Sebastian Gorka joins the club

Barleyfields

Do you have evidence to support your allegation as to the reason why she has shown no remorse? Or is it just wishful thinking’?

Well in the one interview I saw ISIS men were standing behind her holding guns. I'm not sure many of us would have the guts to criticise them in those circumstances.

Maybe I'm just a coward.

M0nica

I beeive - and have always believed that Shamima Begum should be allowed to return home.

She was only 15 when she made the decision to go ti join ISIS and we see case after case in this country where girls of that age have been lured and misled into coercive re;lationships - as in all the concern about gangs of men offering inducements then coercing girls her age and younger into sexual activity.

Except that she was lured abroad, and is of Bangladeshi origin. how does her case, in principle differ from the girls in Richdale, Oxford etc etc. What she has done since is irrelevant. she was a gullible child who did what she was told to do, she has had three pregnancies which have gone full term and the baby later died.

I do not think we should bring her back and just let her run free. I think close supervision, debriefing and education will be needed, probably a period in custody. But the fact that a (male) home secretary has made this decision is no defence of it.

If this view is unpopular, and I am pretty sure it will be, I am untroubled. Justice is often not popular.

Hear hear. I came on to say the same. Shameful the difference in judgement of white teenagers and brown.

I have no way of knowing whether she is remorseful or not, and we will not know until she is back in the UK and been interrogated, but the dangers of retracting her views while still in the hands of the IS, either directly or because many other refugees were still IS supporters or operatives was reported in the news quite extensively at the time.

Do you have evidence to support your allegation as to the reason why she has shown no remorse? Or is it just wishful thinking’?

Barleyfields

I’m talking about the reality of what she did, that she is now an adult who has shown no remorse, and that those in possession of all the facts (which are available to none of us) have resisted calls for her to return. I hope they continue to do so.

She has shown no remorse because in the refugee camp in Syria where she now is, and even more so in othere refugee camps she was in, expressing remorse could well lead to her being killed for deserting the cause.

The only way we can know her involvement is by returning her to the UK where she can be interviewed by those who are trained both to defrief people like her but also have the skill to know whether that eprson is telling the truth or not.

Bangladesh denied her citizenship as well, did it not, even though she could claim it by descent until she was 21.

Babs03

I don’t appreciate another of Trumps entourage telling our government what to do. But that aside. Begum is a British citizen so should be tried and imprisoned in the UK. Also since regime change in Syria where the Kurds are guarding ISIS captives the whole situation could very quickly change with IS militants forcing the release of the captives.
So would we rather Begum goes free?

I agree with this.

She is our responsibility, and it is outrageous that a UK citizen can be denied citizenship.

I don't think Trump should be seen to be bullying us into anything though, which muddies the waters.

The chief of our Security services said a few months ago that security here is stretched to the limit. To bring potential terrorist back to this country would be difficult as Begum would have to be closely monitored if she doesn't go to prison.
If she is in prison they would have to keep her safe as she would be a target for some.
We need to look after our own innocent citizens who would be in danger if we allow Begum and others back into the country.
If Gorka and others feel strongly about this they could offer asylum to ISIS members in the US.

No she needs repatriating, and brought to trial in the U.K.

I don’t appreciate another of Trumps entourage telling our government what to do. But that aside. Begum is a British citizen so should be tried and imprisoned in the UK. Also since regime change in Syria where the Kurds are guarding ISIS captives the whole situation could very quickly change with IS militants forcing the release of the captives.
So would we rather Begum goes free?

Begum was not a child when she gave interviews in 2019 stating she did not regret her decision to join IS, was unmoved by the sight of the severed head of a beheaded man, and considered the bombing of the Manchester Arena to be just retaliation for the bombing of IS held areas.

To compare her with the girls involved in the Grooming rape gangs is disingenuous, to put it politely. Those girls have been harmed by their initial choices, and let down by the services which were on hand to protect them, but they are not a threat to national security. Begum is.

I’m talking about the reality of what she did, that she is now an adult who has shown no remorse, and that those in possession of all the facts (which are available to none of us) have resisted calls for her to return. I hope they continue to do so.

We are talking about her gullibility to grooming.

There are people in prison who have been convicted of committing murder at the age she was when she went off to join ISIS. I doubt anyone would try to argue that they cannot have been guilty because they lacked emotional maturity.

Barleyfields

A child who was old enough to know right from wrong, well educated, not an unwanted kid living in care looking for love.

And her emotional maturity?

Do people think Javid was lying? I certainly don’t. Do they think they know the whole truth of the matter? The reactions I see here are based on emotion, on maternal instincts rather than cold reality. Can nobody imagine the wave of support she would receive were she to be returned to the UK to face terrorism charges, and the consequences we would face were she convicted?

A child who was old enough to know right from wrong, well educated, not an unwanted kid living in care looking for love.

Fully agree Monica she is our responsibility and should’ve been returned and she is ours as is her family She has led a horrible life losing all her babies. I believe she’s in a camp of sorts she was totally brainwashed and that is a very real thing

She was a young kid whose head was turned she was totally brainwashed
Who hasn’t been a teen in love I didn’t go overseas or do anything bad but I do remember being so ‘in love’ at 15 that I climbed out of my window to go and meet this ‘older’ man

The bottom line is that she was child, with the emotional maturity of a child.

M0nica

Barleyfields she is not a terrorist. She was a 15 year old girl beguiled by the promise of being some romantic heroe's wife. A girl as silly as any other girlof that age with a pash for some local or well known ne-er-do-well.

She learnt fast how to keep herself alive, but she was never a terrorist.

I expect that, like me, you have seen her interviewed in recent years. She shows no remorse. Most ne’er do wells on whom a girl might develop a silly crush are not members of proscribed terrorist organisations who delight in medieval methods of execution. She married into and supported ISIS. She was an intelligent, educated girl. She became and in my eyes remains a terrorist, a threat to our security. Do you remember Savid Javid saying ‘If you knew what I know …’? There is much we (and that includes Farage and the Grump camp) don’t know about her, which led to the revocation of her British citizenship, a step not taken lightly. She is not ‘our own’ for us to deal with.

It is totally hypocritical, to argue about children being groomed and subsequently raped in the U.K., but at the same time denying the same consideration to the 3 children who were groomed, brainwashed by by ISIS, raped, lost children and denied their citizenship.

Galaxy

But he is right. She is our responsibility.

Yes, but watching Farage's u turns is pretty unedifying and I am sick and tired of being dictated to by the US.

Barleyfields she is not a terrorist. She was a 15 year old girl beguiled by the promise of being some romantic heroe's wife. A girl as silly as any other girlof that age with a pash for some local or well known ne-er-do-well.

She learnt fast how to keep herself alive, but she was never a terrorist.

I totally agree, M0nica

She is the U.K.’s responsibility.

We deport foreign criminals, we should have our criminals back here.