Starmer’s Dilemma Over Palestinian Situation

Rachel Reeves wants to bring back PFIs, thet were a mistake last time, worth trying I suppose but as they turned out to be false economy why bring them back

Not a good idea at all. I'm surprised she's even thought about it.

Don't worry about the Football Bank Holiday, very unlikely!
It would be a good idea to have an autumn Bank Holiday, though; it's a long time between August and Christmas and we do tend to have fewer than many other countries.

Ilovecheese doesn’t England have to win the football match first? World Cup for example?

Rachel Reeves wants to bring back PFIs, thet were a mistake last time, worth trying I suppose but as they turned out to be false economy why bring them back.

No money to reverse the cruelty of the two child benefit cap, but a suggestion for a bank holiday because of a football match. Now I've nothing against more bank holidays but why could we afford that and not afford to lift children out of poverty.

Glorianny

Casdon

Grany

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

What are you talking about Grany, there are no plans to change free school meals entitlement? Are you referring to the wish list for all primary school pupils to receive free school meals without means testing? If that’s the case it’s hardly surprising that Rachel Reeves, or any would be chancellor, is making no commitments is it? Do you think there is a magic money tree which speaks to her of all the things she should be doing, without giving her control of the economy, somewhere lurking in her back pocket perhaps?

I though all mention of the "Magic Money Tree" had been abandoned since Rishi found one during the pandemic. It obviously didn't take root then?

It got lost I think when Jeremy Corbyn left Labour - I know Amber Rudd accused him of believing in it, so he probably took it with him.

I must be very left-wing because I do believe in a free school lunch for all children in State education, not means-tested.
Not just a slice of pizza, either.

It might be the only proper meal some children have all day.

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

As they are not allowed to talk to the Treasury Civil Servants how do you propose she gets that information Grany?

The 1944 Education Act required all LEAs to provide a midday meal and set nutritional guidelines to follow. Efforts to provide all meals free of charge to the recipient proved too costly and in 1949 the Labour government allowed LEAs to charge 6d. per meal while still providing some meals free to disadvantaged schoolchildren.

It really is a very long time - my whole lifetime - since governments found it was economically impossible to provide free meals for all and this was when poverty and all the privations of a recent war existed. It was also probably the most left-wing government we have had.

Sometimes doing what works is more important than the extremist's vision of impossible to achieve sunlit uplands.

Grany will shout even louder about how awful the Labour Party is.

What will you do when they win Grany?

ronib

Grany

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

Grany relax chill it’s going to be fully costed.

We have Gransetters who could advise her 🙂

It's not like a household budget.
She could try feeling down the sides of the sofa, the bottom of a handbag, pockets, as I did on occasion for school dinner money.
It's surprising how much you could find down there.

Casdon

Grany

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

What are you talking about Grany, there are no plans to change free school meals entitlement? Are you referring to the wish list for all primary school pupils to receive free school meals without means testing? If that’s the case it’s hardly surprising that Rachel Reeves, or any would be chancellor, is making no commitments is it? Do you think there is a magic money tree which speaks to her of all the things she should be doing, without giving her control of the economy, somewhere lurking in her back pocket perhaps?

I though all mention of the "Magic Money Tree" had been abandoned since Rishi found one during the pandemic. It obviously didn't take root then?

Grany

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

What are you talking about Grany, there are no plans to change free school meals entitlement? Are you referring to the wish list for all primary school pupils to receive free school meals without means testing? If that’s the case it’s hardly surprising that Rachel Reeves, or any would be chancellor, is making no commitments is it? Do you think there is a magic money tree which speaks to her of all the things she should be doing, without giving her control of the economy, somewhere lurking in her back pocket perhaps?

Grany

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

Grany relax chill it’s going to be fully costed.

DaisyAnneReturns

Glorianny

Well that video tried to excuse the inexcusable. Who has more experience of peace processes Starmer or Corbyn? (Clue, one has two peace prizes) Who is not influenced by Israel?

Apart from that, there are the hostages. I think there can be little doubt now that Israel expected to find them under the Al-Shifa hospital. They built it and knew there is a huge bomb-proof underground shelter there. Possibly one of the few places such numbers could be held in the tunnels. It seems more likely now that the hostages are held in small groups in other places . Hamas are not as simple as Israel seems to imagine.

The video also fails to understand that Israel intends to do what it has always said now and in the last war, bomb Gaza back into the middle ages, and are quite happy to see thousands of dead and thousands of refugees.

Why are you involving Corbyn in this Gloriany. He is just a man with a view?

The video was about the Labour Party and it's leader. Corbyn's problem (and those who laud his views) is that he has both a very narrow perspective on this and he has no sense of diplomacy when it comes to foreign powers. A good person to have around for single issue campaigns (when they are the same bias as your own) but not someone a government is likely to take notice of.

I've involved Corbyn because he has been vociferous in his demands for a ceasefire, and has years of experience in campaigning for and enabling the peace process.
Starmer on the other hand has no such history.
So who is more qualified to understand the peace process?
The concept that Corbyn has no sense of diplomacy is largely based on the fact that he isn't influenced, paid or recompensed by any foreign power and doesn't therefore comply with US or Israeli demands (or lobbying).

As for the concept that there is less criticism of the government, well of course there is. It is nothing to do with the right wing media and everything to do with expectations. The LP has always stood up for the oppressed and supported peace. It still does. Many Unions are urging their members not to handle military equipment being sent to Israel. The problem is that the LP has a leader totally out of touch with the grassroots party.

It horrifies me that Reeves is going to be our next chancellor. She doesn’t know where the money is going to come from to give children free school meals.

You only have to look at how Wes Streeting is bragging that he is holding the door of the NHS wide open to the private sector to see we are in serious trouble.

The Labour Party has been taken over by corporatists who are interested only in privatisation and war, and whatever they have planned, you can guarantee it’s not good.

The whole bunch of them from the right in the party no good.

Grany

Let’s get this straight: it’s “anti-democratic” for constituents to demand their MPs represent their views and comply with international law, but presumably, it’s fine for lobbyists to demand MPs don’t comply with international law. (If you don’t understand how much our democracy has been compromised, you should watch the award-winning Al-Jazeera documentary The Lobby.)

It is somewhat undemocratic for you to "demand" an MP who, once elected, represents all his constituents, to put forward the view of one person or a small group Grany.

If we had Delegate representation then our MP's would be delegated the responsibility to act in the interests of the people who elected them.

Currently, they are not. They are Representatives and as such are free to serve the people as they think best.

Yes DAR. In order for Labour to win the GE (🤞) they will have to overcome the behemoth that is the right-wing media in this country.

There’s a point made on the video about why so much criticism is being levelled at Keir Starmer’s position, and less so towards the stance of the actual government. I think this bias is being driven by the media - both main stream and social.

Phil Moorhouse (the chap in the video) and three others, including Femi Oluwole, a women who is on twitter, and the chap who pulls a group called Labour Social together, (on which Phil also appears) held two fringe events at the Labour Conference LizzieDrip. For all four this was their job and main source of income.

One was inside the Conference and one outside so none members could attend. They were about what Labour could do to improve their very poor use of social media and why the need to - mainly right-wing ownership of MSM.

It was really interesting but did show how poor Labour are at this.

Glorianny

Well that video tried to excuse the inexcusable. Who has more experience of peace processes Starmer or Corbyn? (Clue, one has two peace prizes) Who is not influenced by Israel?

Apart from that, there are the hostages. I think there can be little doubt now that Israel expected to find them under the Al-Shifa hospital. They built it and knew there is a huge bomb-proof underground shelter there. Possibly one of the few places such numbers could be held in the tunnels. It seems more likely now that the hostages are held in small groups in other places . Hamas are not as simple as Israel seems to imagine.

The video also fails to understand that Israel intends to do what it has always said now and in the last war, bomb Gaza back into the middle ages, and are quite happy to see thousands of dead and thousands of refugees.

Why are you involving Corbyn in this Gloriany. He is just a man with a view?

The video was about the Labour Party and it's leader. Corbyn's problem (and those who laud his views) is that he has both a very narrow perspective on this and he has no sense of diplomacy when it comes to foreign powers. A good person to have around for single issue campaigns (when they are the same bias as your own) but not someone a government is likely to take notice of.

I feel that as Keir Starmer is hoping to be the next Prime Minister, a position that involves representing the whole of this diverse and multicultural country, he should not be seen as if he is taking sides in this war.
If he is hoping to lead us all, he should represent us all.
I agree though, with Lizziedrip about the right wing narrative on the main news channels

Because Kier Starmer next likely PM Being a Labour Party in opposition to the government he could have taken stance, that most people want and many countries a ceasefire to build peace stop the carpet bombing. The ongoing genocide is horrific for anyone to see and as a human rights lawyer he should know that what Israel are doing is going against international law. But he is funded by the Israel lobby and most of his ministers.

People want a ceasefire Now.

Well that video tried to excuse the inexcusable. Who has more experience of peace processes Starmer or Corbyn? (Clue, one has two peace prizes) Who is not influenced by Israel?

Apart from that, there are the hostages. I think there can be little doubt now that Israel expected to find them under the Al-Shifa hospital. They built it and knew there is a huge bomb-proof underground shelter there. Possibly one of the few places such numbers could be held in the tunnels. It seems more likely now that the hostages are held in small groups in other places . Hamas are not as simple as Israel seems to imagine.

The video also fails to understand that Israel intends to do what it has always said now and in the last war, bomb Gaza back into the middle ages, and are quite happy to see thousands of dead and thousands of refugees.

There’s a point made on the video about why so much criticism is being levelled at Keir Starmer’s position, and less so towards the stance of the actual government. I think this bias is being driven by the media - both main stream and social. I watched two news reports over the weekend, one on Sky News and one on BBC, which demonstrated this issue perfectly. One was covering one of the small peace marches; the reporter was asking people what they thought of Keir Starmer’s position on the war - not Sunak’s! The other report started by supposedly explaining about it being a special day in the Jewish calendar; filmed Starmer going to a synagogue and, of course, fired questions at him about Labour being divided etc. Neither reports gave any balance - no mention of Sunak’s position; no asking people at a march what they thought about his stance etc. This is drip-feeding of a right-wing narrative by the media; I hope people don’t fall for it because it will be ever-present in the build up to the GE.

Let’s get this straight: it’s “anti-democratic” for constituents to demand their MPs represent their views and comply with international law, but presumably, it’s fine for lobbyists to demand MPs don’t comply with international law. (If you don’t understand how much our democracy has been compromised, you should watch the award-winning Al-Jazeera documentary The Lobby.)

Glad it was useful to you both. The chap doing it is an ex lecturer (physicist) so I find he does a lot of research and analysis and explains really well. Just what I need

Thanks DAR, good explanation. I wrote to KS a couple of weeks ago expressing the distress anyone watching the news feels. A had a long detailed response which resulted in me continuing to support the Labour position. This you tube vid does that well