The former prime minister of New Zealand has been made a Dame by the Prince of Wales despite being a republican.

As King Charles has been advised not to visit NZ I wonder if this honour was given to keep those in NZ contented
My son’s father-in-law, who lives in NZ is against the Uk being their sovereign

grandtanteJE65

Rosie51

Isn't she another woman who doesn't know what a woman is? Backed the transgender Laurel Hubbard because it was easier than backing biological women. A surprising stance for someone who has been pregnant and gone through giving birth, but heyho if it makes you popular......

Why such contempt of transgender people? And of those who accept them?

Can we not just accept that people do not make the decision to change sex, either surgically or legally without serious heart-searchings?

I am not trying to be nasty, I would genuinely like to know why so many who contribute to this forum cannot just accept that we are not all alike, nor should be,

Bravo ! a I couldn’t agree more !

semperfidelis

I admired and Jacinda enormously. Why all the backbiting and misinformation?

Do you live in New Zealand semperfidelis?

I'm sure opinions were divided over there too.

As the musical points out, there is nothin' like a Dame.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

True ballie. I stand corrected. 😊
The King was approached to give this gong by NZ and he approved of it.

I'm sure people would criticise him if he ignored what NZ government asked for. He can't win can he.

I admired and Jacinda enormously. Why all the backbiting and misinformation?

You can’t compare the UK to NZ as the population is very small there compared to here and the living conditions are too, so saying how great things were around Covid doesn’t make a lot of sense.

maddyfour

Seems a bit hypocritical to accept if she’s a republican.

Doesn’t it just!
Why was she given this honour anyway?

True ballie. I stand corrected. 😊
The King was approached to give this gong by NZ and he approved of it.

The headline is slightly misleading because she was not made a Dame by the Prince of Wales. He only presented the award and it was in fact King Charles who decided to offer her a Damehood.

Baggs

I agree, galaxy, except that I never thought Ardern's or Sturgeon's "path" during the pandemic was acceptable. Both were over-authoritarian and ultimately damaging.

As were most responses globally, in my view. Just look at Sweden where such authoritarianism was not thought necessary and so it has proved.

Australian policy was over-authoritarian too.
Strangely enough, many of the mandates did not apply to political leaders.

julieray

I was on holiday in New Zealand this time last year and was shocked by how different our perception of her was to theirs. I didn’t meet one person who could say a good word about her - and we travelled right across both islands. A common theme was that her husband was allegedly involved with some shady people. Its a shame as she was someone I admired albeit from the other side of the world

We know quite a number of people who live in New Zealand and they were not at all keen on her.

New Zealand became widely regarded as the most pro-China of the Five Eyes partners, which led to tensions with Australia.

I think some in the UK held her in higher regard than those who lived under her governance.

I was on holiday in New Zealand this time last year and was shocked by how different our perception of her was to theirs. I didn’t meet one person who could say a good word about her - and we travelled right across both islands. A common theme was that her husband was allegedly involved with some shady people. Its a shame as she was someone I admired albeit from the other side of the world

I agree, galaxy, except that I never thought Ardern's or Sturgeon's "path" during the pandemic was acceptable. Both were over-authoritarian and ultimately damaging.

As were most responses globally, in my view. Just look at Sweden where such authoritarianism was not thought necessary and so it has proved.

Nicola Sturgeon was lauded for her conduct in the pandemic, her legacy is not what it once was, I think it's important to look beyond what people think was the acceptable path in the pandemic.

grandtanteJE65 Agreed, we’re not all alike. I think concern about transgender issues isn’t contempt of transgender people or of those who support them. It’s more about concerns for the safety of women, the vulnerable, & children. There’s as a small minority of people who use transgender as a cloak to commit criminal acts. Safety is important and is what everyone wants. Unfortunately transgender has become difficult to discuss as it’s such a sensitive issue. It’s a separate subject to Jacinda Ardern accepting a Damehood when she’s a republican. I’d see that as a compliment of the work she has done and she’s chosen to accept it which is up to her.

She deserves it, she was a really good PM and I wish we had someone like her here.

grandtanteJE65

Rosie51

Isn't she another woman who doesn't know what a woman is? Backed the transgender Laurel Hubbard because it was easier than backing biological women. A surprising stance for someone who has been pregnant and gone through giving birth, but heyho if it makes you popular......

Why such contempt of transgender people? And of those who accept them?

Can we not just accept that people do not make the decision to change sex, either surgically or legally without serious heart-searchings?

I am not trying to be nasty, I would genuinely like to know why so many who contribute to this forum cannot just accept that we are not all alike, nor should be,

Absolutely grandtanteJE65. Imo it's another fake media frenzy to sell their wares.
A Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC) is a document that allows some trans men and trans women to have the right gender on their birth certificate.
Currently, in order to get a GRC, trans people have to get a medical diagnosis of ‘gender dysphoria’, and waiting times are long (4+yrs). They also have to show they have lived in their ‘acquired gender’ for at least 2yrs, with evidence. A diagnosis will allow them access to hormone treatment and subsequent surgery

During her time as PM, she was constantly subject to threats of rape and death, and constant misogynistic comments as a women in power.

theconversation.com/jacinda-arderns-resignation-gender-and-the-toll-of-strong-compassionate-leadership-198152

grandtanteJE65
I don’t know if you’ve ever read any threads on here, but re: changing gender (you can’t truthfully change sex either on paper or by surgery) you will find many posters objections are based on the behaviour of an increasing number of TW, whose actions impact detrimentally on females.
If your choice of gender change causes no physical or mental hurt to others, especially TW on females, go ahead.
Once you plan to use your gender change to lie and cheat - accessing places you should not, claiming awards designated for the sex you are pretending to be, then IMO that’s a different matter.
A comparable example would be if I (primary teacher) were to give I simply give myself the title Doctor. I’m not harming anybody, but how would you feel if I worked my way into a hospital and I’m about to operate on you?

Rosie51

Isn't she another woman who doesn't know what a woman is? Backed the transgender Laurel Hubbard because it was easier than backing biological women. A surprising stance for someone who has been pregnant and gone through giving birth, but heyho if it makes you popular......

Why such contempt of transgender people? And of those who accept them?

Can we not just accept that people do not make the decision to change sex, either surgically or legally without serious heart-searchings?

I am not trying to be nasty, I would genuinely like to know why so many who contribute to this forum cannot just accept that we are not all alike, nor should be,

I admired her for the way she acted during Covid but don't know much else about the way she governed other than she is a republican. Difficult to believe she accepted the dame honour.

JA was an intelligent and graceful leader. She led NZ through significant difficulties, including a massacre, huge wild fires and a volcanic eruption. She was unpopular amongst conspiracy theorists and racists. She made good decisions for NZ around COVID - she was very clear and consistent. It’s entirely wrong that she “tanked the economy”. The current lot of clowns are doing that. I’m very glad that her significance has been recognised.

I think Adern's term of office is subject to re-evaluation but her acceptance of the honour does not imply acceptance of monarchy. The Damehood is after all a NZ honour and not a British one.