Another bishop looking the wrong way

Unfortunately there are many church misogynists people who interpret their bible to suit themselves, who do not believe women should hold any positions in the CofE let alone Archbishop so the likelihood of a female Archbishop is extremely remote, although we can hope.

I agree with HettyBetty - in fact, I think everyone, the world over, should ask themselves if religion of any sort, has actually ever been beneficial.
It is used by those who only want to control others.
Centuries ago, the masses were uneducated and easily frightened by stories of hell and damnation and religous leaders went unquestioned.
Hopefully times and ideas are finally changing and maybe these superstitions will finally be seen for what they are.

If I had had any faith that religion was anything other than rotten to the core, recent events would have convinced me otherwise.

Two of the three men I know personally who have been accused or convicted of sexual crimes were very involved in their churches.

Religious institutions are more concerned with protecting their own than caring for others. If I had my way they would all be banned. They do no good which could not equally be done in a wholly secular society.

AGAIN a woman bringing this issue to light despite the Bishop trying to deflect her.. Such courage..
Why don't they appoint a woman to Canterbury for goodness sake..

I don't believe Helen Anne Hartley, Bishop of Newcastle is the only bishop speaking out, but she gets a lot of media coverage, thank goodness. Here's an interview in November, the way her superior male colleagues treat her is very telling.
www.channel4.com/news/church-of-england-seems-incapable-of-transparency-and-accountability-says-bishop-of-newcastle

foxie48

The former Archbishop of Canterbury, Lord Carey, has resigned his permission to officiate
"It was also reported that Lord Carey – who was in post between 1991 and 2002 – agreed that Tudor could return to ministering in 1993.

The Telegraph can now reveal that Lord Carey contacted the Diocese of Oxford on Dec 4 to surrender his permission to officiate (PTO).

Tudor’s 1988 conviction for indecent assault was subsequently quashed on a technicality after the Court of Appeal found the judge had misdirected the jury."

There have been calls for Carey to resign for at least 7 years. I assume he will no longer be able to sit in the HoL. These men are a disgrace. Archbishop of York must be forced out next. Why are congregations not pressuring their leaders to go.

Helen Hartley is very brave going after these men.It does look like a boys club they do what they like for their own sexual gratification with children they come across through their work.
Keep at it Helen, you have mine and many others respect,fighting this canca from within.Well done.

The former Archbishop of Canterbury, Lord Carey, has resigned his permission to officiate
"It was also reported that Lord Carey – who was in post between 1991 and 2002 – agreed that Tudor could return to ministering in 1993.

The Telegraph can now reveal that Lord Carey contacted the Diocese of Oxford on Dec 4 to surrender his permission to officiate (PTO).

Tudor’s 1988 conviction for indecent assault was subsequently quashed on a technicality after the Court of Appeal found the judge had misdirected the jury."

Some 40 years ago I was considering applying for a job with the church dealing with safeguarding, or child protection as it was then. When I made enquiries about the role I was told that cases involving sexual abuse by clergy would not be referred to police or social services, but dealt with ‘in house’. I said that was unacceptable and withdrew my application.
Have they learned nothing?

It's enough cause for many of those who have faith in the concept of those in charge of the Church of England as God's mouthpiece to lose their faith or at least to have It severely shaken. It was a question of identifying right from wrong and dealing with the wrong swiftly and with integrity. . Child abuse is never right, and to ignore it for so long leaving the victims without support or help was most unchristian.

The only bishop to speak out and criticise what has been going on in the church is a woman. I heard her on the radio today , and not one male bishop has had the courage and decency to support her by doing the same.
Speaks volumes.

I find that all organised religion is corrupt and hypocritical. Gone are the days when you could talk to a priest or vicar and trust them. I'm not saying they are all bad, but they involved in bad organisations. Like all big organised businesses, the interests of themselves and their business is put before everybody else.

Thank you foxie48. I’m appalled that the technicality might have meant that there was no prosecution and even more that the church lifted his suspension.

Should be sacked and not a penny pension. These people are not putting the safety of young people before the name of The Church, shame on them.

foxie48

The following link is worth a read.
anglican.ink/2023/06/27/independent-safeguarding-board-abolished-members-sacked-for-asserting-independence-in-order-to-make-safeguarding-more-independent/

If I read that correctly, they abolished part of a safeguarding process mid last year.

(J52 iirc on the long thread on the Makin report very little and too late was ever reported).

As far as I can see there is no body currently in the C of E that can effectively call itself to account for this, and the drip drip of revelations is very destructive for those who do care about their church until this happens.

Agree with msg re Bishop of Newcastle, she seems to be a lone voice though. Seems to me that the clergy is rife with people who are arrogant abusers, why is this I wonder, maybe seen as an easy way to gain some power and respectability within a. community and thus allow them to abuse?

J52 you might find this useful as it gives a timeline of events. I think the problems started for the church when Tudor's conviction for abuse was overturned because of a technicality, so although he admitted having sexual relations with a 16 year old at the school where he was parish priest and Chaplain, he wasn't found "guilty" in the eyes of the law. He did serve a 6 month sentence though and was suspended by the church for 5 years.
www.boltburdonkemp.co.uk/our-insights/posts/church-of-england-vicar-accused-of-child-sexual-abuse-is-prohibited-from-ministry-for-life/

Can someone please explain why this abuse was not reported to the police at the time? Surely a Bishop’s opinion is not above the law.

The following link is worth a read.
anglican.ink/2023/06/27/independent-safeguarding-board-abolished-members-sacked-for-asserting-independence-in-order-to-make-safeguarding-more-independent/

No I don't expect they have! What else is hidden behind this aura of respectability? What I can't understand is why this person was reinstated in 1989 under supervision? At least now we don't have to listen to Archbishop Welby sactimonously lecturing us all about the virtues of the boat people and our lack of humanity concerning same. Hypocrisy doesn't even begin to describe him. John Sentamu must have been aware, as probably Rowan Williams.

The Bishop of Newcastle is a positive voice. She indicated when interviewed on radio 4 yesterday that her comments have not been well received by senior people in the Church

It’s safeguarding policies need urgent updating

Wyllow I've heard Cottrell and others explaining how their hands were tied etc and tbh I was so frustrated that I tried to find an explanation by looking directly at Ecclesiastic law and it was impenetrable for a lay person.
The people who commit abuse under the cover of the church are not Christians and do not represent Christian values. I don't think every male member of the clergy is useless or guilty of covering up abuse but there has been a problem in how some of those in positions of power and responsibility have dealt with safeguarding issues and it seems they have not been helped by outdated practices. I looked at the Complaints procedure 2023 and it looks as if procedures have changed for the better and hopefully practice has too. Sadly I think more instances will come to light and I wonder at what point the calls for resignations will stop. I thought Welby needed to resign and I don't think Cottrell is suitable to replace him in a temporary move either, the church needs someone completely untouched by anything related to these issues.

David Tudor is the vicar here.

She has been having a go at John Sentamu as well , apparently.

She's been an amazing voice for doing the right thing.

I suspect many ordinary church goers are really unhappy with current events but it would seem that there are not appropriate structures within the church to really take this on effectively. The structures are so archaic - they seem "grid-locked".

foxie you ask " aren't there any sanctions available?" I've been asking this for ages on these threads and it would appear that there simply are not, or no effective ones.