Labour and the NHS

Iam64

How anyone can think it’s ok to deport asylum seekers to a country from which we accept asylum seekers is a puzzle to me 😂

... me, too.

I believe the numbers from Rwanda will be small - however, why are we deporting asylum seekers to a country from which others will seek asylum?

There must be some logic in there somewhere, but on the face of it - it does seem rather strange.

As for the effect it will have on numbers crossing boats to the UK, some appear to think we should wait and see. Not being an expert in these matters my POV is purely subjective, and that is - it will have no major impact, and the agencies will strill struggle to process the claims. Apparently, it's a bit of a grim job and staff turnover is quite high leading to less well-trained staff taking on the roles.

Maybe taxpayers' money would've been better spent on significant improvements to staffing levels, and drawing up a proper procedure for failed asylum seekers. Numbers and statistics - accurate ones - are hard to come by, but it does seem that the claims are being processed so very slowly. It's all been so very half-hearted and this popular Rwandan scheme won't really solve a problem that is, in essence, a global problem. People have migrated around the globe since - well, they first decided to walk from one place to another, and it's not going to stop any time soon. It needs a global get-together of the great-and-the-good to hammer out a realistic policy to deal with the matter.

Well said MaizieD

I think it just demonstrates that the will of the sovereign Parliament doesn't agree with the will of the government.

Parliament is sovereign, not the government.

The Lords did have it in their power to hold it up, yet again, but I think they decided that, as the subordinate house, they couldn't do it any longer.

MaizieD DH agreed that thwarted wasn’t the right word to use in this context. So I guess stating that it took 2 years from first reading of the bill to enactment is okay? That’s not thwarting just the amount of time it took.
Two years does seem a long time to me however to pass a bill. It started back in the day when BJ was pm.

ronib

Casdon my position therefore is that I am amazed that a government starting out with a majority of 80 seats has ended up where it is today. Unelectable, undesirable and incompetent. What a mess. Does this help?

your response has nothing to do with your assertion that the government has been 'thwarted' in the passage of the Rwanda bill. Which I read (and forgive me if I'm wrong) as disapproval of the 'thwarting' and, by extension, a belief that a government should not be 'thwarted' when trying to pass legislation. Perhaps I shouldn't have made the latter assumption, but I've seen that belief so often on this forum.

Unfortunately, however 'unelectable, undesirable and incompetent' a government is we're stuck with them until either it looses a vote of no confidence or the PM decides to call a general election.

Casdon my position therefore is that I am amazed that a government starting out with a majority of 80 seats has ended up where it is today. Unelectable, undesirable and incompetent. What a mess. Does this help?

You’re not Jeremy Paxman ronib. There’s little point asking leading questions and then refusing to state your own position so you are able to play an equal part in the debate.

I like and want sprinkles on ice cream. I don’t know what my personal preferences, if I have any, have to do with this particular thread.

ronib

Casdon government seems cripplingly slow to do anything these days. Living in the UK sometimes feels like living on an ice float. - no sense of direction, no real achievements and just muddling along.

The (unwritten) British constitution does not give any government a mandate to do whatever it wants. If it did, it would mean that any government with just a majority of one could introduce all kinds of outrageous laws. Is that really what you want?

You haven’t actually said whether you personally think the government should have unrestricted power or not ronib, you’re skirting around it.

MaizieD this government has not had unrestricted power. It wouldn’t know what to do with it even if it had it….. it does however have a large majority.

ronib

MaizieD okay. Obviously parliamentary democracy whatever that means is allowed to block and delay legislation proposed by the elected government of the day.

You need a history lesson.

It's staggering the number of people who think that the government should have unrestricted power.

Casdon government seems cripplingly slow to do anything these days. Living in the UK sometimes feels like living on an ice float. - no sense of direction, no real achievements and just muddling along.

Do you think being the government of the day should mean that it can do whatever it likes, whether in the manifesto on which they were elected or not, with no inbuilt checks and balances ronib?

MaizieD okay. Obviously parliamentary democracy whatever that means is allowed to block and delay legislation proposed by the elected government of the day.

If you listen to migrants waiting to try again to get to the uk, they tell you it’s no deterrent
It’s so clear,it’s an international problem that can only get worse. It needs European co-operation

I don’t think any of it is okay Iam64 All I know is that nothing has happened despite a lot of money being spent and no one knows if this policy is any kind of deterrent since it is yet to happen.

Wyllow3

Pouter worked 20 night shifts in the last year. Enough to stay on the doctors register and not too many to interfere with MP work.

I agree in general by elections should always be held, but with a GE so close I don't see how it can benefit the constituency in terms of the everyday work of supporting constituents.

Aways useful to have a doc sister and BiL.

BTW, my BiL went on that particular political journey himself living not too far away from Pouter whilst a consultant in the NHS.

ronib

MaizieD The Rwandan policy has been delayed and is yet to be enforced. It is the policy of the government of the day for right or wrong. It is a bit of a moot point as to whether or not it will stop more people turning up here without correct paperwork. My thoughts are that we can’t judge its effectiveness until it has been implemented for at least six months.
Parliamentary democracy is a strange concept at the best of times.

That response doesn't have anything to do with the question I asked you.

How anyone can think it’s ok to deport asylum seekers to a country from which we accept asylum seekers is a puzzle to me 😂

MaizieD The Rwandan policy has been delayed and is yet to be enforced. It is the policy of the government of the day for right or wrong. It is a bit of a moot point as to whether or not it will stop more people turning up here without correct paperwork. My thoughts are that we can’t judge its effectiveness until it has been implemented for at least six months.
Parliamentary democracy is a strange concept at the best of times.

Labour and the NHS a disaster in Wales. I can understand how a doctor can be an MP as well, because you can’t get to see a. Doctor here.

Thanks for the info Wyllow3, it confirms my understanding that other nhs doctors have done this to maintain registration. As this mp has shown, it also ensures they know what’s really happening despite all the govt nonsense

Pouter worked 20 night shifts in the last year. Enough to stay on the doctors register and not too many to interfere with MP work.

I agree in general by elections should always be held, but with a GE so close I don't see how it can benefit the constituency in terms of the everyday work of supporting constituents.

Casdon

It’s time to get real I think. Singling out one MP and criticising him for having more than one job is rich. According to The Guardian, the register of MPs' interests shows that more than 90 Conservative MPs undertake paid work in addition to their job in parliament, along with three Labour MPs. According to the BBC, "more than 200 MPs received earnings in the last year on top of their £81,932 annual salary. I’d much rather a doctor did work in the NHS as well as being a MP than some of the jobs other MPs do.

Yes this! Most MPs do some form of paid 'work.' Some of which is being paid massive amounts for consultancies.

Whilst I support MPs being in the real world and grafting, I don't think they should be allowed to be paid by multi-national companies for doing little except represent those companies in parliament.

Rish Sunak is a good example of trying to make policies that benefit his own families finances.

It's all wrong.