Puzzled about 'kidnapping' lambs

I think Hetty has it right they have been removed to stop them being slaughtered to go on your plates with the mint sauce
I hope they are gambolling in the sunshine

MayBee70

Norah

Glorianny

I admire people who are vegan and vegetarian, I eat little meat. Not half as much as when I was younger when I ate anything. One question I have never found either vs able to answer. "If the whole world stopped eating meat and dairy tomorrow what would happen to all the animals? Would you have a wholesale slaughter of them and bury the remains, or would you just leave them to slowly starve to death? Because there wouldn't be enough land to feed us and them, and farmers would stop feeding them.

Farmers would slowly decrease herds, as people slowly quit eating meat. No bull in the pasture = no more babies. All baby bulls cut (as mostly happens anyway). The replacement heifers sold more quickly than now - less meat would slowly be available, just because. No starving.

Farmers farm, it's what they do, they know how to control yields.

What would our dogs eat?

I cook brown rice and lamb for mine.

nightowl

Oh dear, better tell my healthy 7 year old grandson that he shouldn’t have drunk oat milk from the age of one despite being allergic to dairy and to soya. All properly diagnosed by a consultant and monitored by a dietitian.

Indeed.

I always think back to the animal rights people who released all those mink into the wild that are still wreaking havoc with water voles etc.

I do not like cows milk, lots of dairy intolerance in my family. I do love butter and cheese though, even if it doesn't love me

That's interesting you make your Oat milk Norah, must be so much cheaper!

Norah

Glorianny

I admire people who are vegan and vegetarian, I eat little meat. Not half as much as when I was younger when I ate anything. One question I have never found either vs able to answer. "If the whole world stopped eating meat and dairy tomorrow what would happen to all the animals? Would you have a wholesale slaughter of them and bury the remains, or would you just leave them to slowly starve to death? Because there wouldn't be enough land to feed us and them, and farmers would stop feeding them.

Farmers would slowly decrease herds, as people slowly quit eating meat. No bull in the pasture = no more babies. All baby bulls cut (as mostly happens anyway). The replacement heifers sold more quickly than now - less meat would slowly be available, just because. No starving.

Farmers farm, it's what they do, they know how to control yields.

What would our dogs eat?

Here we go...

Oh dear, better tell my healthy 7 year old grandson that he shouldn’t have drunk oat milk from the age of one despite being allergic to dairy and to soya. All properly diagnosed by a consultant and monitored by a dietitian.

growstuff

No, we couldn't. Oat milk shouldn't be given to children under five and some people are allergic to oats.

Many are allergic to milk and drink something else. I dislike soy milk, don't care for rice milk, and abhor dairy milk. We merely drink oat milk I make. I nursed - some do, others use formula.

And it contains about 70% more carbs than semi-skimmed cow milk.

No, we couldn't. Oat milk shouldn't be given to children under five and some people are allergic to oats.

nightowl

Violetsky that is the biggest load of rubbish put out by the dairy industry to try to convince people that taking calves from their mothers so we can take their milk is fine. Have you heard a dairy cow crying for its calf, often for days? Or trying to climb over barriers in desperation.

There are a few dairy farmers who are pioneering ‘cow with calf’ milking which allows cows to keep their calves with them whilst being milked, and be weaned more naturally. Hopefully this will grow if people insist on continuing to drink something that is after all a completely unnatural food for humans.

We could all make and drink healthy oat milk.

Glorianny

I admire people who are vegan and vegetarian, I eat little meat. Not half as much as when I was younger when I ate anything. One question I have never found either vs able to answer. "If the whole world stopped eating meat and dairy tomorrow what would happen to all the animals? Would you have a wholesale slaughter of them and bury the remains, or would you just leave them to slowly starve to death? Because there wouldn't be enough land to feed us and them, and farmers would stop feeding them.

Farmers would slowly decrease herds, as people slowly quit eating meat. No bull in the pasture = no more babies. All baby bulls cut (as mostly happens anyway). The replacement heifers sold more quickly than now - less meat would slowly be available, just because. No starving.

Farmers farm, it's what they do, they know how to control yields.

Glorianny

I admire people who are vegan and vegetarian, I eat little meat. Not half as much as when I was younger when I ate anything. One question I have never found either vs able to answer. "If the whole world stopped eating meat and dairy tomorrow what would happen to all the animals? Would you have a wholesale slaughter of them and bury the remains, or would you just leave them to slowly starve to death? Because there wouldn't be enough land to feed us and them, and farmers would stop feeding them.

There is archaeological evidence that hominins have been eating meat and marrow for about two million years. They've probably been eating eggs for much longer and drinking milk from other species for about 6-10,000 years. If everybody in the world stopped eating meat, we'd reverse evolution and I don't think anybody really knows how that would turn out - certainly, none of us would be around to know.

nightowl

Violetsky that is the biggest load of rubbish put out by the dairy industry to try to convince people that taking calves from their mothers so we can take their milk is fine. Have you heard a dairy cow crying for its calf, often for days? Or trying to climb over barriers in desperation.

There are a few dairy farmers who are pioneering ‘cow with calf’ milking which allows cows to keep their calves with them whilst being milked, and be weaned more naturally. Hopefully this will grow if people insist on continuing to drink something that is after all a completely unnatural food for humans.

I bought milk from an organic dairy in the early 80s in America. They practiced "family herds" there even then. It is not the case that we have to farm intensively or inhumanely.

The things we could change quite easily we just don't want to.

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/may/24/animal-welfare-groups-lose-court-challenge-over-frankenchickens

Only M&S and Waitrose don't buy these, apparently.

I admire people who are vegan and vegetarian, I eat little meat. Not half as much as when I was younger when I ate anything. One question I have never found either vs able to answer. "If the whole world stopped eating meat and dairy tomorrow what would happen to all the animals? Would you have a wholesale slaughter of them and bury the remains, or would you just leave them to slowly starve to death? Because there wouldn't be enough land to feed us and them, and farmers would stop feeding them.

Maybe that's true but I remember reading about a dairy farmer who tried a free range approach losing 70% of calves due to the cows not attending after birth predators or accidentally trampling their young...

I'm open minded to that being a lie by all dairy farmers

Logically... The collustrum lasts a few days whether the calf is taken or not right? The babies would need the same amount of milk whether it came from teet or bottle... So why would this be considered best practise?

Violetsky that is the biggest load of rubbish put out by the dairy industry to try to convince people that taking calves from their mothers so we can take their milk is fine. Have you heard a dairy cow crying for its calf, often for days? Or trying to climb over barriers in desperation.

There are a few dairy farmers who are pioneering ‘cow with calf’ milking which allows cows to keep their calves with them whilst being milked, and be weaned more naturally. Hopefully this will grow if people insist on continuing to drink something that is after all a completely unnatural food for humans.

To be fair, I remember a dairy farmer telling me that we have bred milk cows to be domestic and docile and in doing so, made them quite stupid

She said that they just aren't good mother's, that without support they don't notice they had a baby which suffocates without human intervention to clear the airways and that they just don't take care of their babies well

A human caused problem of course

Don’t know if you are aware…….

Some commenters saying it’s wrong to take baby Lambs from their mothers

Don’t know if you are , but when baby Calves are born they’re taken straight from the Mother, after all we drink her milk which was meant for her baby.

If it’s a boy it will be slaughtered, if a girl it will be grown so the whole process can begin again.

Imagine giving birth and never getting to feed or care for your baby. It’s so cruel 🥲

Hetty

Then 99% of the population are immoral you are and extremist
keep your opinions to yourself, why do you think you have the right to tell others what to eat

Good points Hetty

It's always seemed weird to me that we can own living things and thier offspring

Hoping those lambs are happily bouncing about the place somewhere

I have a large garden, I'm now eyeing up a couple of lambs that are going to be Sunday roast quite soon and wondering if they would enjoy being lawnmowers instead

M0nica:

'What they did was animal cruelty and they should be prosecuted. The lambs they took looked very young and should be with their mothers.'

No, not that young - and how old is the lamb you eat? Do you believe they go straight from mum to slaughter? They go to market - or on a long, cruel, trip abroad at that age. Which cruelty do you prefer?

Katie59:

'Eating meat is quite legal if they choose not to, fine, affecting the lives of others is not acceptable.'

- you contradict yourself. Your legal (but immoral) choice to eat meat is affecting the lives of people everywhere

henetha:

'They are going about it in the wrong way, I agree Callistemon21. It's no good annoying us. It's governments who should be urged to act against climate change.'

How would you go about it then? They have to do something dramatic and controversial to start the conversations. Public opinion spurs on government decisions - but often it's too little and far too late, unfortunately.

If there's no urgent need to raise awareness, why is ExDancer puzzled? Maybe read my link and find out exactly how your lamb is produced?


www.animalaid.org.uk/the-issues/our-campaigns/animal-farming/suffering-farmed-sheep/

No GrannyGravy and I’m sure they won’t get away with it, but it doesn’t mean they’re not right.