Lucy Letby found guilty.

Timeline of events:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66120934

I’m going to say it one last time because it’s quite clear that some people just don’t hear the unpalatable truth. The managers were experienced clinical staff, who absolutely know what it is to work at the coalface of clinical care. They weren’t the faceless bureaucrats of the tabloid press’ fantasy world. They made bad decisions based on the less than concrete evidence they had, and didn’t listen when others brought forward more concerns which it was difficult to prove. They are I’m sure fully aware that they failed - but it wouldn’t have been because they were off on some jolly. They got it wrong.

Eventually one of the paediatricians told the management that if they didn’t call the police, he would.
Good for him. If he hadn’t become decisive she might have still been killing babies now.

It's not about "piling in with blame" but about being shocked that the system functions in a way that allows this to happen even when serious concerns were raised and hoping that "lessons will be learned" [sic].

Luckygirl3

The most worrying thing for me is the length of time it took to realize something was wrong.

It was because management refused to listen to the concerns of the doctors. They even made them write a letter of apology to her. You couldn’t make it up!

They told the doctor that calling on the police would look bad for the Trust. Someone close to me works in admin. in the NHS. Some of the things she tells us about managers/bosses or whatever you like to call them enjoying jollies would make your hair curl. I don't believe many of them have a clue what goes on 'at the coal face'.

Louella12

*One of the problems we have as a society is that we always look for individuals to blame.*

Nobody has far to look, Casdon

I think you should read up on this case because you don't seem to be fully aware about what's happened

I know exactly what happened as far as it’s been reported in the press Louella. I also know who specifically was involved in the internal investigation, also available to anybody who wants to delve, and I understand how clinical teams deal with concerns about members of nursing staff, from direct experience.

One of the problems we have as a society is that we always look for individuals to blame.

Nobody has far to look, Casdon

I think you should read up on this case because you don't seem to be fully aware about what's happened

I saw that, Kate1949

So terribly shocking and desperately sad.

He genuinely believes that 4 or 5 of those babies should now be in school

I'm lost for words about the attitudes of the senior management

They are an absolute disgrace

Just to repeat again, ‘the bosses’ were the Director of Nursing and the Clinical Director (senior doctor). There was obviously split opinion between the clinicians and the clinical hierarchy regarding her guilt. It’s very easy to blame, but these would be very experienced senior clinical managers, their decisions are in hindsight questionable but they would have been acting in good faith with the evidence they had.
One of the problems we have as a society is that we always look for individuals to blame. I bet the senior nurses and doctors involved are giving themselves a hard enough time over this without people piling in with half the facts to blame them for babies dying. The governments independent inquiry needs to run its course so we can understand exactly what happened and why.

I've just watched an interview with a doc who was very suspicious of her. When he and colleagues went to the bosses they were told that they were bullying Letby and if they didn't send her a letter of apology, there would be 'consequences'

It is beyond belief.
I saw a photograph some week ago of her parents attending the trial and I thought of them today, but not as much as I thought of the babies and their parents.

Why is this murderer given the option of not attending court? It seems to be increasingly common that these criminals are allowed a choice. Their victims did not have one.
And once again, the hospital management, who will 'learn lessons', and be moved to equally important and lucrative roles elsewhere once the attention has died down.

She took advantage of the trust we all have in nurses and doctors - just as Harold Shipman did.

Not sure if this has been mentioned in the press, but I wondered what her background is. Her parents and family must be badly affected.

I have been listening to the Lucy Letby Trial podcast on Podbean. It is very detailed on each baby. It was clear that LL enjoyed the buzz of when the babies became seriously ill. She enjoyed the drama of everyone texting each other afterwards and the attention it brought. She specifically asked to work with the very sick babies.

It’s a terrible thing to have happened, but I do see how incomprehensible it would be from the Clinical Nurse Manager and Director of Nursing’s perspective that a by all accounts ‘average’ nurse, who had worked on the unit prior to these deaths for some time would suddenly turn rogue and start killing babies. I’m not defending their actions at all, but I think we should remember that this case was so complex it took 10 months of evidence to conclude, and that Lucy Letby herself must clearly be very manipulative to have batted off suspicion for so long. The lesson I would suggest will be that the police should have been involved much sooner when it became clear that a member of staff was likely to be involved.

A lot more is coming out now obviously. She was apparently infatuated with a married consultant and they had days out etc together. It has been suggested that she harmed the babies knowing that he would be involved in trying to save them.

Grandma70s

I am sceptical about this verdict. There is only circumstantial evidence. I suppose I find it impossible to believe that someone so normal-seeming should do such things.

This table is quite convincing (see photo).

//A nurse who worked at the hospital told Sky News that when "alarms would go off during the night" there would be a "phrase that people would use".

Lynsey Artell said that colleagues would ask, "I wonder if Lucy's working tonight?"//

From news.sky.com/story/nurse-lucy-letby-found-guilty-of-murdering-seven-babies-on-neonatal-unit-12919516

The death rate in that neonatal unit was far lower before Lucy Letby started work there.

I think it’s very unlikely that she’s innocent.

And Mr & Mrs Letby. Their only child is a child murderer who will spend her life in prison. Awful shock for them. How do you process that?

Anniebach

They face up to what they have done when they start their sentence.

They do, but they should also be made to face their victims. Too many excuses made for evil crimes.

Poor babies, poor parents and poor Jurors - 10 months and they must have had to listen to the most harrowing evidence.
I hope that she never sees the light of day again.
Agree that there must be further enquiry into hospital management.

Callistemon21

Luckygirl3

The most worrying thing for me is the length of time it took to realize something was wrong.

There is a thread about anger.

Yes, I'm angry because Consultant Paediatricians who had concerns about her were ignored by management and in fact were threatened with being reported to the GMC when they expressed those concerns. The management at the hospital defended her without a proper investigation and said she was being 'victimised'.
More babies died as a result of their deliberate inactions.
As reported on the BBC lunchtime news.

Those responsible for allowing this to continue need to be investigated and charged if found guilty of a cover-up or negligence 😡

Absolutely agree with you. She is clearly either evil or insane, but they are definitely culpable. My anger is also directed at them, particularly the Nurse Manager (I think it was them) who when asked if they would accept responsibility for whatever may happen, replied that they would.

Yes I used to be the same fancythat. Remember Ted Bundy?

Sentencing is on Monday. She attended some verdicts where she was found guilty but didn't want to hear any more.

I hope that eventually criminals will have to attend verdicts and sentencing.

I doubt she'll be there on Monday

Kate1949

Murderers and psychopaths don't have the words tattooed across their foreheads and may appear to live normal lives, raising no alarm bells, as in the case of Letby.

When I was younger, I used to think, naively, that if they didnt look like a murderer or whatever, then they probably were not.

I have learnt my lesson over the years.