the people on my tree going back about 8 generations are Scottish. That's about 200 years. But there are Irish-origin surnames there, which indicates some of the people came over from Ireland in previous generations. Given where I live, it would be miraculous if there were no Vikings in my ancestry. But, at least some of my ancestors arrived 10,000 years ago by walking in from Doggerland.

Its confusing for some, this genealogy thing, isn't it tickingbird? We can start a new thread in the Genealogy forum, if you'd like to understand a bit more?

😉

Sorry growstuff missed your post re this.

Oreo

Why continue with ridiculous 10,000 year old migrant themes
Maremia
We’re talking of the here and now and what to do about 45,000 or more illegal immigrants landing here in small boats.

Oreo - until we process their applications for asylum how do we know who is illegally here??

Lizbethann55

Perhaps we should just shoot all the old people to allow space for all these illegal immigrants. Where should we start? 100 years olds? 90? 80? 70?. That should solve the problem of an aging, useless population. Think of all the money the country would save in pensions. It would solve the staffing in care homes crisis and stop the hospital bed blocking.

No need the Tories have successfully reduced life expectancy by 2 years recently.

So keep voting Tory and it will sort out the problem.

Milliedog - where in the UK do your grandchildren live?

I'm referring to your statement that your grandchildren are the
only ones in their class with English as their first language.

I can understand some areas having high ethnic mixes (as ours does) but is it a particular quirk of their address?

What are they doing that is illegal?

Entering a country without a passport or documentation - illegal by any country’s laws I imagine.

My ancestors came in from Doggerland, (I think you laughed about that...or maybe it was somebody else...). Whatever, the fact that on at least one line I have genes that can be traced back to the original settlers on these Isles does not mean that I don't have genes from later settlers. I certainly have Irish ancestors. Probably some Vikings too. Incidentally 10,000 years ago there was no England or Scotland. Maybe you missed that bit

No volver it is you that’s confused. I didn’t laugh and didn’t comment either AND that isn’t what you posted at the time. Am I surprised? No. Same old, same old…..,

Perhaps we should just shoot all the old people to allow space for all these illegal immigrants. Where should we start? 100 years olds? 90? 80? 70?. That should solve the problem of an aging, useless population. Think of all the money the country would save in pensions. It would solve the staffing in care homes crisis and stop the hospital bed blocking.

Sparkynan, as I post regularly ( sigh) population growth nationally is due to old people living longer. Imported, by whatever route, young people is not the source of the growth. We are having fewer children than any time in history. I don't wish to become embroiled in the Rwanda debate, but I would like contributions to be based on data. Although I understand that life expectancy is starting to drop, so, clearly some progress is being made on Plan B to stop population increase...

Population of Manchester 552,000 in 2021

The total number of recorded migrants crossing in 2022 was 45,756
(www.dw.com › en › uk-record-number-of-migrants-cross)
This does not include people entering UK on larger vessels, or in any other way.

So following on this trend. in approx 12 years time the UK will have another city the size of Manchester…

This does not include Asylum and Immigrants seeking legal routes into the UK.

What are we to do?.. and we need to take into consideration the coming Climate disaster that’s going to affect everything. What are our Grandchildren going to do????

It seems some people would just like to look the other way, shrug their shoulders and say none of it is the UK's problem.

They might even say how terrible the situation is in other countries, but it's nothing to do with us. Virtual signalling at its finest!

Oreo

Why continue with ridiculous 10,000 year old migrant themes
Maremia
We’re talking of the here and now and what to do about 45,000 or more illegal immigrants landing here in small boats.

What are they doing that is illegal?

grandmac

HousePlantQueen

Have you seen what is happening in Iran, grandmac? Have you seen the photos of the young men who have been hanged because they dared to protest against the brutal murder of a young woman imprisoned for not wearing a hijab properly? Maybe you don't care, but I looked at them, saw the face of my son of the same age who is alive and safe because he was born here. And I wept.

Yes I know exactly what is happening in Iran as I have many relatives living there. And it is actually worse than is shown in our media. But I still can’t condone illegal immigration.

What do you mean by illegal immigration?

Oreo

Only the Iranian people can overturn their murderous regime.
There are plenty of other regimes just as bad in the world sadly, and even sadder there are many people in those countries who support them.

It’s even sadder that in a formerly proud democracy like the UK people are unable to see what is really happening under this government. In fact, it’s unforgivable.

MaizieD I take your point but I think 200 is the maximum figure for export at a cost of £120 million? So quite minimal impact on population arguably with welcome revenue to a poor country?

Only the Iranian people can overturn their murderous regime.
There are plenty of other regimes just as bad in the world sadly, and even sadder there are many people in those countries who support them.

Could you support legal migration from Iran then? Or just leave the Iranian state to murder it's own citizens?

ronib

MaizieD did not think Braverman said anything about population density but rather the aim is to disrupt people smuggling and its mode of operation. Basically don’t arrive here in small boats if you want to be allowed to stay. I am sure I didn’t imagine the speech…. Braverman seems to think it’s going to work.
Also clearly Rwanda needs the income from the enterprise.

Braverman has said nothing about population density. I was just posting the figures for the benefit of posters who keep telling us that the UK can't take any more people because it's overcrowded.

So we're proposing to send them off to an even more overcrowded country... With nothing like the level of public services we have (even accounting for the fact that ours have been wrecked by the tories)

HousePlantQueen

Have you seen what is happening in Iran, grandmac? Have you seen the photos of the young men who have been hanged because they dared to protest against the brutal murder of a young woman imprisoned for not wearing a hijab properly? Maybe you don't care, but I looked at them, saw the face of my son of the same age who is alive and safe because he was born here. And I wept.

Yes I know exactly what is happening in Iran as I have many relatives living there. And it is actually worse than is shown in our media. But I still can’t condone illegal immigration.

Why continue with ridiculous 10,000 year old migrant themes
Maremia
We’re talking of the here and now and what to do about 45,000 or more illegal immigrants landing here in small boats.

Oreo, when is your cut off era for being a 'true native' of these islands?