The Refugee Ship

54Beetlejuice

Seems to me RNLI and Border Force have no trouble finding them and ferrying them to Dover

Like a taxi service?

That's exactly what they have become

11:54Dickens

I wasn't suggesting RNLI could become Police Patrol Boats you said that, I was making the point that they have no trouble finding them and ferrying them ashore so if they can find them Patrol Boats could and turn them back and no I don't donate to RNLI and I believe their donations have fallen dramatically because of their actions (ie they have become the last part of the chain, starting with the criminal smuggling gangs and ending with them picking them up)

nanna8

Could they not also have boats providing accomodation for homeless people ? Or is that too hard ?

'They' could. They could also provide accommodation for some from spare converted containers. In fact they could do quite a lot for homeless people.

The question is more - do they want to? Even without the immigration situation, I'm not convinced it's a pressing priority with government.

Nicenanny3

*Dickens*Can you not see that, physically and practically, that would be damned near impossible? How do you think we would do this? Have armies of people wading out to turn the boats around and possibly engaging in an act that would see those in the craft drown? Or fight to come ashore - in which case we'd have to - what - shoot them?

*Seems to me RNLI and Border Force have no trouble finding them and ferrying them to Dover*

I don't know about the Border Force - haven't investigated much how they operate, but no-one who signs-up to volunteer in the RNLI is going to agree to a situation where they decide whether or not to let people drown. It is not the RNLI's job to police our waters - that is up to the Border Force - entirely.

When you volunteer to save lives at sea - it's a blanket operation and will therefore include rescuing those you'd rather they didn't.

I might be mistaken, but I don't think RNLI volunteers want to become 'police patrol' boats. And, if you don't approve, you are not compelled to donate.

Could they not also have boats providing accomodation for homeless people ? Or is that too hard ?

I would like to see the navy patrolling the channel en masse and turning boats back. They have the ability to fire warning shots which would hurt nobody but show that we mean business.

Seems to me RNLI and Border Force have no trouble finding them and ferrying them to Dover

Like a taxi service?

DickensCan you not see that, physically and practically, that would be damned near impossible? How do you think we would do this? Have armies of people wading out to turn the boats around and possibly engaging in an act that would see those in the craft drown? Or fight to come ashore - in which case we'd have to - what - shoot them?

Seems to me RNLI and Border Force have no trouble finding them and ferrying them to Dover

Iam64

We are still part of Northern Europe Glorianny. We are still part of what’s an international problem. I may not share GSM’s views on this issue but I agree with her that positive action is needed

... exactly.

That's the problem isn't none of the main stream parties, the Reform Party would sort immigration out but unfortunately I don't think they would win a General Election. Labour voted against the Illegal Migration Bill and Rwanda so I think if they get in the floodgates will open even more. I'm in a Conservative safe seat Tatton and I hope it stays that way.

Nicenanny3

09:25Casdon

Nicenanny3

Actually we are 7 million a day poorer housing and paying for them 😮

Tell us your solution for the current situation Nicenanny3, I’d be interested to know what, in the absence of the Rwanda plan implementation, you think should happen now?

*If only I had a say unfortunately all I have is my one vote in a General Election. I'd turn back the boats stop them from entering our waters for a start but unfortunately that's not going to happen our government is weak and if Starmer wins the next election it will become weaker.*

I'd turn back the boats stop them from entering our waters for a start

Can you not see that, physically and practically, that would be damned near impossible? How do you think we would do this? Have armies of people wading out to turn the boats around and possibly engaging in an act that would see those in the craft drown? Or fight to come ashore - in which case we'd have to - what - shoot them?

There has to be a policy and a strategy, and it would be better if it was co-ordinated Europe-wide.

It's all very well saying Sunak and Starmer are 'weak', but they are or will be faced with a difficult situation. And, as we are prominent on the world stage - we cannot simply physically "turn back the boats" and create a situation which might result in the death - of either the immigrants or one of those co-opted to push them back out to sea again.

We are still part of Northern Europe Glorianny. We are still part of what’s an international problem. I may not share GSM’s views on this issue but I agree with her that positive action is needed

So which party is going to stop this influx Nicenanny? I don’t see any signs of any but the Conservatives being willing to take tough, unpopular measures.

09:25Casdon

Nicenanny3

Actually we are 7 million a day poorer housing and paying for them 😮

Tell us your solution for the current situation Nicenanny3, I’d be interested to know what, in the absence of the Rwanda plan implementation, you think should happen now?

If only I had a say unfortunately all I have is my one vote in a General Election. I'd turn back the boats stop them from entering our waters for a start but unfortunately that's not going to happen our government is weak and if Starmer wins the next election it will become weaker.

Yes there have always been waves of immigration Glorianny, but not in the vast numbers we are experiencing now. And previous waves of immigrants haven’t been wholly supported by the state, other than unaccompanied children of course such as arrived on the kinder transport.

Glorianny

I think it's a bit rich to expect any plan for all Europe when we have just voted ourselves out of any European policies.
There have always been waves of immigration in the UK. There have always been awful warnings about the threat they posed to us.
And guess what? It seldom happened. In fact immigration has brought us huge diversity in all areas, food, culture, business and every day life. Our lives are richer for it.

I think it's a bit rich to expect any plan for all Europe when we have just voted ourselves out of any European policies.

Well, quite. But with or without us, the EU will still have to deal with the matter of immigration. We can either 'sign-up' - or not - with whatever policies are put in place, if we are invited.

Some of us still consider ourselves as being part of Europe.

Nicenanny3

Actually we are 7 million a day poorer housing and paying for them 😮

Tell us your solution for the current situation Nicenanny3, I’d be interested to know what, in the absence of the Rwanda plan implementation, you think should happen now?

Actually we are 7 million a day poorer housing and paying for them 😮

I think it's a bit rich to expect any plan for all Europe when we have just voted ourselves out of any European policies.
There have always been waves of immigration in the UK. There have always been awful warnings about the threat they posed to us.
And guess what? It seldom happened. In fact immigration has brought us huge diversity in all areas, food, culture, business and every day life. Our lives are richer for it.

Iam64

Interesting comments JenniferEccles and Dickens.
You’re correct, ther appears to be no coherent European plan, no effective strategy in place.
It’s nonsense to suggest that our island status, along with being further north, should give us a get out of jail free card. Given the waves of people seeking sanctuary or better economic life chances will continue to increase, the need for coordinated, consistent responses from Europe/uk is essential

It’s nonsense to suggest that our island status, along with being further north, should give us a get out of jail free card. Given the waves of people seeking sanctuary or better economic life chances will continue to increase, the need for coordinated, consistent responses from Europe/uk is essential

I don't think any nation - island or not - can escape this - and those with a colonial history... well, you know...

Humans have been migrating, one way or another, for one reason or another, since - when?... the dawn of time?

This migration is going to continue and world leaders have got to get to grips with it and develop a coherent strategy to deal with it.

And I believe it's equally important to consider the effect that migration will have on each host country both economically and culturally. We cannot bury our head in the sands and ignore the fact that immigration will have an effect on communities - because we are afraid of being deemed 'racist'. Multi-culturalism appears to work really well in some areas, but not in others, and this can't be ignored. It's all very well pontificating from the comfort of your (collective) armchair in The Cotswolds or leafy-Surrey about showing our humanity to these often-desperate people when you are barely affected by their arrival, but it's a different story for those living in overcrowded towns and cities where the infrastructure has already crumbled due to years of public-spending cuts.

I'm no expert in the matter of immigration (as you can see), but surely with big issues like immigration, climate-change, and the environment, we have to deal with them rationally, realistically, honestly - and coherently... and stop using them as political footballs which just stokes up resentment, anger and fear, and simply causes more trouble and problems?

Interesting comments JenniferEccles and Dickens.
You’re correct, ther appears to be no coherent European plan, no effective strategy in place.
It’s nonsense to suggest that our island status, along with being further north, should give us a get out of jail free card. Given the waves of people seeking sanctuary or better economic life chances will continue to increase, the need for coordinated, consistent responses from Europe/uk is essential

JenniferEccles

As I have previously said, this is a problem facing the whole of Europe so it’s time each countries’ leaders got together to work out an effective plan to stop the migrants from setting foot in Europe in the first place.

We are not the only country overwhelmed by the sheer numbers and of course those who make it here will have first arrived in possibly Italy or Greece.

If migrants arriving via the people smugglers were automatically banned from seeking asylum anywhere in Europe, the smugglers business model would disintegrate.

If migrants arriving via the people smugglers were automatically banned from seeking asylum anywhere in Europe, the smugglers business model would disintegrate.

As long as "smugglers" operate, migrants will migrate.

When you consider what they are actually doing - the smugglers - putting people into craft which are frequently simply not sea-worthy and extracting huge sums of money, not caring whether the those migrants make it, live or drown on the journey, you have to admit that calling them "smugglers" just doesn't cut it... "smugglers" sounds too tame, almost like something from an Enid Blyton novel (Five Go To Smuggler's Top).

They are evil, dangerous, vicious people-traffickers, and IMO, when caught should be given a very very long prison sentence such that, when they are released, they are too old and decrepit to even consider continuing the human traffic trade.

I have also mentioned Europe's response to the problem and, from what I can gather, there is no coherent plan; the relevant agencies appear to be "looking into" it and gathering information. I'm not sure there's any effective strategy in place at the moment, so that's a big EU failure.

As I have previously said, this is a problem facing the whole of Europe so it’s time each countries’ leaders got together to work out an effective plan to stop the migrants from setting foot in Europe in the first place.

We are not the only country overwhelmed by the sheer numbers and of course those who make it here will have first arrived in possibly Italy or Greece.

If migrants arriving via the people smugglers were automatically banned from seeking asylum anywhere in Europe, the smugglers business model would disintegrate.

Germanshepherdsmum

I hope those decisions will be challenged by the government Glorianny.

We don’t have the resources to cope with all these people and we have to take whatever measures are available to prevent yet more coming here. They are not, as far as I’m concerned, welcome and I frankly couldn’t care less about those who disagree.

Difficult to see how such a decision can be challenged given that the ports are privately owned something that was enabled by the Conservatives.

4 dinghies today 221 more beds to find.