I do wish Keir Starmer would stop talking about ‘working people’!

eazybee

I disagree.
People who save money that has been earned, and taxed,should be allowed to invest it if they wish, and not be taxed again.

Unless you know how to work the system, or can pay someone to do that for you, you are taxed as you earn, taxed again on the money you save, and the money is taxed again when you die.
It isn’t the less well off who can afford to pay someone to sort it out for them, but it’s one reason why millionaires stay rich.

Ah, but at least you don't have calloused hands

MissAdventure

Ah, but at least you don't have calloused hands

No, but broken fingernails from all the cleaning 😕

If only people like Beth Rigby et al had been so interrogational and forensic about every word Conservative MP’s have uttered over the past 14 years . Especially regarding Brexit…

MayBee70

If only people like Beth Rigby et al had been so interrogational and forensic about every word Conservative MP’s have uttered over the past 14 years . Especially regarding Brexit…

And if Only all those people had got off their rear end and bothered to vote, we might not have had Brexit.
Over a million people who didn’t bother, contributed to Brexit.

eazybee

I disagree.
People who save money that has been earned, and taxed,should be allowed to invest it if they wish, and not be taxed again.

By that token, should people who have earned their own money not be charged VAT when those spending someone else's be charged an extra 20%?

Mollygo

MayBee70

If only people like Beth Rigby et al had been so interrogational and forensic about every word Conservative MP’s have uttered over the past 14 years . Especially regarding Brexit…

And if Only all those people had got off their rear end and bothered to vote, we might not have had Brexit.
Over a million people who didn’t bother, contributed to Brexit.

If ifs and ands were pots and pans there'd be no need for tinkers' hands.

Yes I know, but we only have Brexit because not enough people voted against it.

I'm not disagreeing with that. Obviously we can't prove it, but it seems to me to be likely to be true. It's Brexit and 14 years of mismanagement that have got us to this pass, and we are all going to have to pay.

If we are looking at who is responsible (eg those who didn't vote) statistically it is older people who voted in favour. Should they/we carry the can? It's the same logic.

Nothing to do with Starmer's definition of working people though.

Statistics, statistics and damned lies.

I have a very good customer who insists upon writing cheques. First time it happened I had to ring my bank and ask where to send it. The young woman who answered said she had never seen a cheque! Its a bit of a faff but she spends quite a few hundred pounds at a time so Im not going to turn her away.

biglouis

I have a very good customer who insists upon writing cheques. First time it happened I had to ring my bank and ask where to send it. The young woman who answered said she had never seen a cheque! Its a bit of a faff but she spends quite a few hundred pounds at a time so Im not going to turn her away.

I was sent a cheque for money I was owed by a financial company; it was for less than £10 yet I had originally paid them via direct debit.
Thank goodness our bank is the one remaining open here.

Statistics can be used to prove whatever point you like to make
e.g. statistics show that fewer younger people voted.

Statistics can also be made to show that younger people were more pro remain.

So statistics show that if more people who were pro-remain had got off their rear ends and voted, we wouldn’t have Brexit.

What statistics don’t show is how many older people voted remain, and are still taking the rap for all those of any age who voted leave.
But if that statistic was required, I’m sure it could be produced.

What statistics don’t show is how many older people voted remain, and are still taking the rap for all those of any age who voted leave.
But if that statistic was required, I’m sure it could be produced.

I'm not sure why these statistics are produced as fact as they rely on exit polls.

I thought he was referring to anybody who wasn't contributing to the economy. e.g most pensioners, children, criminals, the unemployed and the like.

Sorry, I was referring to Keir Starmer and what he meant by "working people".

AN41

I thought he was referring to anybody who wasn't contributing to the economy. e.g most pensioners, children, criminals, the unemployed and the like.

Most people contribute to the economy in some way whether they are working or not.

We may invest and most people spend on goods and services.

If he meant people who pay PAYE are working people, did he mean people who are self employed are not working people?

Allira

AN41

I thought he was referring to anybody who wasn't contributing to the economy. e.g most pensioners, children, criminals, the unemployed and the like.

Most people contribute to the economy in some way whether they are working or not.

We may invest and most people spend on goods and services.

My NDN volunteers with the local tourist board - then goes into town and buys a coffee in one of the local cafes / eateries, later, shopping locally.

She's retired, not on PAYE - not one of Starmer's "working people", but I'd suggest she's contributing to the economy and society, even if only locally. And I bet there are thousands like her in small towns and villages all over the country.

I understand Starmer wants to reassure workers that they are not going to see tax rises, but unfortunately, his emphasis is divisive.

... what will happen of course is what always happens. Money cannot be extracted from the very poor, obviously, and the very rich are gong to do what they always do - or shout blue-murder and threaten to up sticks and leave. So, once again, it will be those in the middle, neither poor nor rich, who have been prudent with what money they do have, who will bear the brunt of the economic burden.

biglouis and Allira, Dad was recently sent a cheque as a lottery win.
I was able to pay it into his current account by using the camera on my phone.
Worth a try next time?

They don’t have cheques anymore here. All online or phone these days.

nanna8

They don’t have cheques anymore here. All online or phone these days.

I still use cheques.

madalene

If he meant people who pay PAYE are working people, did he mean people who are self employed are not working people?

I was self employed, but never received any payments through the PAYE system.
I went out to work 60 hours a week.

So he can't mean that.

Boz

He told Beth Rigby it was someone who, when confronted by a big and unexpected bill, couldn't write a cheque to cover it.
Some impoverished middle-classes couldn't do that, so this argument is a bit unconvincing.
I was struck by his use of the word cheque. I haven't written a cheque in years - it's cards or money transfers. A dated expression. Starmer isn't a money-man I feel.

Frankly, there are very few people suddenly faced with a big bill who could find the money - just like that - , anyway he did not define the value of a 'big unexpected bill' £100? £1,000?, £10,000?

Yet, at the same time as Stramer is making silly statements like this, people are under constant pressure, and being given incentives to save - for their pension, for a deposit on a house, for resilience when 'sudden big bills' come in etc etc.

He is the classsic example of someone trying to have his cake and eat it.

My definition of a working person is someone who has to work to obtain the money they live on, which includes, people on high salaries.

It does not, of course, include many pensioners. We are living on incomes based on the savings and contributions we made in the past.

Just a comment about people on high salaries.
A friend was boasting about a forthcoming long weekend abroad for all the partners (solicitors) and their wives 'to use up excess profits, otherwise it will go in tax,'
Another wife has spent the past two months on weekends away, parties when whole houses or hotels have been hired for clients, and a trip abroad as her accountant husband is retiring, all paid for by his firm, again to use up profits rather than pay tax on it. Apparently necessary to retain clients.