Diane Abbott suspended from the Labour Party

'To suggest Jewish people who hide their Jewishness by not wearing specific clothing, not sending their children to religious schools etc are avoiding discrimination is nonsense.'

they have that choice, someone with black skin does not, that is the point. And where did anyone say Synagogues and schools do not need protection??? What about Islamic schools, do you think they deserve protection?

Fleurpepper

Galaxy

I think there is also another layer to the racism faced by Jewish people, its here on this thread, their experiences are frequently minimised, its connected I think with the tropes around money and success.
I watched Jewish people receiving daily abuse online, just pop on to the Twitter feeds of any celebrity who is Jewish if you dont believe they dont experience daily abuse.

No, not at all.

Thanks Galaxy.
The Jewish museum in Berlin illustrates the way Jewish people have suffered anti semitism throughout time. To suggest Jewish people who hide their Jewishness by not wearing specific clothing, not sending their children to religious schools etc are avoiding discrimination is nonsense. Synagogues and schools need protection. Outside one north Manchester primary school, it isn’t unusual to hear a passer-by shout ‘can you smell gas’

Diane Abbott didn’t send this letter in error. There are local elections soon. She’s attempting to cause trouble for Starmer. She’d rather have the tories in than Labour.

Jackiest

The Windrush boat came to England in 1948. That was not a scandal, they were happy to come and there was work for them and housing. The scandal which was the hostile environment policy came to light in 2018 was created in 2012 sothe scandal started then.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windrush_scandal

Well it is true that they were happy to come and expected a warm welcome and jobs and housing. But that was not the experience for may after they arrived, sadly!!

Curtaintwitcher

I'm afraid I don't understand all this obsession with racism. Consider the number of black, Asian and Jewish people in government. They were all voted into office by the British electorate. If racism was really as rife as those in power suggest, not a single one would be an MP.
The problem with Dianne Abbott and many others in the public eye (including a certain woman who married a royal), they see all slights and criticisms as being racial when it is more likely their personality that is at fault.
I know racism does exist, white people are victims of it too, but some people are obsessed by it.

I think that those experiencing racism very regularly in their lives might understandably feel a bit obsessed by it! A black teenager walking along the road to the station getting stopped and searched 8 times in 1 month! (Son of a friend of mine) for instance. He's not obsessed actually, he's scared ..and so is his mother!!

Oh dear … you really have no idea.

I'm afraid I don't understand all this obsession with racism. Consider the number of black, Asian and Jewish people in government. They were all voted into office by the British electorate. If racism was really as rife as those in power suggest, not a single one would be an MP.
The problem with Dianne Abbott and many others in the public eye (including a certain woman who married a royal), they see all slights and criticisms as being racial when it is more likely their personality that is at fault.
I know racism does exist, white people are victims of it too, but some people are obsessed by it.

Fleurpepper

I am denying the statement made by Galaxy. No-one has done this on this thread.

I agree.

I am denying the statement made by Galaxy. No-one has done this on this thread.

What do you mean Fleurpepper? I don’t understand.

Galaxy

I think there is also another layer to the racism faced by Jewish people, its here on this thread, their experiences are frequently minimised, its connected I think with the tropes around money and success.
I watched Jewish people receiving daily abuse online, just pop on to the Twitter feeds of any celebrity who is Jewish if you dont believe they dont experience daily abuse.

No, not at all.

Galaxy
^I think there is also another layer to the racism faced by Jewish people, its here on this thread, their experiences are frequently minimised, its connected I think with the tropes around money and success.
I watched Jewish people receiving daily abuse online, just pop on to the Twitter feeds of any celebrity who is Jewish if you dont believe they dont experience daily abuse.^

Well said and so true. Unfortunately there is still this belief that all Jews are wealthy and run the world. It really is nonsense.

Galaxy I think there is also another layer to the racism faced by Jewish people, its here on this thread

True as well!

* maddy one* I pointed out quite rightly that government have provided additional funds for the protection of Jewish schools and synagogues as recently as this March. That shows clearly that Jewish people in this country, that is Britain, are experiencing racism on a regular and possibly daily basis

I agree maddy.

I also absolutely agree that a black person is possibly more easily identifiable than a Jewish person BUT I simply don't see why that is considered relevant in terms of the fact that Jewish people experience racism! And whether its daily,weekly, monthly or once in a lifetime it is STILL racism!!

No idea what point DA thought she was making really!

I think there is also another layer to the racism faced by Jewish people, its here on this thread, their experiences are frequently minimised, its connected I think with the tropes around money and success.
I watched Jewish people receiving daily abuse online, just pop on to the Twitter feeds of any celebrity who is Jewish if you dont believe they dont experience daily abuse.

growstuff

Callistemon21

HousePlantQueen

Having been away for a few days, I haven't read this entire thread, so apologies if I repeat what someone else has said.

I agree with Fleurpepper post of 10:41 today.

I am no fan of Diane Abbott, her patronising tone on radio shows irritates me no end. but she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself.

she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself

So she surely should know better than to express racism against other people.

She must have known better - that's what I find so strange. I also think she must have known what kind of furore it would cause.

I'm honestly coming round to the idea that it's been planned, that she intended to resign anyway and is causing as much trouble for Starmer as she can.

Interesting - that could well be true.
I'm surprised the letter got past the editor too.

That’s interesting growstuff, you could be right. DA could quite possibly be trying to cause trouble for Keir Starmer. I hadn’t thought of that.

I agree growstuff , I do not believe that letter was sent in error.

And additionally diminishes totally Diane Abbott’s remarks in the Observer paper yesterday.
To be honest, I’m quite surprised that the Observer’s editors thought it was appropriate to print this letter.

Fleurpepper
Firstly and importantly, I haven’t discussed at any point on this thread anything about the left wing of the Labour Party. I’ll accept your apology if it’s forthcoming.

As to your opinion of whether or not there should be religious schools, I’m afraid it’s irrelevant. The discussion is not about religious schools. I pointed out quite rightly that government have provided additional funds for the protection of Jewish schools and synagogues as recently as this March. That shows clearly that Jewish people in this country, that is Britain, are experiencing racism on a regular and possibly daily basis. No argument about religious schools diminishes this fact.

Wondering whether this weekends memorial service fir Steven Lawrence played a part in Dianne Abbot writing what she did. What happened to him woukd make anyone angry. He was a young man waiting fir a bus, whose killers were known but went free for years before they were eventually tried and committed.
She has lived with racism every day of her life and has suffered vile abuse since she became an MP.
I am not black and dont think anyone who is not black can truly understand how that might feel.
I remember the No Blacks, No Irish, No dogs notices in Windows of houses with rooms to let in London in the 60s/70s and was disgusted.

Callistemon21

HousePlantQueen

Having been away for a few days, I haven't read this entire thread, so apologies if I repeat what someone else has said.

I agree with Fleurpepper post of 10:41 today.

I am no fan of Diane Abbott, her patronising tone on radio shows irritates me no end. but she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself.

she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself

So she surely should know better than to express racism against other people.

She must have known better - that's what I find so strange. I also think she must have known what kind of furore it would cause.

I'm honestly coming round to the idea that it's been planned, that she intended to resign anyway and is causing as much trouble for Starmer as she can.

Germanshepherdsmum

And to downgrade that racism to the equivalent of prejudice against people with red hair. Ridiculous and indefensible.

It could be argued that people with red hair are descended from a race of Celts who themselves were prized as slaves by the Romans and Persians millennia ago.

However, now, although there is known prejudice, it does not equate to racism.

DA is very ignorant and thinks she “owns” racism. Her racism is worse than anybody else's she thinks.

How do you know that Primrose53?

Are you her analyst?

And to downgrade that racism to the equivalent of prejudice against people with red hair. Ridiculous and indefensible.

HousePlantQueen

Having been away for a few days, I haven't read this entire thread, so apologies if I repeat what someone else has said.

I agree with Fleurpepper post of 10:41 today.

I am no fan of Diane Abbott, her patronising tone on radio shows irritates me no end. but she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself.

she has without doubt experienced racism (and sexism) herself

So she surely should know better than to express racism against other people.