Sudan

westendgirl

I dont think anyone is blaming British forces. Also on Question Time last night another participant ,who had served in Afghanistan spoke of his anger at the way Afghans who had worked for the British there were left.
It seems that communication is where this govt falls down in a big way . Yesterday , I think it was Mitchell who said safe
route s would be set up . This information was reversed by Braverman who said there woul be no safe route. (She is trying hard to be Cruella, isnt she ?)

Ok despite being a Conservative I am not a fan of Ms.Braverman or he policies.

However, in a situation like Sudan, the Government and the people on the ground in Sudan have to prioritise U.K. Citizens.

I didn’t see Question Time.

Withdrawal from Afghanistan started way before those dreadful scenes at the airport over the last couple of days before the USA totally withdrew. I have empathy for those who were left behind, but we do not know every single detail of every single case.

westendgirl

I dont think anyone is blaming British forces. Also on Question Time last night another participant ,who had served in Afghanistan spoke of his anger at the way Afghans who had worked for the British there were left.
It seems that communication is where this govt falls down in a big way . Yesterday , I think it was Mitchell who said safe
route s would be set up . This information was reversed by Braverman who said there woul be no safe route. (She is trying hard to be Cruella, isnt she ?)

It’s a civil war there are no guaranteed safe routes, we do not have the ability to guarantee the safety of a convoy out of Sudan.
The security of the airfield used is being controlled by Sudanese troops, they are allowing access by civilians to the airport for now. That might change we don’t know, our own military has said the airlift will continue as long as it is safe to do so.
Neither side in this war has any interest in stopping foreigners leaving the country so possibly a few extra days evacuation may be allowed.

The ceasefire has been extended for another 72 hours according to news bulletins, I hope it holds.

I didn't 'blame' British forces in the ground. It's quite obvious different Ministers are telling different stories. And surely it is in the national interest to bring doctors back to work in an underfunded, overstretched NHS. Expecting them to make their own way back to the UK is ludicrous.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65420882
The above link to a BBC report
Sudanese NHS doctor 'betrayed' after being refused entry onto evacuation flight to UK

It’s just a pity that as usual there are a many people complaining about the British response. Our diplomats were extracted quickly and of course they were the first because direct threats have been made against them, and additionally they would have been in the capital city, so more easily able to get to the airport. Now British citizens are being evacuated, and there are apparently about 4000 people eligible to be evacuated, whereas other countries have had far fewer people to evacuate, often only a few hundred. Many people who are eligible are in remote villages and fear making the difficult journey to the capital city, and who can blame them for that. But our forces cannot be expected to access every remote village in the country, risking their own lives, to find people in the middle of a civil war.
Many people are being evacuated. Our forces are doing an admirable and difficult job. Stop the criticisms and be pleased people are getting out.

Grantanow

I didn't 'blame' British forces in the ground. It's quite obvious different Ministers are telling different stories. And surely it is in the national interest to bring doctors back to work in an underfunded, overstretched NHS. Expecting them to make their own way back to the UK is ludicrous.

Do you not think that Sudan really needs all its doctors at this present time?

maddyone

It’s just a pity that as usual there are a many people complaining about the British response. Our diplomats were extracted quickly and of course they were the first because direct threats have been made against them, and additionally they would have been in the capital city, so more easily able to get to the airport. Now British citizens are being evacuated, and there are apparently about 4000 people eligible to be evacuated, whereas other countries have had far fewer people to evacuate, often only a few hundred. Many people who are eligible are in remote villages and fear making the difficult journey to the capital city, and who can blame them for that. But our forces cannot be expected to access every remote village in the country, risking their own lives, to find people in the middle of a civil war.
Many people are being evacuated. Our forces are doing an admirable and difficult job. Stop the criticisms and be pleased people are getting out.

Good post maddyone I totally agree

Our military are not accessing anywhere outside the airport, they are helping and preparing the evacuees for the flight out. No doubt there are some of our own soldiers watching what the Sudanese close to the airport are doing, because you cannot rule out a rouge unit breaking the cease fire.

Katie59

Our military are not accessing anywhere outside the airport, they are helping and preparing the evacuees for the flight out. No doubt there are some of our own soldiers watching what the Sudanese close to the airport are doing, because you cannot rule out a rouge unit breaking the cease fire.

Absolutely they are not allowed to leave the airfield, the U.K. doesn’t want boots on the ground in this conflict.

The Sudanese Forces are manning all checkpoints and it is them who decide who passes through.

Grannygravy, but these doctors have British residency and worked for us through the pandemic.

Nandalot

*Grannygravy*, but these doctors have British residency and worked for us through the pandemic.

I do not know their status, some are saying they have a working visa, you have posted that they have residency.

Do we know where they were stopped and by whom. Was it at one of the many checkpoints manned by Sudanese Forces, and if so which faction of the Sudanese conflict were manning that particular checkpoint?

I doubt very much that U.K. Forces at the airfield have the authority to pick and choose who boards the flights. They have to obey orders given to them by their Commanding Officer.

We do not know enough details to decide what is right or wrong, nor should we in a dangerous situation which could rapidly deteriorate any minute.

It did say on the news last night that only holders of British passports were allowed to board the planes. Apparently some people were trying to get some of their family members out, which is understandable under the circumstances, but only British citizens are allowed to board the planes. The places obviously must be available to citizens who can get there and so others cannot be allowed to board. This is the sad reality of war.

Well said @ 11.19 maddy.

GrannyGravy13

Nandalot

Grannygravy, but these doctors have British residency and worked for us through the pandemic.

I do not know their status, some are saying they have a working visa, you have posted that they have residency.

Do we know where they were stopped and by whom. Was it at one of the many checkpoints manned by Sudanese Forces, and if so which faction of the Sudanese conflict were manning that particular checkpoint?

I doubt very much that U.K. Forces at the airfield have the authority to pick and choose who boards the flights. They have to obey orders given to them by their Commanding Officer.

We do not know enough details to decide what is right or wrong, nor should we in a dangerous situation which could rapidly deteriorate any minute.

Their circumstances will all be different. This doctor is a registrar in the NHS, so part way through a training scheme, he will have a working visa. Yes, he could stay in Sudan, but to do that he would forgo his place on a training scheme after four years, and leave a critical gap in the team he works for. I do think there are exceptions, and he should not have been turned away by the army at the airport - there needs to be a strategic approach in these cases.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65420882

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

GrannyGravy13

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

Yes, I understand that. However I think there should be a strategy for how to manage their safe passage, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t remain waiting at the airport in case there is an opportunity to send them out on a flight in due course. Sending them away seems wrong.

In my opinion only people holding a British passport should be let in.

Nicenanny3

In my opinion only people holding a British passport should be let in.

Give us an explanation as to why you think it’s okay to abandon doctors who are working for the NHS part way through training programmes, and why you think it’s okay to leave NHS patients without care as a result of gaps created by these staff being unavailable Nicenanny3.

Casdon

GrannyGravy13

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

Yes, I understand that. However I think there should be a strategy for how to manage their safe passage, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t remain waiting at the airport in case there is an opportunity to send them out on a flight in due course. Sending them away seems wrong.

It has been reported that a Turkish evacuation plane has been fired upon at the airport.

We cannot send troops over to escort those needing to evacuate, so how a safe passage can be managed from different areas in such an unstable environment is impossible to imagine.

Callistemon21

Casdon

GrannyGravy13

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

Yes, I understand that. However I think there should be a strategy for how to manage their safe passage, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t remain waiting at the airport in case there is an opportunity to send them out on a flight in due course. Sending them away seems wrong.

It has been reported that a Turkish evacuation plane has been fired upon at the airport.

We cannot send troops over to escort those needing to evacuate, so how a safe passage can be managed from different areas in such an unstable environment is impossible to imagine.

Nonetheless, he’s made it.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65423219
I understand all the difficulties, but there are thousands of British citizens who need to get out still, and I don’t think those who are doctors working for our NHS should be abandoned in the chaos, that’s all I’m saying.

Casdon

Callistemon21

Casdon

GrannyGravy13

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

Yes, I understand that. However I think there should be a strategy for how to manage their safe passage, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t remain waiting at the airport in case there is an opportunity to send them out on a flight in due course. Sending them away seems wrong.

It has been reported that a Turkish evacuation plane has been fired upon at the airport.

We cannot send troops over to escort those needing to evacuate, so how a safe passage can be managed from different areas in such an unstable environment is impossible to imagine.

Nonetheless, he’s made it.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65423219
I understand all the difficulties, but there are thousands of British citizens who need to get out still, and I don’t think those who are doctors working for our NHS should be abandoned in the chaos, that’s all I’m saying.

Oh good. I'm pleased.

However, when places are limited, British citizens must take priority. Imagine the furore if a British child had been taken off the plane to allow him to have a place.
Actually, I don't think he would have allowed that to happen.

I hope everyone will be rescued, this is madness.

Obviously what has happened to the doctor is that the bad publicity about his case has shamed the Foreign Office into reversing course as it should. There are other doctors in the same position waiting to return to the UK. It makes no sense to prevent junior doctors from completing their training and continuing to work in the NHS. The provision of medical services in Sudan is a matter for the Sudanese government, not the UK government: a hard point to make but - as some have pointed out - war requires hard decisions to be taken.

Callistemon21

Casdon

Callistemon21

Casdon

GrannyGravy13

Casdon yes it is unfortunate, but as it stands only those with U.K. passports are being evacuated on U.K. rescue flights.

In war lines have to be drawn which to some seem unjust.

Yes, I understand that. However I think there should be a strategy for how to manage their safe passage, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t remain waiting at the airport in case there is an opportunity to send them out on a flight in due course. Sending them away seems wrong.

It has been reported that a Turkish evacuation plane has been fired upon at the airport.

We cannot send troops over to escort those needing to evacuate, so how a safe passage can be managed from different areas in such an unstable environment is impossible to imagine.

Nonetheless, he’s made it.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65423219
I understand all the difficulties, but there are thousands of British citizens who need to get out still, and I don’t think those who are doctors working for our NHS should be abandoned in the chaos, that’s all I’m saying.

Oh good. I'm pleased.

However, when places are limited, British citizens must take priority. Imagine the furore if a British child had been taken off the plane to allow him to have a place.
Actually, I don't think he would have allowed that to happen.

I hope everyone will be rescued, this is madness.

I hope they are all rescued too, and no, I’m sure he wouldn’t have taken the place of a child. I think the issue they are having is that not everybody can make it to the airport, and I’m sure he will have been allocated a vacant seat because there was nobody else available to take it, and filling up the planes departing is essential to get people out. It must be mayhem.

chaos mayhem madness

Three words I’ve picked out of the recent posts on this thread.
Those words sum up the situation accurately. It will be absolutely chaotic, and mayhem and madness will be in evidence at the airport and over the country as a whole. Thank goodness our brave troops are doing their duty so diligently and helping to get as many as are eligible out safely.