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Governments First Budget

(565 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Wed 30-Oct-24 07:55:04

We won’t know too much until we can read tomorrows analysis , but we do know of this government’s intended direction of travel, and whether it meets with our expectations as voters and what we all voted for, which of course changes with each individual.

My vote and expectation was for

First and foremost to save our NHS and crumbling public services.

Second was to address the state of our environment, the polluted seas and rivers, and the lack of diversity.

Next -to address the fact that economic growth has been more or less stagnant since 2010. We need a Keynesian type budget for growth, that is imaginative and forward thinking to produce the revenue to invest in out country.

Personally I have never thought it possible to have this type of successful economy where citizens can be confident of a cradle to grave welfare state, where education is first class, health is free at the point of use and available within a very reasonable time limit, where public services are well run and invested in and care for all in need comes as a right, can be obtained by the tax payer on the cheap. This type of economy must be paid for and we will need to see tax at Scandinavian levels in order to achieve this.

Looking at the state the country is in, we knew in July that this would be a mighty task. Mighty tasks need research/planning and massive effort. They always start painfully slowly but momentum will gather as each year passes and we will gradually see the result of the effort put in to save our country from the ravages of 14 long years of economic blows our public services received.

Of course the right wing media - childlike - is insisting on jam today without spending any of their pocket money, but as wise parents we know that all jam does is rot your teeth. Instant gratification is only for the hard of thinking, the more intelligent know that time is the master.

So now looking back at the few short months Labour has been in government, i am pretty supportive of the direction of travel, and the achievements to date - which probably need listing to remind everyone - but not for this thread.

Some stuff has been announced but I think it best until we begin to see how it fits into the overall picture before we begin to comment.

It looks as if this is going to be a massive budget though - so hold onto your hats!

LizzieDrip Sat 02-Nov-24 09:10:40

From AGE CONCERN UK regarding Pension Credit:

“We're here to help!

We offer support through our free advice line on 0800 678 1602. Lines are open 8am-7pm, 365 days a year. We also have specialist advisers at over 120 local Age UKs”

growstuff Sat 02-Nov-24 09:09:50

Mollygo

Ask the Labour Party. They’re the ones who will know whether it does or not. If they thought it would do that much damage in opposition back then under Corbyn and again under Starmer . . .
And of course it may well include all those who need, but don’t apply for pension credit so don’t get the WFA and those on the cusp who don’t get it anyway.
Not a problem for KS etc. as it won’t affect them.

I would have thought it did, which is why they stated that those in receipt of Pension Credit would still receive WFP.

PS. As I've written in the past, I'm "on the cusp" and I'm not going to die from the cold this winter.

PPS. I'm not happy about it, but I do wish there were less hyperbole.

LizzieDrip Sat 02-Nov-24 09:02:34

I just cannot understand why people don’t apply for pension credit, if they may be able eligible. Age Concern will help people with the application process if necessary - it’s actually not as difficult as people think.

Also, for those struggling ‘on the cusp’ councils and many energy providers have ‘warm home discounts’ that they may be eligible for.

Mollygo Sat 02-Nov-24 03:01:50

Ask the Labour Party. They’re the ones who will know whether it does or not. If they thought it would do that much damage in opposition back then under Corbyn and again under Starmer . . .
And of course it may well include all those who need, but don’t apply for pension credit so don’t get the WFA and those on the cusp who don’t get it anyway.
Not a problem for KS etc. as it won’t affect them.

growstuff Sat 02-Nov-24 02:48:55

1.4 million pensioners receive Pension Credit and will continue to receive the WFP. Does the 1.4 million include the 300,000 whom the Labour Party forecast would die?

Mollygo Sat 02-Nov-24 02:41:53

Presumably the sudden realisation of just how much 300,000 pensions actually cost per annum

Yes but how could it be criticised by the LP in opposition, yet carried out once they are in power?

GrannyGravy13 Fri 01-Nov-24 22:20:31

👍🏻

Allira Fri 01-Nov-24 17:59:29

Mollygo

Listening to info about the proposed withdrawal of WFA I discovered that Labour, when in opposition, had estimated that over 300K deaths would result from that withdrawal. What has suddenly changed now they are in power?

I’m sure if I look at the ONS site I’ll discover that a new way of making the calculation has been brought out.

Presumably the sudden realisation of just how much 300,000 pensions actually cost per annum.

Allira Fri 01-Nov-24 17:57:55

fancythat

^Of course I am interested in hearing from farmers about how this matters to them, but as with moans about means-testing the WFP from people who can still buy clothes from Joules or holiday in second homes abroad it is just white noise.

^

But how do you know who is who?
But I take your point.

Without knowing if those complaining about losing the WFA are the same people who buy from Joules or have second homes abroad that statement is just white noise.

Mollygo Fri 01-Nov-24 17:54:24

Listening to info about the proposed withdrawal of WFA I discovered that Labour, when in opposition, had estimated that over 300K deaths would result from that withdrawal. What has suddenly changed now they are in power?

I’m sure if I look at the ONS site I’ll discover that a new way of making the calculation has been brought out.

eddiecat78 Fri 01-Nov-24 17:46:26

Casdon

Unfortunately the nature of farming is that there’s always one plight or another - taxes, IHT, weather, livestock and crop disease, land prices, food prices, competition from abroad etc. etc. I’m not being critical when I say this, but I’ve never heard a farmer say there’s been a year without major challenges.

That is true - and considering they are doing something as vital as producing food it would be nice if the government acknowledged the difficulties and supported them rather than adding to their worries. There is already a distressing rise in the numbers of farmers taking their own lives.

fancythat Fri 01-Nov-24 17:41:11

^Of course I am interested in hearing from farmers about how this matters to them, but as with moans about means-testing the WFP from people who can still buy clothes from Joules or holiday in second homes abroad it is just white noise.

^

But how do you know who is who?
But I take your point.

fancythat Fri 01-Nov-24 17:38:55

I was told by someone today[can you guess that I speak to all and sundry when I am out], that her grandson, age 15, nearly 16, has a two year wait for mental health services.
Which will ironically and sadly mean, that by the time he gets to the top of the NHS waiting list, he will no longer be under child services, and will be under adult mental health services. sad

fancythat Fri 01-Nov-24 17:36:42

The waiting list for dermatology here is horrendous

Here too.
I have been told 1 year wait.

fancythat Fri 01-Nov-24 17:35:06

GP surgeries, care homes and hospices are among those demanding an exemption from the hike in National Insurance, saying the extra tax on employers may force some to close.

I could see some of that coming, once figures start to sink in.
I think I read charities are trying to get exemptions, with no joy so far.

I think I am right in saying, if you employ 3 employees or less, you are exempt.
Was in a small cafe this morning.
He seemed to think he was exempt. I think he was employing some family members.

fancythat Fri 01-Nov-24 17:32:28

Casdon

Unfortunately the nature of farming is that there’s always one plight or another - taxes, IHT, weather, livestock and crop disease, land prices, food prices, competition from abroad etc. etc. I’m not being critical when I say this, but I’ve never heard a farmer say there’s been a year without major challenges.

You are correct there.
Famaily farming has always been precarious.
Good years mixed in with bad ones.
And different sectors can work at different levels.

I think I am right in saying, the poulty sector has had some good years[not counting bird flu].
Sheep have been doing relatively better for a little while. At least where I am.

Other sectors, dodgier.

Fruit and veg - have trouble with recruiting staff last few years. At least around here. Crops left in ground in some cases.

FriedGreenTomatoes2 Fri 01-Nov-24 17:31:02

Mind you Himself just read the same article in the Telegraph and commented “I wouldn't trust this doctor with an abacus let alone a prescription pad. Try retirement.” 🤣

Allira Fri 01-Nov-24 17:30:17

The very wealthy will continue to find ways of evading paying tax and, as usual, ordinary people will be the ones bearing the brunt.

Ordinary People are, of course, not the same as Working People because Ordinary People include small business owners, farmers, GPs, those running hospitality businesses, etc.

Mamie Fri 01-Nov-24 17:29:44

growstuff

I hope there's more positivity in the NHS than there is on this thread. Of course staffing is going to be a problem, so the solution won't be in the short term, but they've got to start somewhere. The alternative is to say they won't bother and leave the situation as it is now.

My GD has just started as a medical student and it is clear already that there is a drive to promote wellbeing and a focus on retention in the longer term.

FriedGreenTomatoes2 Fri 01-Nov-24 17:23:01

Oh heck2 …

The Chancellor’s budget raid could cost a GP practice the equivalent of five nurses’ salaries, estimates suggest.

GP surgeries, care homes and hospices are among those demanding an exemption from the hike in National Insurance, saying the extra tax on employers may force some to close.

The Government had said that the public sector would be exempted from the rise.

However on Thursday night, Darren Jones, the Treasury minister, said GP practices were “not part of the public sector” and would face extra costs.

Dr Richard West, chairman of the Dispensing Doctors Association, has written to the Health Secretary, warning that such a hike, combined with the increase in the National Living Wage, could force surgeries to shut up shop.

Dr West, whose practice serves 16,000 patients in rural Suffolk, said: “Our accountants have calculated that the practice will incur additional costs of £140,000 from next April. This includes the costs associated with the rise in employers’ NICs and the Living Wage. This is equivalent to several senior clinical staff.”

The figure is almost as much as the combined starting salary of five nurses, who earn £29,969.

FriedGreenTomatoes2 Fri 01-Nov-24 17:21:39

Oh heck …

Michael O’Leary, the Ryanair chief executive, accused the Chancellor of a short-sighted tax grab he said demonstrated that she “has no clue how to deliver growth in the UK economy”.

He added: “Reeves has damaged the UK’s growth prospects and made air travel much more expensive for UK families travelling abroad on holidays or to visit friends and family.

“At a time when Ireland, Hungary, Sweden and many regions in Italy have abolished air travel taxes, Chancellor Rachel Reeves’s idiotic decision to further raise the UK’s already-high air travel taxes will deliver cuts, not growth.”

MayBee70 Fri 01-Nov-24 16:50:08

Mollygo

MayBee70
I guess we’ll need people from the EU. Oh, hang on a minute…confused…

Why are you confused? Don’t tell me you’re worried that all the spaces are being taken up by the continuing boatloads. It’s not so. That continuation is a totally different issue.

I was just pointing out that I would assume the NHS is missing the EU staff that were made to feel so unwelcome after Brexit, including someone I knew who had a breakdown. But Brexit continues to be the elephant in the room.

growstuff Fri 01-Nov-24 16:13:19

OldFrill

For those that aren't familiar with Community Diagnostic Centres the attached may be useful. It also discusses staffing.
www.england.nhs.uk/long-read/community-diagnostic-centres/

I had my suspected melanoma diagnosed in a community setting by tele-dermatology. Originally, I had an appointment with a consultant, but this was brought forward. I went to a local hub and had the "mole" photographed with a special camera. The image was then sent to a consultant, who responded within 24 hours.

The waiting list for dermatology here is horrendous. My GP put me on the two week cancer pathway, which is more like six weeks. Apparently, everybody used to be sent for a face-to-face consultation with a consultant. Most suspect lesions turned out to be negative, so a lot of time was "wasted". This way, patients can go to a local hub and be seen by a relatively junior member of staff who just has to point and click a camera. The consultant sees all the images, but can concentrate on the ones which raise suspicions.

Mollygo Fri 01-Nov-24 16:11:06

MayBee70
I guess we’ll need people from the EU. Oh, hang on a minute…confused…

Why are you confused? Don’t tell me you’re worried that all the spaces are being taken up by the continuing boatloads. It’s not so. That continuation is a totally different issue.

Casdon Fri 01-Nov-24 15:55:11

There is more positivity, but also some trepidation that the expectation in the short term is too high growstuff. Staff are beaten down, but they aren’t out yet. Everybody I know still working in the NHS wants it to get better for patients, and to have the resources and staff to make that happen.