Finnair - Weighing Passengers

You know when we laugh at the times when people used to say smoking was good for you.
In the future my guess is people will look at the way we pussyfoot around obesity in the same way.

DH has just reminded me that when I used to fly back and forwards to Europe (way back in early 80’s) I used to get weighed along with suitcase, pram and babe in arms at Luton airport. It must have been Monarch Airlines, as they flew out of Luton regularly to my home town.

People are getting bigger is quite an understatement on what is happening.

IMHO This would be fat shaming.

I can't imagine the shame of the person being singled out as 'a burden' on the plane.

Some people have illnesses that make them overweight: eating disorders that are an illness and not just 'greed'. Some take medication that puts on weight. Some have genetic differences that their body never signals that they are full etc. Overeating and weight gain usually has an underlying illness.. whether mental or physical.
As for the safety of everyone. We have all been flying safely with all body types so far but I guess as people are becoming bigger the airlines need to allow for this in their planning..... and not make it personal.

Oh, and I'm not trying to close down any conversation or healthy discussion, by the way. Bring it on...

GrannyGravy13

MissInterpreted

Let the fat shaming begin...

It’s nothing to do with fat shaming

Aircraft’s safety relies on weight to fuel ratio along with the weight capacity of the aircraft itself.

Sorry safety of all onboard should always be uppermost.

When I spoke of fat shaming, I meant on here. Somehow any threads which mention overweight or obese people always seem to bring out the worst in some posters.

MissInterpreted

Let the fat shaming begin...

Let's close down healthy discussion

MissInterpreted

Let the fat shaming begin...

Well I, for one, hope that we are a mature empathetic group of people, who will not do that but the above comment is often used to close down conversation. I like to see people who struggle with their weight get much more help and support via the NHS. It's one area of primary health care that would make a huge difference to people's lives and offer a return on the investment. I'd also like to see the govt take a more pro-active role in ensuring the food for sale in our supermarkets isn't contributing to the problem.

MissInterpreted

Let the fat shaming begin...

It’s nothing to do with fat shaming

Aircraft’s safety relies on weight to fuel ratio along with the weight capacity of the aircraft itself.

Sorry safety of all onboard should always be uppermost.

MissInterpreted

Let the fat shaming begin...

There should never be fat shaming as often people who become obese have health problems such as depression or other issues.
Obesity does cause problems for the NHS. When my DD started nursing it took 6 nurses to turn an obese person rather than 2. There had to be special wide trolleys and beds too. This is apart from the fact that they are more inclined to develop certain illnesses.

If your baggage, carry on or hold is overweight you have to pay more…

Let the fat shaming begin...

My daughter could have written your post foxie, and as you know, she’s a doctor. She frequently talks about the cost to the health service of overweight people.
Whilst I wouldn’t want to see people humiliated by being weighed at the airport, I do think it wouldn’t be unreasonable for them to give an appropriate weight when booking, but it would also need to include height as well, because as someone upthread pointed out, a tall person weighing the same as a small person would lead to very different needs in the seat.
To be honest, I think that airline seats have been getting smaller and smaller in recent years and I vehemently disagree with this. Some are as little as 17 inches across and frankly that is too small for comfort. Not so bad on EasyJet going to Greece, but a different matter when flying Singapore Airlines to New Zealand.

There have been a couple at least aircraft, that crashed through being over the weight they thought they had onboard.

But one was a military plane with all men passengers.

I was'nt sure, but the link makes it all sound reasonable?

news.sky.com/story/finnair-airline-starts-weighing-passengers-with-luggage-to-ensure-a-safe-take-off-13066646

It's not just the weight of the passenger but also, airlines have to think about the overall weight of the plane, the weight of the seating and other equipment, the combined weight of the pilots, various cabin crew and loads of passengers + all the luggage, stuff in holding bays etc. Planes may be huge hulking things but they can only take so much internal weight so if they have too many seriously obese passengers at any one time it could actually affect air flow, putting crew and passengers at risk.

But at the same time, I understand why some passengers would be angry or upset!

Well exactly Foxie! you've made valid points and I agree about being extremely overweight being normalised, I've heard outraged comments from very obese people in the context of flying that they should not be penalised, but once again, if, like you, you are seated next to a very overweight individual who encroaches on one's personal space, whose rights should be paramount?

I am going to be very controversial here. I look forward to the day when being very overweight is viewed in the same way as smoking, ie there is a recognition of how damaging it is to the person and how expensive it is to society. I say this as an ex smoker and as someone who has changed their lifestyle so I stay within an acceptable weight. I know many will think this is a dreadful attitude to have but I worry about how the NHS, which is already creaking, will cope with the additional burden of dealing with the co-morbidities that are caused by most of the population being unhealthily fat (sorry I've used that word because that is what they are). Being too fat is being normalised in our society and it is killing people too early or leading to people leading impaired lives because of multiple health issues. Over 5 million people in this country now have diabetes and 90/95% of them will have type 2. Heart disease, high blood pressure, certain types of cancer, failing joints all have links to obesity. We have a national crisis with children's teeth, partly because of lack of access to dentists but mainly because of sugar laden diets. We have become a very unhealthy nation.
Coming back to the topic, my last flight was thoroughly miserable. I had a window seat and the person next to me was huge. The plane was quite warm and I was squashed up to the window for three hours whilst my neighbour sweated profusely and constantly poked me with his elbow. We had paid the same amount for our seats but I only had partial use of mine!
I have put my tin hat on as no doubt this post will provoke some angry responses but surely we should be talking about this?

It’s a trial, the weight is kept private. It is all to do with where people are seated on the aircraft, fuel needed for the overall weight of the plane and its occupants, baggage and freight.

I can see the point of it and personally think it’s a good thing.

Many years ago we were flying back from Turkey when I spotted an extremely obese man (30+ stone). I thought I pity anyone on the aircraft seated nearby. I could not believe it when he sat in the seat in front of me. The seat went backwards under all that weight giving me little room and terrified the seat would break. His obese wife was in the aisle seat and a very young child sat between them.

I’m short and fat, I don’t need an extension on my seat belt and don’t overspill my seat. I’m very overweight, I would agree to be weighed if it was for safely reasons.

I don’t see anything in the news reports about charging larger passengers extra.

The Finnish Transport and Communications Agency will check average weights calculated from the data this summer. The airline will use those numbers for aircraft balance and loading calculations from 2025 to 2030. (NBC News)

I’ve flown on many very light-aircraft where it’s standard procedure for pilots to ask passengers how much they weigh and then distribute passengers around the plane for balance.

The overspilling seat issue isn’t about weight but size. Two people, one short and fat, one tall and muscular could weigh the same. Mike Tyson's fighting weight was around 220lbs about fifteen and half stone. He was 5'10". I'm much shorter. If I weighed that I'd be hanging over the seat.

I do sympathise with people whose personal space is encroached. I’ve experience it, on a bus not a plane, where I could barely get one bum cheek on the seat and it’s been easier to standbut where does one draw the line on these things? I’ve had uncomfortable plane journeys where a very tall person has had to jam their legs again my seat and felt obliged to apologise for the nuisance. They really should have beee seated in the bulkhead but these seats are often claimed by people with other needs.

Airlines need to adapt their configurations, acknowledging that people come in a variety of sizes. Size isn’t a choice and sometimes obesity isn’t either.

I knew someone whose job it was configure cabin space depending on the kind of cargo, human or freight. Taking out a few rows and not selling seats to maximum capacity would make journeys a lot more comfortable for everyone but then airtlines would argue that ticket prices would have to rise.

Aircraft have a set maximum weight to ensure safe takeoff. Fuel requirements are calculated based on weight and distance. Planes carry little more fuel than necessary to complete a journey and margins are tight.

A few years ago, returning from Greece, there was a ground incident at Gatwick causing planes to be be held waiting for permission to land. We circled for only about five minutes before the pilot announced that if held much longer he would need to reroute to Luton to take on more fuel - which is what happened. It was little more than a splash and dash. We were back in the air and landed at Gatwick soon after. It made me wonder just how tight the fuel calculation must have been and what had factored into it.

On a flight back from South Africa I had a very tall and large male passenger in front of me who tipped his seat back and I couldn't get out to the loo. The crew wouldn't speak to him to move his seat forward. Longest flight of my life so yes please can airlines take account of the growing size of people.

I've often thought that if one day each and every passenger was terribly overweight then the plane would be overloaded and not be able to take off.

I've flown with Finnair, thank goodness they weren't doing it then (although I was very slim in those days). It could be embarrassing.

However, having stood in a huge check-in queue at Heathrow, watching a family with two small children being made to unpack and readjust all their luggage because it was a bit overweight, yet the woman between us and them in the queue was extremely overweight, I can understand it could be considered a good idea.