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Why are you giving this the oxygen of publicity?

I think people should know this s happening.

Is this for real? .

Beyond belief- but so much of what is happening there would come under that heading.

That was always the plan.many Jews are disgusted by this and the treatment of the Palestinian people since 1948 .Israel had information about October 7th 2 WEEKS before it happened....this was their way of disposing of Palestinians with no come back .Time the world stood up to Israel once a victim NOW an aggressor .Its genocide in plain sight !

I think that was the agenda all along, and on the West Bank where it is happening in plain sight.. there will be no 2 state policy IMO

I agree. There is now way that Israeli intellgence did not know about the impending Oct 7th attack. In my opinion, Netanyahu let it unfold as it gave him and his right wing settler supporters 'permission' to do what they wanted.

I give my opinion whilst strongly condemning the atrocities carried out by Hamas, but I think that Netanyahu has blood on his hands, Israeli and Palestinian.

There is now way that Israeli intelligence did not know about the impending Oct 7th attack. In my opinion,

It was reported at least last week that the IDF 'spotters' on the border, whose job it is to look for unusual activity from Gaza, reported that Hamas was undertaking obvious training for an offensive of some sort, several weeks before the actual attack.

The story goes that their intelligence was ignored because they were female and low ranking. It's reported that several of the spotters were killed in the 7/10 attack.

I didn't post about this at the time as I was keeping away from the Israel/Hamas thread. As an example of male chauvinism I found it very upsetting, but HPQ's spin on the story makes it even more horrific.

(P.S. I read the story in the Financial Times, so thought it to be bona fide)

That's interesting Maizie I hadn't read that. Also remember that for weeks, months prior to Oct 7th, there were mass protests in Tel Aviv against Netanyahu and the draconian laws he and his minorities wanted to impose on the electorate.

It’s been reported that there is little if anything being reported on Gaza by Israeli media. Jeremy Bowen has just been interviewed and said Israelis aren’t generally interested in what is happening there.
The international press are not allowed in.

Over 20,000 are dead, mostly women and children, thousands injured and untreated and many bodies still under flattened buildings. It’s truly heartbreaking.

HousePlantQueen

I agree. There is now way that Israeli intellgence did not know about the impending Oct 7th attack. In my opinion, Netanyahu let it unfold as it gave him and his right wing settler supporters 'permission' to do what they wanted.

I give my opinion whilst strongly condemning the atrocities carried out by Hamas, but I think that Netanyahu has blood on his hands, Israeli and Palestinian.

Yes, this is what Jewish friends are saying. Intelligence had been warning about such an attack for a long time. And the IDF has hugely advanced technology for surveillance and precise attacks. It would have been almost simple to stop the attack- at the fence (it took quite some time to destroy it, and with very large plant- visible to the IDF)- and then there was quite a distance for Hamas to cover before the attacks. Again, IDF advanced technology would have allowed for them to know, and to attack, with very little, or even no, loss of life to Israel.

If indeed it becomes clear at some point, and I think many have made their mind already with the evidence available so far- that Netanyahu and the IDF 'allowed' this to happen, so that it would give them the 'excuse' vis-à-vis the world and their main ally, USA, to bomb the lot and then re-possess. And the last thing on their mind, I believe, is a two State solution.

It is such an abominable thing to say, with the past in mind, and will use other words to say the same- the solution of all solutions.

HousePlantQueen

That's interesting Maizie I hadn't read that. Also remember that for weeks, months prior to Oct 7th, there were mass protests in Tel Aviv against Netanyahu and the draconian laws he and his minorities wanted to impose on the electorate.

A search has revealed a lot of stories about the disregard of the intelligence from the Israel/ Gaza border, dating from late October onwards. I'll post a link to my search results, which include the FT story that I read. That's paywalled, but others might be available to read.

duckduckgo.com/?q=Israeli+spotters+reported+Hamas+action+before+7th+october&t=chromentp&ia=web

Netanyahu and his ilk have been wanting to exterminate Palestinians for a long time - here are articles and messages from 2014. They make shocking reading (so does the burning alive )

electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/israeli-lawmakers-call-genocide-palestinians-gets-thousands-facebook-likes

The Inconvenient Truth Is That Israel Will Have to Rebuild Gaza
Someone will have to take responsibility for the enclave and Israel is the only realistic candidate. It’s an unwelcome but necessary task

And so they should - without making any profits.

Sorry:

www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-16/ty-article/.premium/the-inconvenient-truth-is-that-israel-will-have-to-rebuild-gaza/0000018b-d7e4-dffa-adef-f7e4f0ec0000

I came across this in the Washington Post
www.972mag.com/intelligence-ministry-gaza-population-transfer/
It is a rather chilling read, not necessarily something that the Israeli Govt will do but certainly shows the thinking of those on the right wing of Israeli politics. I find the Washington Post a pretty reliable source of information.

(https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/12/19/egypt-gaza-refugees-displaced-israel/)

Agree with you HPQ and Fleurpepper- I don't believe that the Israeli spy network ( allegedly one of the best in the world) didn't see this coming. The people of Israel are very badly served by the egomania of Netanyahu. He does, indeed, have the blood of his own people on his hands, as much as that of his adversaries. I fear that this worries him very little - victory is all that matters to him.

It’s pretty likely that Israeli intelligence knew an attack was imminent, however they were not be able to do anything about it unless Hamas struck first. In the event Hamas killed hundreds and we have seen the result - about 10 Palestinians killed for every one Israeli.

Hamas seems willing to fight to the last Palestinian, Israel will do the same if needed

Israeli Intelligence did know there was an attack imminent. Whether they ignored it because of chauvinism, or did so deliberately, it doesn't excuse the fact that they were unprepared at the border and no warning given to kibbutz's likely to be vulnerable. Even if the timing was uncertain they could have been in a state of preparedness.

It is such an unbelievable tragedy.

Katie59

It’s pretty likely that Israeli intelligence knew an attack was imminent, however they were not be able to do anything about it unless Hamas struck first. In the event Hamas killed hundreds and we have seen the result - about 10 Palestinians killed for every one Israeli.

Hamas seems willing to fight to the last Palestinian, Israel will do the same if needed

Of course they could have done a lot first- a) listen ot warnings and take them seriously b) it took quite a while for Hamas to get through the heavily fenced border, and with large plant- they could have been taken out by drone strikes there and then b) there was about 30 km for Hamas to cover between the fence and their target- they could have been taken out on their way, with drone or other attacks. Killing only Hamas, and before they could strike. That is the whole point of advanced warning systems, intelligence and very modern technology.

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Reported.