Trevor Phillips - Tory mouthpiece or just thick?

Bats are another ball game

Mollygo

PN
^ Mollygo I'm not sure behaving in that way to everyone makes it any better.^
Of course it doesn’t, any more than evading giving straight answers is better.
But calling out one group for doing either of those things whilst excusing the other group for doing it ?
Does that make things better?

You seem convinced that this is what is happening - ie that people excuse KS for doing things that BJ or RS did, but that's not remotely the case, as far as I can see.

Yes, people complained about things like lying to the Queen, or to the HoC, about all sorts of things too numerous to mention, but nobody is saying that what was wrong then is ok now. People just say it as we see it. If KS does something people don't agree with they say so.

In any case, it's the motive and context that matter. Saying there were no parties during Covid is lying. Being unable to afford to do some of the things you'd said you'd do is very different. Understanding that is not excusing lying, it's recognising nuance.

petal53

I think neither bats nor newts should take precedence over humans.
That’s probably an unpopular view with some people, but that’s my opinion anyway.

I shall whisper very quietly.
I disagree. I think we need to preserve these habitats.
By destroying the environment we will eventually destroy the Earth and that includes all living things, humans included.

Doodledog
You can, along with others, put your own interpretation on anything I post. It won’t make what you or they say any truer than what I say.

No problem Allira, disagreement is absolutely acceptable, so long as it is polite, and you were polite.
We all have different opinions, otherwise we’d be clones.

Mollygo

Doodledog
You can, along with others, put your own interpretation on anything I post. It won’t make what you or they say any truer than what I say.

I'm not interpreting anything. I am saying that people are not excusing the same behaviour in one party that they accept from another. If there have been examples of the same behaviour from this government and the last, I can't think of any.

What I say is my opinion, just as yours is your own. I am not arrogant enough to tell you why you post what you post, though. Only you know that.

Allira

petal53

I think neither bats nor newts should take precedence over humans.
That’s probably an unpopular view with some people, but that’s my opinion anyway.

I shall whisper very quietly.
I disagree. I think we need to preserve these habitats.
By destroying the environment we will eventually destroy the Earth and that includes all living things, humans included.

I think we need to find a balance. If wildlife live in an area needed for housing, and can be relocated (or even bred in captivity until they can be found a suitable habitat) then I think that's the way forward.

We shouldn't wilfully destroy habitats, and if there is a choice between building on newtlands and not, we should let them be; but if the only suitable land for people to live on has newts on it, the people should be prioritised.

What is happening about the way that polluted rivers and streams are destroying wild life?

Doodledog

Allira

petal53

I think neither bats nor newts should take precedence over humans.
That’s probably an unpopular view with some people, but that’s my opinion anyway.

I shall whisper very quietly.
I disagree. I think we need to preserve these habitats.
By destroying the environment we will eventually destroy the Earth and that includes all living things, humans included.

I think we need to find a balance. If wildlife live in an area needed for housing, and can be relocated (or even bred in captivity until they can be found a suitable habitat) then I think that's the way forward.

We shouldn't wilfully destroy habitats, and if there is a choice between building on newtlands and not, we should let them be; but if the only suitable land for people to live on has newts on it, the people should be prioritised.

I totally agree.
We don’t have an abundance of views here in Southend but this was one of them. Unfortunately this photo doesn’t show it in full.
When this estate started to go up I could have cried.
Then, to add insult to injury *they pulled the bloody lot down*😡

www.echo-news.co.uk/news/24618411.southend-fossetts-way-demolition-half-built-homes/

petal53

I think neither bats nor newts should take precedence over humans.
That’s probably an unpopular view with some people, but that’s my opinion anyway.

I agree, not because I hate them or want them hurt or damaged or wiped out!!

But I do think people in need of a home should come first.

Petra

That whole Fossets Farm fiasco was appalling! Know whom I blame for that! Absolutely disgraceful!

MayBee70

What is happening about the way that polluted rivers and streams are destroying wild life?

It seems to all be left to volunteers, it’s tragic and awful! Ditto those who live near a beach.

This is how politically unbiased Trevor Phillips is; from todays Times
“Do Baron Keir's plans add up? Oh no they don't
Hardup Hall is plunged into chaos, with the Chief Minister's daughters at odds over how to make the people happy
It's panto time. Oh no it isn't. Oh yes it is. Over at Hardup Hall, the Baron (friends call him Keir) is wrestling with a thoroughly modern dilemma. It was so easy in the old days when you could set the court howling with laughter and outrage at your rivals' aesthetically challenged offspring, Borisella and Lizteria, and promise that your own progeny would be a picture of undiluted virtue, integrity and industry. When the King got round to choosing a Chief Minister this year, you walked it by popular acclamation.
But since then the revelations that you decked out your family with magic ballgowns and fancy eyewear left the kingdom feeling a bit sour. So this year, you've asked the Fairy Godmother to keep her wand to herself; there will be no pumpkin coach and the mice are going to stay murine. And you're somehow going to have to keep finding new ways to explain that the fact there won't be a ball really isn't your fault.
Talking to your right-hand man, McButtons, you've decided the answer is to show people you can deliver better standards of living. But you need a plan. No one seems convinced by your foundations, missions or milestones.
Fortunately, you've got two ambitious daughters, Rachel and Angela, both of them clever in their own ways, both persuasive, both with a following in the Hardup clan. Each has a credible scheme. The problem is that while they both think they are in sync right now, it won't last. If either succeeds, it will probably scupper the other. It's a headache.
Start with Rachel, who runs the Treasury. Since she told you the magic money tree had uprooted itself and gone to some place called The Gulf, things have been pretty dismal. The few quid left in the kingdom's coffers are being sucked into a mysterious black hole apparently created by Borisella and Lizteria. Her first step was to plug that gap by taxing the legs off the merchants, and stopping the firewood allowance for old people. They're not happy.
All the same, she says she's got a plan to grow the economy. Unfortunately, it depends on building things like roads, railways and reservoirs. But to do that you need actual workers; AI can do a lot of stuff, but it won't dig a hole for you. The kingdom's already short of a quarter of a million builders before anybody's agreed to any new projects. You've also got a skills mismatch; apparently 41 per cent of the kingdom's people work in sectors for which their education doesn't qualify them.
It will be years before the kingdom can rely on its own people to deliver Rachel's plan, so they're going to have to come from foreign lands, just as they did after the world war that reduced us to rubble 80 years ago. The only difference now is that the incomers aren't pushing brooms and laying pipes; more than four out ten are graduates, compared with the 31.4 per cent of the kingdom's natives. The burdens on the welfare state were mostly born and brought up here. Rachel's not bothered by this. In her mind, growth is all that matters and how it is delivered and by whom is secondary.
The Baron sighs. He can already see trouble ahead. Having studied Rachel's PowerPoint slides carefully, he turns to Angela's social media feed, which is how she prefers to make her case. Angela's job is to decide who gets to build houses and roads and railways, and where they put them. She certainly likes a party, so you've got to get through the indie band intro before she launches into her actual plan.
Angela's set herself a target of producing a million and a half new homes. In the past, the kingdom has been a bit laissez-faire about it, and that meant many plans being put on ice by local people who didn't fancy their view of the valley being obscured, or wildlife enthusiasts brandishing placards of the black-legged kittiwake. She's put everyone on notice that she won't tolerate any backsliding on building; and as for the newts, bats and birds, they may as well start packing their bags right now.
The problem is that at current housing densities, Angela's 1.5 million homes might accommodate 3.5 million souls. But somebody's got to build them. And as a Swiss writer once said, if you ask for workers, you get people instead. And what do the people who will make Rachel's plans work need? More homes, more hospitals with more doctors and nurses in them, more schools with more teachers for their children, more roads and trains to get to their jobs and, eventually more pensions. And who's going to get the blame if they don't appear? Angela.
The truth is that if Rachel gets her way the kingdom will need to find homes for at least an extra two million legal migrants in the next five years. Even the other million or so migrants who remain uncounted because they snuck in without telling anyone or simply overstayed their welcome need a roof over their heads.
Their cloak of invisibility may fool the border police but it won't keep the rain off. The majority of Angela's extra dwellings will have to be handed to the people who came from abroad to work in hospitals, care homes and hotels; and, of course to the brickies, painters, engineers, electricians and plumbers who come to build tunnels, railways, power stations — and Angela's new homes.
Yes, they'll pay taxes; but according to the UN 15 per cent of their earnings won't be spent to boost the kingdom's economy — that money will be sent back to relatives where they came from. In the end, what with the great big black fiscal hole, there just won't be enough to pay the extra doctors and the teachers; and that means longer waiting lists and bigger classes for everyone. Which is the Baron's nightmare: he might get more growth and more homes overall but nobody's going to be saying thanks, because, individually, they won't feel any better.
And then there's the rest of Angela's job, which is to make everybody like everybody else in the kingdom, especially the foreigners. They call it community cohesion in some places. It was tough enough when the average annual net migration figure was a quarter of million. It's going to be a lot harder when you're adding over half a million to the population every year.
Just after he became Chief Minister, the Baron had to confront some ugly scenes in the north of the country from people who think that there must be a magic way to deliver growth without skills or people. The trouble died down almost as quickly as it flared up.
At least, he thinks to himself, their cheerleader Dame Nigella's off my back for a while, off doing warm-ups for that orange-faced Oompa Loompa on the other side of the Big Blue Ocean. Some of my advisers keep worrying that the people might start liking him more than me.
He breaks off his musing to look out at a crowd of people gathering outside the windows at Hardup Hall, pointing up and chanting at him. He thinks he can hear the name “Nigel' but can't quite make out what they're saying, so he turns to McButtons to see if he has caught it. He has. “Sir, they're shouting, 'He's behind you!'”

I think we can safely answer, "Tory Mouthpiece" MayBee.
Looks likes he gets paid per inch of rubbish.

MayBee70

This is how politically unbiased Trevor Phillips is; from todays Times
“Do Baron Keir's plans add up? Oh no they don't
Hardup Hall is plunged into chaos, with the Chief Minister's daughters at odds over how to make the people happy
It's panto time. Oh no it isn't. Oh yes it is. Over at Hardup Hall, the Baron (friends call him Keir) is wrestling with a thoroughly modern dilemma. It was so easy in the old days when you could set the court howling with laughter and outrage at your rivals' aesthetically challenged offspring, Borisella and Lizteria, and promise that your own progeny would be a picture of undiluted virtue, integrity and industry. When the King got round to choosing a Chief Minister this year, you walked it by popular acclamation.
But since then the revelations that you decked out your family with magic ballgowns and fancy eyewear left the kingdom feeling a bit sour. So this year, you've asked the Fairy Godmother to keep her wand to herself; there will be no pumpkin coach and the mice are going to stay murine. And you're somehow going to have to keep finding new ways to explain that the fact there won't be a ball really isn't your fault.
Talking to your right-hand man, McButtons, you've decided the answer is to show people you can deliver better standards of living. But you need a plan. No one seems convinced by your foundations, missions or milestones.
Fortunately, you've got two ambitious daughters, Rachel and Angela, both of them clever in their own ways, both persuasive, both with a following in the Hardup clan. Each has a credible scheme. The problem is that while they both think they are in sync right now, it won't last. If either succeeds, it will probably scupper the other. It's a headache.
Start with Rachel, who runs the Treasury. Since she told you the magic money tree had uprooted itself and gone to some place called The Gulf, things have been pretty dismal. The few quid left in the kingdom's coffers are being sucked into a mysterious black hole apparently created by Borisella and Lizteria. Her first step was to plug that gap by taxing the legs off the merchants, and stopping the firewood allowance for old people. They're not happy.
All the same, she says she's got a plan to grow the economy. Unfortunately, it depends on building things like roads, railways and reservoirs. But to do that you need actual workers; AI can do a lot of stuff, but it won't dig a hole for you. The kingdom's already short of a quarter of a million builders before anybody's agreed to any new projects. You've also got a skills mismatch; apparently 41 per cent of the kingdom's people work in sectors for which their education doesn't qualify them.
It will be years before the kingdom can rely on its own people to deliver Rachel's plan, so they're going to have to come from foreign lands, just as they did after the world war that reduced us to rubble 80 years ago. The only difference now is that the incomers aren't pushing brooms and laying pipes; more than four out ten are graduates, compared with the 31.4 per cent of the kingdom's natives. The burdens on the welfare state were mostly born and brought up here. Rachel's not bothered by this. In her mind, growth is all that matters and how it is delivered and by whom is secondary.
The Baron sighs. He can already see trouble ahead. Having studied Rachel's PowerPoint slides carefully, he turns to Angela's social media feed, which is how she prefers to make her case. Angela's job is to decide who gets to build houses and roads and railways, and where they put them. She certainly likes a party, so you've got to get through the indie band intro before she launches into her actual plan.
Angela's set herself a target of producing a million and a half new homes. In the past, the kingdom has been a bit laissez-faire about it, and that meant many plans being put on ice by local people who didn't fancy their view of the valley being obscured, or wildlife enthusiasts brandishing placards of the black-legged kittiwake. She's put everyone on notice that she won't tolerate any backsliding on building; and as for the newts, bats and birds, they may as well start packing their bags right now.
The problem is that at current housing densities, Angela's 1.5 million homes might accommodate 3.5 million souls. But somebody's got to build them. And as a Swiss writer once said, if you ask for workers, you get people instead. And what do the people who will make Rachel's plans work need? More homes, more hospitals with more doctors and nurses in them, more schools with more teachers for their children, more roads and trains to get to their jobs and, eventually more pensions. And who's going to get the blame if they don't appear? Angela.
The truth is that if Rachel gets her way the kingdom will need to find homes for at least an extra two million legal migrants in the next five years. Even the other million or so migrants who remain uncounted because they snuck in without telling anyone or simply overstayed their welcome need a roof over their heads.
Their cloak of invisibility may fool the border police but it won't keep the rain off. The majority of Angela's extra dwellings will have to be handed to the people who came from abroad to work in hospitals, care homes and hotels; and, of course to the brickies, painters, engineers, electricians and plumbers who come to build tunnels, railways, power stations — and Angela's new homes.
Yes, they'll pay taxes; but according to the UN 15 per cent of their earnings won't be spent to boost the kingdom's economy — that money will be sent back to relatives where they came from. In the end, what with the great big black fiscal hole, there just won't be enough to pay the extra doctors and the teachers; and that means longer waiting lists and bigger classes for everyone. Which is the Baron's nightmare: he might get more growth and more homes overall but nobody's going to be saying thanks, because, individually, they won't feel any better.
And then there's the rest of Angela's job, which is to make everybody like everybody else in the kingdom, especially the foreigners. They call it community cohesion in some places. It was tough enough when the average annual net migration figure was a quarter of million. It's going to be a lot harder when you're adding over half a million to the population every year.
Just after he became Chief Minister, the Baron had to confront some ugly scenes in the north of the country from people who think that there must be a magic way to deliver growth without skills or people. The trouble died down almost as quickly as it flared up.
At least, he thinks to himself, their cheerleader Dame Nigella's off my back for a while, off doing warm-ups for that orange-faced Oompa Loompa on the other side of the Big Blue Ocean. Some of my advisers keep worrying that the people might start liking him more than me.
He breaks off his musing to look out at a crowd of people gathering outside the windows at Hardup Hall, pointing up and chanting at him. He thinks he can hear the name “Nigel' but can't quite make out what they're saying, so he turns to McButtons to see if he has caught it. He has. “Sir, they're shouting, 'He's behind you!'”

Absolutely hilarious, from where I'm sitting it's spot on.
"We have enough houses, we dont have enough houses,". From Rayner. According to Zoopla 1.1 million homes were sold last year, so the housing stock is there, so many being built in this area, usually occupied from people who want to escape from the southern area, you can see that from the increase in Chelsea tractors on the roads. So where do local people fit in? People actually born in the area, the biggest problem, they won't be building social housing. for local people, and the prices are too high for them to buy . We've had an influx of Africans, all needing homes in an area that is one of the poorest. This Government will gleefully build over local green places leaving nowhere for local people to relax, they'll destroy wildlife habitats in the rush to provide homes for migrants. Government seem like headless chickens , Rayner contradicts herself at every question asked. Still 10 year plan will be out of the window certainly in 5 years, but the damage they inflict will be done.

Well well, UK placed on recession watch, no surprise after that dreadful budget.
Thanks Reeves.

If you do a little searching you will easily find Phillips being scathing to the Tories ( particularly around Johnsons behaviour during lockdown) - he expressed the publics anger quite effectively due to his own tragic circumstances in lockdown.
I find him interesting - he tends to think for himself and challenged a lot of the identity politics mantras.
I can also cope with people challenging labour - they are in government - they like any party needs to be challenged.

Wyllow3

I think we can safely answer, "Tory Mouthpiece" MayBee.
Looks likes he gets paid per inch of rubbish.

It’s called political satire, and it’s actually very funny😂

Galaxy

If you do a little searching you will easily find Phillips being scathing to the Tories ( particularly around Johnsons behaviour during lockdown) - he expressed the publics anger quite effectively due to his own tragic circumstances in lockdown.
I find him interesting - he tends to think for himself and challenged a lot of the identity politics mantras.
I can also cope with people challenging labour - they are in government - they like any party needs to be challenged.

I agree, unfortunately there are a lot of people who can’t see past their own political blinkers.

Oreo

Galaxy

If you do a little searching you will easily find Phillips being scathing to the Tories ( particularly around Johnsons behaviour during lockdown) - he expressed the publics anger quite effectively due to his own tragic circumstances in lockdown.
I find him interesting - he tends to think for himself and challenged a lot of the identity politics mantras.
I can also cope with people challenging labour - they are in government - they like any party needs to be challenged.

I agree, unfortunately there are a lot of people who can’t see past their own political blinkers.

Are you referring to me Oreo?

Why did Angela Eagle continually use the word illegal when referring to asylum seekers?
We are often told on GN that they aren’t illegal.
As Angela Eagle is the minister for border security I assume she is using the correct terminology.

Why would you think so?

That was to Maybee70 not you petra

I started to watch a bit of Trevor Phillips this morning, but then I fell asleep again. Ooops!

Having said that, I have respect for him. I believe him to be unbiased and to the point. I liked him way back when he was head of the Commission for Racial Equality and then later on chairman of the EHRC.