Israel, Hamas and now Hezbollah

Vintagewine

I think these things are wrong. It’s perfectly acceptable to say so but when someone responds to a post that’s basically saying targeting all Jews for the actions of the Israeli government is anti semitism, someone responds with “they are definitely Jews” that’s outright anti semitic.

If someone posted about the Taliban or Isis murdering and torturing but added they’re not representative of all the Islamic faith and that Muslims in London shouldn’t be targeted for what they do, then someone responds with they have extreme religious beliefs but they “are definitely Muslim”. It’s painting all Muslims as bad and complicit in the actions of fanatics.

Tickingbird I listened to news on radio 4 this morning and they visited an illegal Jewish settlement in the West Bank and talked to settlers who were armed with a machete and a pistol. Would you describe them as terrorists? Illegal settlements in the West Bank are protected by IDF, tbh I find the situation there very confusing, can you explain how it is possible to say these things are wrong without being accused of being anti semitic?

Katie59

^Jane71
Criticising Israel for their attacks on Gaza is not anti-Semitic. We're commenting on Israel, not Jews.
If we harangued Jews in London for what Israel is doing, that would be anti-Semitic. It's not their fault.
Just as it's not the Palestinians fault in Gaza what Hammas did
Both sides need to adhere to International law.
Oh dear what a mess: my heart bleeds for all the poor people being hurt.

Part of the hostility of the Palestinians feel is because of the policies of the extreme religious parties in Israel, they are definitely Jews.

You’re crossing the line here.
So you think it’s OK to steal land because of your religious views

Your post was in reply to Jane71 who posted, in essence, that Jews aren’t responsible for the actions of Israel. You responded with a post about stealing land and the comment “they are definitely Jews”. Now, let me explain as there is a definite difference between the way anti semitism is tolerated and excused and the way any other type of racism or prejudice isn’t.

Insert any unacceptable behaviour into your sentence and end it with …..they are definitely black or definitely Muslim.

Do you post such comments about Muslims when Isis, 7/7 bombers, 9/11 et al occur? No you wouldn’t dare.

Yocheved Lifsvhitz showed remarkable dignity on her release.

I wish both of these ladies a peaceful life.

I was incredibly moved when I say the brief clip of Yocheved Lifschitz taking the hand of her captor and saying "Shalom" when she was released. What an inspirational woman. She has spent a lifetime working towards peace with her Palestinian neighbours and despite her abduction and what she has been through she still has the humanity to make that gesture of friendship. It gives me a little more faith in the goodness of people, not everyone in this world wants retribution and violence.

Agreed foxie. That video clip brought me tears. I keep watching it over and over because it feels like observing the goodness of humanity in the midst of all the horror.

tickingbird

Katie59

Part of the hostility of the Palestinians feel is because of the policies of the extreme religious parties in Israel, they are definitely Jews.

You’re crossing the line here.

So you think it’s OK to steal land because of your religious views

Katie59

Part of the hostility of the Palestinians feel is because of the policies of the extreme religious parties in Israel, they are definitely Jews.

You’re crossing the line here.

Jane71

Criticising Israel for their attacks on Gaza is not anti-Semitic. We're commenting on Israel, not Jews.
If we harangued Jews in London for what Israel is doing, that would be anti-Semitic. It's not their fault.
Just as it's not the Palestinians fault in Gaza what Hammas did.
Both sides need to adhere to International law.
Oh dear what a mess: my heart bleeds for all the poor people being hurt.

Part of the hostility of the Palestinians feel is because of the policies of the extreme religious parties in Israel, they are definitely Jews. It is estimated that around 800,000 Jewish settlers occupy land in the West Bank contrary to the agreed borders.
This expansion policy has made a difficult relationship with Palestinians much worst.

I note that Tugendhat has told Israel in the UN that they must be mindful that Hamas are using the residents of Gaza as human shields and that they are just as much victims of Hamas as the Israeli residents.

I thought that Israeli lady was so gracious in her comments.

foxie48

I was incredibly moved when I say the brief clip of Yocheved Lifschitz taking the hand of her captor and saying "Shalom" when she was released. What an inspirational woman. She has spent a lifetime working towards peace with her Palestinian neighbours and despite her abduction and what she has been through she still has the humanity to make that gesture of friendship. It gives me a little more faith in the goodness of people, not everyone in this world wants retribution and violence.

I felt the same foxie. Despite everything, it gives me some hope to know there are some people with good hearts and a way will be found through all the bitterness and hatred one day.

Oh dear, posted in haste. I should clarify -I mean the fine line between legitimate criticism of some of the responses of this Israeli government and anti semitic comments which have occurred here

I was incredibly moved when I say the brief clip of Yocheved Lifschitz taking the hand of her captor and saying "Shalom" when she was released. What an inspirational woman. She has spent a lifetime working towards peace with her Palestinian neighbours and despite her abduction and what she has been through she still has the humanity to make that gesture of friendship. It gives me a little more faith in the goodness of people, not everyone in this world wants retribution and violence.

No one is suggesting that criticism of the Israeli government is anti semitic. Some of us are pointing to the fine line between that and anti semitism.

Criticising Israel for their attacks on Gaza is not anti-Semitic. We're commenting on Israel, not Jews.
If we harangued Jews in London for what Israel is doing, that would be anti-Semitic. It's not their fault.
Just as it's not the Palestinians fault in Gaza what Hammas did.
Both sides need to adhere to International law.
Oh dear what a mess: my heart bleeds for all the poor people being hurt.

No problem foxie. It’s easily done.

Glorianny

International law says both sides are guilty of war crimes.

Allegedly.

Have either been charged?

If so, you cannot assume guilt.

maddyone

Did you quote the wrong post foxie?
My post wasn’t about violence against women but about a woman speaking at a press conference about what happened to her family on October 7th.

So sorry, I didn't mean to quote your post, apologies, I was rushing off and was careless!

International law says both sides are guilty of war crimes.

Iam64

Gloryanny -you seem to believe anyone who supports the release of hostages, is disgusted by the actions of Hamas is somehow in full support of the Israeli government. It isn’t 1947 and no one can undo the decisions made then.
We should all stand for international law, the protection of innocent lives and humanitarian support for Palestinians
There has to be hope and work towards a two state, political solution.
That’s where the efforts of the Israeli government and Hamas should be, along with political leaders throughout the world

I dont know what others think but I do believe if someone posts pictures which are there to elicit a certain response about one side of the conflict it is only fair and reasonable that the conditions the other side is experiencing should be shown.

Hamas knew that their actions on 7/10 would get a strong reaction from Israel it’s why they carried out such barbaric acts.

I find the actions of the Hamas terrorists both in Israel and the cowardly way they hide their weaponry and themselves amongst women and children abhorrent.

I have repeatedly posted that I have every sympathy for the women and children in Gaza.

I also feel that Israel has every right to defend and protect its citizens.

Hamas continues to shell Israel daily, it is in their control to stop shelling, handover their hostages and be open to negotiations.

Glorianny
There’s no point trying to explain the reasons certain sites are targeted, the bias is so strong it’s cleverly disguised antisemitism

The above post wasn’t mine, I merely quoted it but I support it anyway.

I also don’t believe criticising the Israeli government is anti semitism. However, I do object to apologists for Hamas blaming Israel for the barbarism of 7/10.

I posted upthread that I was heartened to hear the elderly Jewish lady speak well of her captors and to hear that they were treating all the hostages well. Her husband is still captive and has always campaigned for peace and better treatment of Palestinians.

What can’t be denied is whoever planned the massacre was aware that the squads sent in were bloodthirsty savages. That’s unforgivable.

Gloryanny -you seem to believe anyone who supports the release of hostages, is disgusted by the actions of Hamas is somehow in full support of the Israeli government. It isn’t 1947 and no one can undo the decisions made then.
We should all stand for international law, the protection of innocent lives and humanitarian support for Palestinians
There has to be hope and work towards a two state, political solution.
That’s where the efforts of the Israeli government and Hamas should be, along with political leaders throughout the world

Children in Gaza dying because of Israeli bombs. (There are images of dead children in this video and you may choose not to watch it). 2000 children are reported as dead. Parents are writing their child's name on their leg so they can identify them if they are hit,
edition.cnn.com/2023/10/24/middleeast/israel-hamas-gaza-war-tuesday-intl-hnk/index.html

tickingbird

^There’s no point trying to explain the reasons certain sites are targeted, the bias is so strong it’s cleverly disguised antisemitism.^

Not always disguised GG13

There are Jewish people protesting about the bombing of Gaza all over the world. The concept that the actions of Israel are at all linked with Judaism is about as anti-semitic as you can get.
www.france24.com/en/americas/20231020-not-in-our-name-the-jewish-new-yorkers-speaking-out-against-dehumanisation-of-palestinians
edition.cnn.com/2023/10/23/us/jewish-palestinian-protest-israel-gaza/index.html
Te Jewish Voice For Peace has actions for Jews to take www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/2022/08/gaza-under-attack-toolkit-2/

Hamas, set the children of Israel you are holding as hostages and human shields free