But does he really 'understand'?

MissAdventure

I've rarely seen this level of concern for other sections of society, when their entitlement to such an amount changes.

Quite the opposite, in fact.
It usually heads straight into lectures about being good money managers, batch cooking, driving to food banks, patting their bellies and being pleased that they'll be given more money, along with downright insults.

It usually heads straight into lectures about being good money managers, batch cooking, driving to food banks...

... and support for 30p Lee who insisted that meals could be cooked for about 30 pence per day.

- which I believe might be possible if you are buying in huge bulk and feeding the five thousand who aren't fussed about what they eat. Families tend to be smaller and their members sometimes 'picky'. Or allergic.

Anyway, I take your point. For my part, I'm in the position of being able to afford the loss - but, it's the injustice meted out on those who whilst being just above the PC cut-off point, could really have done with that money which they've been given no time to recoup or re-budget for.

... but then, I also personally know a young single mother who is working full-time but on a low income and really struggling with her energy bills, and she's in a financial category that would be considered to be 'OK'. So that's an injustice too.

You had to listen to radio 4 this morning. It was talking about future plans for electricity usage. I didn’t believe what I was hearing,
but one of the comments was something like
”I don’t think people are going to be happy about the fridge. We like to be in charge of that ourselves.”
Unfortunately, it’s not beyond the bounds if possibility. I was more interested in the two tier idea of those who can afford solar panels and heat pumps will also get cheaper electricity.

^Then, if I have a smart meter, the energy company could decide to turn my fridge freezer off for an hour at peak times to reduce the demand. peak time is when people cook and open their fridge-freezer.
Is everyone on here happy to have the freezer turned off remotely when the energy companies feel it’s necessary^

Mollygo what on earth are you talking about? I’ve had a Smart meter for years - never had my freezer (or anything else) turned off remotely🤷‍♀️Please enlighten me!

Mollygo my local council are involved in a huge drive building social housing, all of which are getting heat pumps and solar panels, great for the residents and the environment. Our house construction isn't suitable for a heat pump and they won't let us have external insulation or solar panels because we're a conservation area, so it feels as if we're the forgotten. I probably couldn't afford solar panels anyway, but I'm sure some of my younger neighbours could.
Having just had a smart meter for electricity installed, compulsory because our meter was too old and past its use by date, I do hope they can't deliberately interrupt my electricity supply! To be fair, that's not a drawback to smart meters I've read about.

Agree.

What a poisoned chalice Starmer has inherited! He's human, has a family to care for and very little time to do so due to the pressures of his job - unlike Boris who prioritized personal issues over cobra meetings during the early days of covid. I really don't care if he's recieving a few gifts so he and his family look smart enough to represent the country internationally - shouldn't be important but it is these days, imagine if they turned up in jeans and sweatshirts (which is just about the sum total of my wardrobe anyway). I don't think help with costs like school fees is a big deal, after all, he's paid less than his advisors! Why shouldn't he get a few sports and show tickets! The sheer level of corruption that went on in the dealings of the last government was very different and on a totally different scale. Stopping MPs from having second jobs would look like a good way forward but would need some thought as it could be a professional disaster for anyone who wants to return their former career after serving their country - doctors and nurses for example have to work and update their knowledge for a minimum number of hours or lose their right to practice. I want my representatives to do the jobs they are elected for, not scrabble around wasting their time trying to source affordable formal clothes, make up their own pack lunches and sit online to find out the cheapest ways of travelling etc.

It’s all down to bad management of your affairs

Sometimes life doesn't work out how we would wish. Poor health, fractured careers, reeling from loss and yes bad decisions.

Annoying, aren't they?

Platitudes and patronising

Rosie51
It’s all down to bad management of your affairs, not a government, any government responsibility.
I listened to the radio this morning telling me I can save 2/3 off my electricity bill if I have solar panels. The fact that I can’t afford them and have been told by 2 separate firms that our roof is not suitable is probably my fault too.
Then if I had got a heat pump(which we couldn’t afford) instead of my new boiler, which we could afford, I could be given special offers from energy suppliers.
Then, if I have a smart meter, the energy company could decide to turn my fridge freezer off for an hour at peak times to reduce the demand.
peak time is when people cook and open their fridge-freezer.
Is everyone on here happy to have the freezer turned off remotely when the energy companies feel it’s necessary? Or is it just me who would prefer to control that.

It talked about businesses too. Imagine buying your food from Iceland when you don’t know how often the freezer has been turned off by the energy company to reduce usage.

Doodledog

MissAdventure

I've rarely seen this level of concern for other sections of society, when their entitlement to such an amount changes.

Quite the opposite, in fact.
It usually heads straight into lectures about being good money managers, batch cooking, driving to food banks, patting their bellies and being pleased that they'll be given more money, along with downright insults.

Indeed. I wonder what could have brought about the sea change in compassion levels on here🤔

Well I'll remember not to be concerned about anybody but myself from now on, don't want to come under some nasty suspicion.
Doodledog I was under the impression you originally thought the withdrawal should have been delayed until next year to give people time to budget?

MissAdventure

I've rarely seen this level of concern for other sections of society, when their entitlement to such an amount changes.

Quite the opposite, in fact.
It usually heads straight into lectures about being good money managers, batch cooking, driving to food banks, patting their bellies and being pleased that they'll be given more money, along with downright insults.

Indeed. I wonder what could have brought about the sea change in compassion levels on here🤔

Just another thing growstuff if you are on a pre payment metre or struggling hand to mouth building up energy credit during milder weather is impossible.

I really thought you would have more empathy on this.

eazybee I agree. I also do not believe he understands, and if he does, he does not care. I am now very afraid of what's going to happen to the benefits of my autistic son. It used to be the likes of Rees-Mogg I feared, but this Kier Stalin is quite possibly going to outdo 'em all

Even for people on a very low income, it's chickenfeed. some people on very low incomes might be extremely grateful for that chickenfeed. Do you think people on PC should have the chickenfeed WFA withdrawn too?
They're never going to abolish standing charges. The infrastructure of getting gas and electricity to our homes has to be maintained and sharing that cost amongst all consumers seems fair, but I do think standing charges are way too high.

It's £4 a week. It's not difficult to build up a surplus over the summer for the winter months.
I blame all those people who didn't have the foresight to realise there'd be a snap election, Labour would win and the very first economic measure they'd announce would be withdrawal of the WFA with immediate effect. They should have been putting their £4 (or £6 if they were eligible for £300 WFA) aside all summer. It wasn't why I voted Labour, and I'm not alone in that view. Didn't conference vote to reverse the decision? (non binding, I know!)

growstuff I have already posted (cannot remember if it was on this thread or elsewhere) that I think the state pension should be the same for all.

If there was to be an across the board equalisation, with an increase which would bring everyone up to £15,000 say, (pulled that figure out of my proverbial hat) there would be no need for pension credits or WFA.

As the above will probably not happen, WFA and/or pension credits should be available to all lower income pensioners to allow them to live in warmth and eat without the use of food banks.

(I also think that employers should pay their employees enough so that they do not have to rely on universal credit, but that’s a different can of worms)

Just seen this:
But it isn’t toxic IMO
It’s just airing of differing views. If you or anyone else can’t bear seeing criticism of the Labour government or PM then probably best I agree to not look at the political threads as much.
Tbf to Conservative posters, they have had to put up with a lot of criticism of their Party, some of which they will have agreed with and some not, but they had to take it on the chin.Now it’s Labour’s turn in the hot seat and it may make you uncomfortable but you have now to take it on the chin too.
Thank you. It is true, some Conservative actions were difficult to defend but criticism had be accepted
Now it is Labour's turn, and it is obvious from Starmer down they are not prepared to accept criticism, and have little idea how concerned people are by his lack of judgement, from depriving pensioners to his family's acceptance of donations: him, his wife and now in the name of his son.

I think Keir Starmer does understand but if he really told the full facts it would not sound as though he were doing us a favour. He says people should claim pension credit if they are entitled but does he really want them to?
I 've just listened to Martin Lewis on This Morning who has done his maths.
He says if everyone claimed pension Credit who is entitled to it, it would cost more than the WFA and leave a bigger so called 'black hole'
I just think Keir Starmer has taken the easiest decision to attack those who cannot retaliate

GrannyGravy13

growstuff

GrannyGravy13

growstuff to anyone on a low income, whether that be pension, benefits or salary £200 is a lot of money.

But it's a tiny fraction of fuel bills!

(And, excuse me, but I do know what it's like to have a low income.)

If it’s divided over the four coldest months £50 means the difference between being cold, or keeping your home heated to a level which is safe for your health.

Sitting with a blanket and extra clothes may keep your body warm, but the air you breathe is still cold and that can kill the elderly and vulnerable.

It's £4 a week. It's not difficult to build up a surplus over the summer for the winter months. There are other ways of ensuring more equality, so that everybody has enough money to buy essentials. Cue all the bleating about how there will never be equality (and people have always worked hard for what they've got and they're not letting anybody else have any of it) - so let's just continue dishing out crumbs such as WFA (and patting ourselves on the back).

The annual threshold for Pension Credit is about £9,870. £200 is a very small percentage of that. I wrote before that people could save more if the standing charges were abolished. It's less than people were paying extra last year when fuel prices were increased dramatically (but have now fallen). Even for people on a very low income, it's chickenfeed.

growstuff

GrannyGravy13

growstuff to anyone on a low income, whether that be pension, benefits or salary £200 is a lot of money.

But it's a tiny fraction of fuel bills!

(And, excuse me, but I do know what it's like to have a low income.)

If it’s divided over the four coldest months £50 means the difference between being cold, or keeping your home heated to a level which is safe for your health.

Sitting with a blanket and extra clothes may keep your body warm, but the air you breathe is still cold and that can kill the elderly and vulnerable.

I've rarely seen this level of concern for other sections of society, when their entitlement to such an amount changes.

Quite the opposite, in fact.
It usually heads straight into lectures about being good money managers, batch cooking, driving to food banks, patting their bellies and being pleased that they'll be given more money, along with downright insults.

Rosie51

growstuff

kittylester

growstuff

I agree with you Doodledog. I think the sniping says more about the mentality of the people sniping and using silly insults. I don't take any of them seriously.

But it would be nice if we could believe that he did understand. Freezing pensioners will want his understanding.

But but but the idea that there will be millions of freezing pensioners is a myth. Moreover, if anybody (not just pensioners) can't afford to have heating £200 wouldn't have made a huge difference.

I agree, there won't be 10 million freezing pensioners, I don't know how many will suffer from cold this winter and neither do you. For some WFA would be £300.
if anybody (not just pensioners) can't afford to have heating £200 wouldn't have made a huge difference. If £200 wouldn't make a huge difference why are people on PC still getting it? Surely it's because the government think it will make a difference?

I'm not a mind reader, but I would imagine it's so the government can claim that the very poorest will still get it.

GrannyGravy13

growstuff to anyone on a low income, whether that be pension, benefits or salary £200 is a lot of money.

But it's a tiny fraction of fuel bills!

(And, excuse me, but I do know what it's like to have a low income.)

growstuff

kittylester

growstuff

I agree with you Doodledog. I think the sniping says more about the mentality of the people sniping and using silly insults. I don't take any of them seriously.

But it would be nice if we could believe that he did understand. Freezing pensioners will want his understanding.

But but but the idea that there will be millions of freezing pensioners is a myth. Moreover, if anybody (not just pensioners) can't afford to have heating £200 wouldn't have made a huge difference.

I agree, there won't be 10 million freezing pensioners, I don't know how many will suffer from cold this winter and neither do you. For some WFA would be £300.
if anybody (not just pensioners) can't afford to have heating £200 wouldn't have made a huge difference. If £200 wouldn't make a huge difference why are people on PC still getting it? Surely it's because the government think it will make a difference?