OFSTED is not ‘Fit for purpose’ yet world class education goal?

But I think you're in Scotland (correct me if I'm wrong). English local authorities now have hardly any advisors.

I’m not in Scotland.

The problem is that schools which have become academies probably don’t have LEA advisors.
Many primaries where I work have resisted becoming academies.
Many primary schools where my DD is head have also resisted and have attached advisors, though where she is, (still not Scotland) they are called something else.

Luckygirl I know PREVENT has been around for a while. I don't know all the details, but my understanding is that there were some changes to procedures (or something) for the new school year and staff weren't fully up-to-date.

It's written somewhere (in the report or an announcement by Ofsted - can't remember) that no children had been at risk, which is what I find puzzling. If that was the case, it wasn't a major safe-guarding issue.

I picked up from the inquiry that the "flossing" dance on the second day contributed to the judgment. If that's true, it's ridiculous because it's not sexual - it was a TikTok craze and meant nothing very much but apparently the inspector refused to be budged.

I have written that safeguarding is a difficult area. I am interested in the examples given (and, accepting that they are anecdotal) which are very difficult to interpret.
Thise who work every day with children can understand the context of some remarks and behaviour. Supervision (of the helpful kind) is important so that staff can check things out. But a clunky, tick-box type of referral, out of context, to SS or PREVENT can end up doing more harm than good, and staff know this.
I worked in a very diverse area. I had to often discuss these issues with new workers. In some cultures / countries it is traditional to dress girls, especially at party / carnival time in ways that traditional British culture sees as inappropriate. As for 'flossing' I remember my parents being horrified by some French children who 'danced like Zizi Jeanmaire' for a joke. You could call it 'sexualised' but really, fussing about it makes it something it isn't.
Inexperienced staff should always be able to discuss their concerns freely with more experienced workers before referrals. I am not horrified by a teacher not knowing whether to refer to PREVENT or not, I want to know that they know with whom to discuss it.

growstuff

Luckygirl3

It didn't indicate that in the report, but it does not go into specific incidents as far as I could see.

I've read (admittedly anecdotally, but from sources which seem reliable) that the inspector quizzed the head and some teachers (including a newly qualified teacher) about new safeguarding guidelines, specifically about PREVENT (the anti-terrorism programme), which had only been introduced by the DfE a couple of weeks previously. They didn't give confident answers and got flustered because the inspector's questioning was aggressive. There were apparently some gaps in writing up incidents and the inspector saw some pupils performing the "flossing" dance in the playground, which he deemed to be sexual.

The inspector said that no children were at risk and the shortfalls could be remedied within 30 days. Nevertheless, the "inadequate" rating was published.

PREVENT has been around for years. All staff and governors have to keep themselves updated on it.

To say that no children were at risk contradicts the idea of a safeguarding fail. And I agree that if they were small "fails" that could be remedied in 30 days they should have been given the time to do that.

Luckygirl3

It didn't indicate that in the report, but it does not go into specific incidents as far as I could see.

I've read (admittedly anecdotally, but from sources which seem reliable) that the inspector quizzed the head and some teachers (including a newly qualified teacher) about new safeguarding guidelines, specifically about PREVENT (the anti-terrorism programme), which had only been introduced by the DfE a couple of weeks previously. They didn't give confident answers and got flustered because the inspector's questioning was aggressive. There were apparently some gaps in writing up incidents and the inspector saw some pupils performing the "flossing" dance in the playground, which he deemed to be sexual.

The inspector said that no children were at risk and the shortfalls could be remedied within 30 days. Nevertheless, the "inadequate" rating was published.

Luckygirl3

It didn't indicate that in the report, but it does not go into specific incidents as far as I could see.

Indeed! Independent schools which belong to one of the associations (eg GSA, HMC) do not have Ofsted inspections. The ISI inspects about half of independent schools and has a different inspection framework.

Mollygo

Lovetopaint037,
Our school, so presumably not just our school, has an attached LEA advisor, au fait with OFSTED matters, who does a pre inspection check when we are in the window .
She is not just for there for that.
She comes into school regularly, to meet staff, advise on any issues, talk about progress, visit lessons or do the HT appraisal, or when requested to support the head/school.
I’m sure it isn’t just our school, but it might just be our LEA as I’ve heard no other mention of it on here.

But I think you're in Scotland (correct me if I'm wrong). English local authorities now have hardly any advisors.

Lovetopaint037

In the early seventies I remember the council schools had an attached inspector whose job was to SUPPORT the school. This meant that regular visits were made and time was given to air problems and relationships were established with staff. I remember our head shaking her head and saying that the difference between that system and the later changes was that one was based on support and the other on fear. As all good teachers know if you want to help children to gain their full potential you establish an ethos of support and achievement.

Not only that, but specialist subject teachers in secondary schools had after-school meetings with other specialist teachers. Of course there were some loud mouths who used to tell us how wonderful they were, but they were opportunities to share ideas, good practice (and frustrations). These days schools are in competition with each other, so keep good practice to themselves, so it's "imposed" by gurus who send their days sitting in Whitehall being impressed by the latest fads, no matter whether they'd be practical in a real classroom (and probably how much the publishers of fad schemes donate to whatever party is in power).

Mollygo - would that our school had such an advisor - the local LEA has dwindled to virtually nothing.

And....Ofsted costs a lot of money. It is a well paid second career for some retired teachers. Maybe the money might be spent more usefully?

Lovetopaint037,
Our school, so presumably not just our school, has an attached LEA advisor, au fait with OFSTED matters, who does a pre inspection check when we are in the window .
She is not just for there for that.
She comes into school regularly, to meet staff, advise on any issues, talk about progress, visit lessons or do the HT appraisal, or when requested to support the head/school.
I’m sure it isn’t just our school, but it might just be our LEA as I’ve heard no other mention of it on here.

In the early seventies I remember the council schools had an attached inspector whose job was to SUPPORT the school. This meant that regular visits were made and time was given to air problems and relationships were established with staff. I remember our head shaking her head and saying that the difference between that system and the later changes was that one was based on support and the other on fear. As all good teachers know if you want to help children to gain their full potential you establish an ethos of support and achievement.

hallgreenmiss

maddyone

Independent schools do have official OFSTED inspections. My husband worked in an independent school for many years and there were a number of OFSTED inspections during his time there. Before OFSTED came into being, there were other governmental inspections at his school, but I can’t remember what they were called.

Independent schools are inspected by the Independent Schools Inspectorate, (ISI).

ISI is answerable to Ofsted. The quality of its service is monitored by Ofsted.

Ofsted needs an overhaul. As previously said some of the inspectors are on an ego trip. It should be encouraging and not destructive to schools. The amount of preparation time and fear that these visits cause is unbelievable. The fact that is becoming impossible to recruit new teachers speaks volumes about the profession. Now they want to recruit eighteen year olds to learn on the job. I am a retired teacher and the way that the profession has been downgraded since the Tories have been in government is shocking.

This is exactly the sort of thing that makes teachers and governors so anxious - the thought that they are trying to trip people up on these small things and blowing them out of proportion. Racism is clearly unacceptable, but however much teachers try to create an atmosphere of harmony there will be pupils who will do this sort of thing regardless; and misgendering is an easy slip to make - I do it with my GD/S all the time.

It does not feel like a fair system - there is a sense that they are not looking to find out what the positives are and how they can be built upon, but seeking out tiny faults to hone in on and blow out of proportion.

A high school that has been Outstanding since Ofsted began has been downgraded to needs improvement. It failed on safeguarding after a teacher misgendered a pupil. Inspectors also reported hearing racist comments from children in the corridors.
Seriously ?!

maddyone

Independent schools do have official OFSTED inspections. My husband worked in an independent school for many years and there were a number of OFSTED inspections during his time there. Before OFSTED came into being, there were other governmental inspections at his school, but I can’t remember what they were called.

Independent schools are inspected by the Independent Schools Inspectorate, (ISI).

It didn't indicate that in the report, but it does not go into specific incidents as far as I could see.

Was it true that the downgrade of Ruth Perry's school was because any safeguarding fail leads to automatic overall fail - and a young NQT was asked about referral to Prevent (the govt anti-radicalisation programme). She didn't know about it, or gave the wrong answer of something. Bang.

I'd love to know if I misheard this. If it's true it needs to be #1 in any discussion about this poor woman's life.

Our governing body took the decision not to allow inspectors to interview pupils on their own as we felt this breached safeguarding rules. It does happen in schools, but we were clear we were not happy about it.

We are due an OfSted soon and, as staff welfare governor, I am very concerned with this case as it is my job to ensure that staff are not put at risk by any aspect of their job. It feels a big responsibility at the moment.

I was a school Business Manager for 28 years and went through a lot if various inspections including OFSTED. Some inspectors were ok and others were appalling. One HT I had actually told an inspector to leave the premises as he was downright rude to all the staff. And as I was in control of finance amongst other areas, I had audits every year. At the end of day 2 of 3 one auditor told me he hadn’t found anything wrong so would have to dig a bit deeper! He never found anything to complain about and seemed quite miffed!!

It wasn't the inspection itself, which was awful, but the madness before it.
Our HT asked a retired witch of an HT to do a mini pre-inspection. She scrutinised everything, including wall displays. The staff were so upset and demoralised by it.
BTW, this was the time when we were actually awarded eleven out of ten Excellents.

I was an early years teacher for 25 years then a specialist teacher for nearly 10 years. I was never in a school where a full inspection took place (Scottish system) and truly count my blessings. Have known very experienced teachers in bits when they were told they were going to be inspected and my dearest friend, who was an incredible teacher, told me the experience of being inspected was almost as bad as her darling Dad dying. Having said that, the Scottish system seems much better than Ofsted.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/ruth-perry-inquest-ofsted-alan-derry-report-b2460018.html

Some of this has been covered previously in this thread, but the section towards the end is Amanda Spielman outlining changes Ofsted will be making.
Let's hope those still happen.

There are some interesting comments following the article as well, including one from a man whose wife experienced a similar inspection thirteen years ago.

(Apologies for the annoying adverts).

It must not be allowed to happen again

This!