What kind of father sacrifices his children in order, he thinks, to win an election

MayBee70

SecondhandRose

Been to China? The US? Seen what they pump out? We are the tiniest tip of the iceberg. Until there is a viable alternative to fossil fuel we sadly need them. Electric cars are expensive, heat pumps and solar panels are expensive. There are some very ugly wind farms out to sea.

There had been a grant people could get if they wanted to install solar panels but the Conservatives did away with it. Heat pumps are horrendously expensive, don’t save the homeowner much money and an electrician friend of ours said they were rubbish. Every new build should have solar panels fitted. Why isn’t this happening?

We have retro fitted a "climatisation" unit which provides air con in the summer and heat in the winter. It runs on electricity but uses less per kw than other forms of electric heating. One day, when I've saved up we will install solar panels to provide the power to generate the system. We are very pleased it and have bought another unit and outlets to install at the other end of the house.

It isn't just the health of children he is sacrificing and it isn't the energy needs of the British public he is focussing on.
Old people are badly affected by air pollution as well. And energy companies in the UK are not publicly owned, so the people who will benefit most from his actions are the already hugely profitable energy companies.
Not caring about the poor, the elderly and children, and passing legislation that will benefit the rich. It's still the Tory party isn't it.?

Germanshepherdsmum

Do you expect magic overnight? And all the wind farms in the world won’t help people who are, and will be for many years, reliant on a secure supply of oil and gas.

This is the crux of the matter, I think. The people campaigning for the schemes aren't going to have to live with the consequences.

Someone who upgrades their car every couple of years, lives in an area that has both easily accessible charging points and good transport links, and has a choice of fuel for heating isn't going to be too put out by any of this, so it's easy for them to take the moral high ground, particularly if they can afford to pay congestion charges and carry on their business as usual, without the inconvenience of older cars clogging up the roads.

There is a lot that needs to be done, and we should be doing it as quickly as possible, but IMO changes should be phased in so that the impact is not felt disproportionately by one sector of society. It's not just the 'poor' who are affected by this - many of them won't have cars anyway. It's anyone who doesn't live in a well-connected area with readily available services such as deliveries, and anyone who doesn't have a choice of heating fuel, as well as anyone who doesn't live within walking distance of a bus stop or train station with a regular service (assuming they are able to walk to it in the first place). Cycle lanes are all well and good for the young and fit, but even then they are really for local journeys - they are not going to help many people who live 20 miles out of the city centre to commute, and they are pretty useless for shopping, or for journeys with children in tow.

Why not subsidise public transport (and electric cars, if an ecological case can really be made for them), instead of charging people who have access to neither? Why not increase the number of electric trams across cities and larger towns? Why not plan new developments with schools and other facilities in them, so that residents don't need to travel every day for basics? And plant trees to help prevent flooding? And so on and on. But no, instead the 'solution' is to keep things as they are for those who can afford to pay, and limit movement for those who can't.

Trurider1

As Usual a lot of Stupid ill thought out comments and a total lack of Reality. Lonond was POLLUTED in Roman Times. The Cause was small Metal Foundaries. WHY? You can see Lonodn fform Wimbledon Hill, Gypsy Hill, Sydenham Hill, Parliament hIll Etc. London is built in a Bowl and he prevailing winds blow over it not through it. The Low Emissions Zone wil hardly affect anything as a Result. As to Oil and Gas, The European Union was run on CHEAP Russian Gas and Oil. Putin thought he would hold Europe to RANSOM and do what he liked but they cut it off. Now where DO YOU think Europe is getting its supplies from OR DO THEY MAGICALLY appear? At the Rate it is being used up BRITAIN would have no supplies within Seven years. ARE YOU PREPARED FOR YOUR CHILDREN TO FREEZE TO DEATH???

If the winds are blowing over London then the pollution from vehicles will be staying at ground level where it is emitted. One of the causes of breathing problems in youngsters is that babies and toddlers are at just the right height to be affected by fumes. So, when moving along a road or staying still whilst their parents chat, they are closer to the source than adults.

You cannot always see the pollution.

Fumes from gas appliances are also bad for asthmatics. I know because suffered a major attack whilst at a friend's house where a gas stove was in use.

SecondhandRose

Been to China? The US? Seen what they pump out? We are the tiniest tip of the iceberg. Until there is a viable alternative to fossil fuel we sadly need them. Electric cars are expensive, heat pumps and solar panels are expensive. There are some very ugly wind farms out to sea.

There had been a grant people could get if they wanted to install solar panels but the Conservatives did away with it. Heat pumps are horrendously expensive, don’t save the homeowner much money and an electrician friend of ours said they were rubbish. Every new build should have solar panels fitted. Why isn’t this happening?

Apologies if someone's already mentioned the interview on Woman's Hour today with Dr Karen Joash (consultant in obs & gynae). She discussed the risks of airborne pollution to unborn children. It's worth listening to on BBC Sounds. Here's the link:

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001p6rm

Here's an aritcle in case you don't have time to listen:

www.maidenhead-advertiser.co.uk/news/sponsored/187065/sponsored-how-air-pollution-affects-our-unborn-children.html

There's no easy answer to the problem, as illustrated by these posts. One thing is certain though: we have to decrease our reliance on unsustainable transport. Unfortunately there are a lot of us who do not consider the wider implications of our actions. In many instances we have to stop answering our own needs for the greater good. But I doubt that's going to happen in this 'me' society, partly encouraged by successive governments, none of which risk unpopularity in favour of really sorting out what needs to be done.

And I agree with M0nica, the reductionist stance is that Sunak is sacrificing the health of human beings in his desire to secure votes.

Germanshepherdsmum

Don’t you realise that more and more wind farms are being built? But the wind doesn’t always blow. Just like the sun doesn’t always shine.

On islands in the north sea like the UK there is always something going on, weatherwise. If it's not windy, then the sun is shining. Then there's tide power.

It must be possible for smaller, more local plants to be built which use the available conditions effectively.

Trurider1

As Usual a lot of Stupid ill thought out comments and a total lack of Reality. Lonond was POLLUTED in Roman Times. The Cause was small Metal Foundaries. WHY? You can see Lonodn fform Wimbledon Hill, Gypsy Hill, Sydenham Hill, Parliament hIll Etc. London is built in a Bowl and he prevailing winds blow over it not through it. The Low Emissions Zone wil hardly affect anything as a Result. As to Oil and Gas, The European Union was run on CHEAP Russian Gas and Oil. Putin thought he would hold Europe to RANSOM and do what he liked but they cut it off. Now where DO YOU think Europe is getting its supplies from OR DO THEY MAGICALLY appear? At the Rate it is being used up BRITAIN would have no supplies within Seven years. ARE YOU PREPARED FOR YOUR CHILDREN TO FREEZE TO DEATH???

Interesting post 😄

As Usual a lot of Stupid ill thought out comments and a total lack of Reality. Lonond was POLLUTED in Roman Times. The Cause was small Metal Foundaries. WHY? You can see Lonodn fform Wimbledon Hill, Gypsy Hill, Sydenham Hill, Parliament hIll Etc. London is built in a Bowl and he prevailing winds blow over it not through it. The Low Emissions Zone wil hardly affect anything as a Result. As to Oil and Gas, The European Union was run on CHEAP Russian Gas and Oil. Putin thought he would hold Europe to RANSOM and do what he liked but they cut it off. Now where DO YOU think Europe is getting its supplies from OR DO THEY MAGICALLY appear? At the Rate it is being used up BRITAIN would have no supplies within Seven years. ARE YOU PREPARED FOR YOUR CHILDREN TO FREEZE TO DEATH???

Do you expect magic overnight? And all the wind farms in the world won’t help people who are, and will be for many years, reliant on a secure supply of oil and gas.

Germanshepherdsmum

Don’t you realise that more and more wind farms are being built? But the wind doesn’t always blow. Just like the sun doesn’t always shine.

And it's taking 6 - 10 years to get them connected to the Grid.

You’d be surprised at the number of cars 18+ years old around Maizie. Mine is just a year younger and I have no intention of changing it.

We have air source heating, put in when the property was built, and developers are increasingly doing this to gain a competitive edge. Retrofitting isn’t always successful and may be impossible in a listed building. Ground source heating requires a fair amount of land. There’s a programme about heat pumps on BBC tonight which we will watch. For the foreseeable future, unless people are able to install a heat pump - and they’re not cheap - people in rural areas depend on oil for heating. There’s no mains gas in our village in Norfolk or anywhere nearby, and my son’s area in rural Essex is also wholly dependent on oil. It will take years for this to change, years during which we continue to need oil and gas - and that’s before we consider how long it will take for petrol and diesel vehicles to become extinct. We have to cater for reality whilst trying to achieve an ideal world. Sunak’s ideas reflect reality.

Yes, electricity can be stored but its generation by wind or solar power is weather dependent. I agree about water power, which will doubtless be developed further for future use.

Not 18 year olds, probably, but a 7 year old diesel car doesn't seem ancient to me.

Yes, I think everyone is aware of that.

I was responding to Primrose, Dd, who didn't seem to be.

But another relevant point (there can be more than one grin) is that not everyone changes their car every couple of years, and doing so is not environmentally friendly.

But you don't have to change your car every two years to get one with a low emissions rating. Most petrol cars registered since 2005 will qualify. The idea that masses of people are driving around in 18+ year old cars seems to me to be unbelievable.

Germanshepherdsmum

Don’t you realise that more and more wind farms are being built? But the wind doesn’t always blow. Just like the sun doesn’t always shine.

But the oceans never stop moving, masses of energy in there. We can always store excess electricity generated for later use.

Then there is air source heating and earth source heating.

There are so many alternatives to Sunak’s daft suggestion.

Put our resources into developing these new technologies.

Don’t you realise that more and more wind farms are being built? But the wind doesn’t always blow. Just like the sun doesn’t always shine.

M0nica I agree with your comments
All the money in the world won't protect his children from global warming. In his interview he sounded very arrogant. Why o why can't we use more off shore wind turbines.
.

What kind of man sacrifices his children to get elected? All of them; or those with wives that allow it.

Cossy most supermarkets and Deliveroo don’t deliver to most places! I live in a rural area where only Tesco and Morrisons deliver, and as far as Deliveroo is concerned we might as well be on Mars. Much of the country is rural and my area is by no means unusual.
New builds have had very high insulation requirements for some years and many developers provide solar panels nowadays.

anna7

Sensible comments from Nicenanny and Brownow1564. I drive a 10 year old diesel car and no way can I afford to change it. I don't consider myself poor, just average. If I didn't drive how would I spend the hours I do looking after my very elderly mum. Not to mention taking her to her various appointments. I would never get her on public transport. Its difficult enough by car. To suggest I don't care about poor children is insulting to say the least. Perhaps Whitewave would like to come up with a solution for me.

Yes. Why should people have to change perfectly serviceable cars if they don't want to? Taxes have been paid, and depreciation incorporated at the point of sale. To then insist that only if you pay even more to buy a differently 'unecological' vehicle are you allowed to travel on the roads for which you also pay tax is very unfair.

To give a fuller idea of where my logic is coming from, I think that toll roads are also wrong, as anything that prevents free movement for all is a step towards a totalitarian society.

Oh come on! Sacrificing his children? Folk need to stop being delusional!

There is a war in Ukraine - this limits the energy suppy throughout Europe. The UK is not self sufficient for power. We'll need oil for some years to come - Most EV's are charged using electric from fossil fuel (yes really)!

ULEZ are fine for those who can afford EV's or have reliable public transport but completely penalise those trying to earn an honest living (like mechanics, plubers, decorators builders etc who need to transport their tools)

Until the far east - China in particular - reduce their carbon footprint whatever we in the UK do is a drop in the ocean.

Sounds like a Trumpster - will say and do anything to win an election. There are enough (uneducated) people who will support him.
USA Gundy

Sensible comments from Nicenanny and Brownow1564. I drive a 10 year old diesel car and no way can I afford to change it. I don't consider myself poor, just average. If I didn't drive how would I spend the hours I do looking after my very elderly mum. Not to mention taking her to her various appointments. I would never get her on public transport. Its difficult enough by car. To suggest I don't care about poor children is insulting to say the least. Perhaps Whitewave would like to come up with a solution for me.

I think the whole driving to the larger supermarket thing is a bit of a red herring as so many supermarkets and indeed Deliveroo deliver to most places now. We do need better public transport links and we certainly do need to be more independent and will be reliant on fossil fuels for many more years, however what I don’t understand is why we don’t mitigate more, plant more trees, only build new builds which have solar power and are properly insulated. Instead of charging £12.50 a day, which is huge, why not introduce more toll roads ? I’m sure there’s lots which could be done which hasn’t, however, I also read yesterday that most of the new fuel in the North Sea will be oil, and most will be sold abroad ?